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Sergeants Miniatures Game: Day of Days» Forums » Rules

Subject: X-Buildings - Doors rss

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Doug Roderick
United States
Dayton
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Hello,

I've searched through the forums, but haven't found an answer to this question. If soldiers are in a building and have the door open to shoot out of it. Can an enemy soldier run in through the door to initiate Close Combat if they can fulfill the straight line rule?

The section of the rules causing this question is under the X-Building Movement section of the X-Terrain rules:

--Soldiers may not pass through an enemy soldier that is guarding the door. If an enemy Soldier outside is blocking a doorway, 2 Soldiers may move into Combat Contact to engage the enemy (see Combat Contact rules).--

Thanks
 
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John Di Ponio
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Lake Orion
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Hi Doug,

i have always played it that if they soldiers are in the building shooting out, you cannot assault(which adheres to the X-Building rules). I just attribute it to soldiers not being able to actually see whats inside the building, only knowing that gunfire is coming out of it.
 
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Greg
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Lowell
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I think one of the biggest issues with X-Terrain is that soldiers inside aren't required to be in any specific part of the building to shoot out of a window or door. All soldiers are considered to be able to shoot from anywhere from inside, though there are some restrictions of only 2 being able to shoot out of the same window on a turn.

While that may seem the elegant and simple way of handing this, it seems to create other issues.

With these rules, a player can have a soldier standing inside the doorway, blocking it, but being able to shoot from a far window. Even though that soldier is shooting from out of a specific window, "physically" the mini is blocking the opponent from getting inside to engage in combat contact.

It can also become "gamey" when it comes to explosive templates, because knowing that the opponent has a Panzerfaust, you might spread your soldiers around the inside of the building as far apart as possible to lessen soldiers falling under the template, yet they can still each shoot from any window or doorway.

The way I choose to handle it is to require soldiers to be placed where they are shooting from and only be able to shoot from those windows or door. That way if a player chooses to block entrance through the doorway to prevent the enemy from entering, then that soldier can only shoot out of that door way. Also, considering soldiers outside of the building are limited to their firing arc for shooting, I don't see why 1 soldier in a building should be able to shoot out of any different window at any time to be able to cover approach from the enemy.
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John Di Ponio
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Sorry Greg, I should have explained that the man in the building was in the doorway or shooting out of the doorway only. I kind of typed the aswer a bit fast. Your way you handle it is the exact way I deal with it. It makes perfect sense and I think adds to the tactics of the game.
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Todd
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I understand wanting to put soldiers within X-terrain where they are defending/shooting, but that leads to the random pulls from explosives being a sticky issue. How can a grenade, thrown in a window on one side of the building, hurt someone on the opposite side. Could it really roll that far given whatever is on the floor, etc. Or the PF hit one area and wound someone in a completely different location. You see my point.

As far as the Panzerfaust, we play that the PF would cause an explosion within the building and then would follow the explosive rules that call for ID checks.

We'd also say that if someone was able to charge through the door to get into the building, then that soldier would have to physically fit within the building to get inside. After that, hand-to-hand could be initiated with both side being able to arrange their soldiers, inside soldiers first.

It may not be perfect, but if some knucklehead wants to Rambo it up, they could do it. We've both thought about it at least once during our games with X-terrain.
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George Anderson
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Here is how that was played at Historicon Tournament this year:

Soldiers inside the building could not block other soldiers from entering the building.

Soldiers outside the building standing such that their bases blocked the door could prevent other soldiers from entering.

The idea is, as someone mentioned earlier - position inside of a building doesn't matter. Anyone outside of a building is treated as per the normal rules, so a soldier trying to get into a door would be blocked if they would enter into base to base contact with the blocking soldier first.

George
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George Anderson
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An earlier post also mentioned templates and positions.

I believe we did not use templates INSIDE OF an x-terrain building during the Historicon Tourney. So, a blast affected everyone (grenades only affect up to 4) on the same level. Use ID checks to determine who is affected if more than four in a building level when a grenade goes off.

George
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Greg
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Well not using blast templates inside x-terrain would solve some of the issues I had with random placement. Not sure why that wasn't in the rules that way.
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Mayor Jim
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Fort Wright
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Hahma wrote:
Well not using blast templates inside x-terrain would solve some of the issues I had with random placement. Not sure why that wasn't in the rules that way.
Because it's X-terrain shake Seriously, no templates inside a building seems to make a lot of sense...same for the crazy "blocking" the doorway.

Here's a new one though...I'm "charging" through a doorway to enter into CC with a unit inside. My movement only allows me to get one inch into the building. The enemy unit I'm charging is a bit further away than me...does this mean that I can't CC the unit since I'm not in base to base contact? Since units in a building occupy any space on their floor, would I have to charge through a door and have enough movement available to reach the farthest corner?
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Greg
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MayorJim wrote:
Hahma wrote:
Well not using blast templates inside x-terrain would solve some of the issues I had with random placement. Not sure why that wasn't in the rules that way.
Because it's X-terrain shake Seriously, no templates inside a building seems to make a lot of sense...same for the crazy "blocking" the doorway.

Here's a new one though...I'm "charging" through a doorway to enter into CC with a unit inside. My movement only allows me to get one inch into the building. The enemy unit I'm charging is a bit further away than me...does this mean that I can't CC the unit since I'm not in base to base contact? Since units in a building occupy any space on their floor, would I have to charge through a door and have enough movement available to reach the farthest corner?


Yeah Jim, kind of another wonkiness to it as your example shows. I suppose one way of doing it is for the opponent to do an identity check to see which one of his guys is going to be "it" and then place that soldier in base to base contact with your soldier. If all the soldiers occupy the same space so to speak for all other purposes, then by golly, you could be able to charge in there and go CC with one of them. Though if you can toss a grenade through the door first with a grenade toss bubble action/move or with a shoot and move capability, that would be better
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