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Subject: Omnitron help? rss

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Scott Yavorski
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Looked through the newest few pages and didn't see anything (other than something to make Omnitron more difficult?!) about this. We've played him twice now, technically once since the first time we were told the rules wrong. The first time, when we weren't playing the card for his turn (we were just doing the flip ability, oops) we got him down to single digits and still lost. Tonight we played him again with Guise, Ra and Mister Fixer and we got WORKED. He still had 80-something hp left when our final guy went down. The 15hp, my hp is your damage, thing, came out 3 times, once as the first card before anyone had any damage ready, so we all took 11 out of the gate (on turn 2, but still).

Either way, playing him right or wrong, I don't understand how to keep up the damage output to keep up with his drones and devices / components and still do enough damage to him to keep his drones from healing... he stayed in the high 90's forever because he would just get a heal drone or two out as soon as we could hit him.

Thoughts?
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Brian Rayburn
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One useful trick against Omni is Visionary's Wrest the Mind. Use it on the EPE (the 15 pt damage card).

Use Wraith's Infrared Eyepiece, two if you can get them and a Utility Belt out.

Legacy makes everyone better.

Stay away from Guise. He's cute, but not a 'real' deck, he's there mostly just for laughs in one-off games.

Been a while since I've busted this game out, so if I think of anything else, I'll be back.
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Bern Harkins
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Omnitron is one of the "swingier" villains. He can be a cream puff sometimes, and rip apart a prime team next game.

Getting the Electro Pulse Explosive on turn one is bad luck. It's possible to recover from it, but its going to make a game much harder to win.

With Omnitron, like many (but not all) other villains, the trick is to develop your heroes, prune Omnitron's cards in play back, and then smack him. It's not unusual for him to have eighty or more hp late in a game, and for the heroes to still win. It takes time and experience to know just how to prioritize your actions, when to switch from controlling the tableau to villain punching.

Also, Guise and Mr. Fixer are both fun decks, and powerful under the right circumstances, but they are two of the harder decks to play. Fixer in particular takes practice.

So my advice is rub some dirt on your boo-boos and get back on the field. There is more to this game than it seems at first, and not all of it can be easily explained (so many variables)... but once you've seen more situations play out, you will develop a better notion of what to do, and when.
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Scott Yavorski
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Thanks, yeah, I've played a lot and really enjoy it (it's my favorite game by far right now), I hadn't played Fixer before and the Guise player was brand new but we had just won against Baron, so I thought we'd have a harder time but still be able to win against the other tier 1 villain. He just seems poorly labeled or we just got really really bad luck. The shuffling-things-you-just-killed thing is so evil!

Oh well, we'll get 'em next time!
 
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Jason Farris
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1. Try 4 heroes
2. Consider heroes with native damage so getting all you ongoings or equipment nuked will not end you. I really like Unity for this reason as her bots are neither ongoing, nor equipment
3. Use heroes with "you can't damage me" cards. Mr. fixer has grease gun, Haka has ground pound, Legacy has heroic interception, etc.

All of these will make Omnitron easier to defeat. Once you get a few wins under you belt, then you can swap in more diverse heroes.
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Bern Harkins
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Omni really is tier one... he's not that hard to beat if the team retains focus, and keeps extra copies of critical cards in hand, in case he destroys them.

However, he has some really nasty tricks, and with luck on his side he can smear any group of heroes.

I think my group is pretty proficient. We've beaten every villain except Progeny, and we've only played him once. We usually pound Omnitron... but the last time we played him, we lost.

Tier one, yes... but he's still dangerous.

Who would want it any other way?
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Gamer D

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Omnitron really just has a couple of tricks up his sleeve that you have to watch for, namely blowing up all your equipment and hitting you for full damage with a luckily timed Electro Pulse Explosive. Basically I think if you keep those particular things in mind as you play and are prepared for them then you have a decent chance of winning. He also can wipe out all ongoing cards as well, although that particular card isn't as potentially damaging as the other two I mentioned.

Beyond that though he's pretty straightforward. His components die when you deal damage to Omnitron, so a lot of the time you can ignore the components and just hit Omnitron in the face. And his drones are somewhat distracting but don't typically hit that hard and die easily. So I agree with the people above who said he is one of the easier opponents once you know what to expect when you fight him.
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Jason Farris
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dugman wrote:
Omnitron really just has a couple of tricks up his sleeve that you have to watch for, namely blowing up all your equipment and hitting you for full damage with a luckily timed Electro Pulse Explosive. Basically I think if you keep those particular things in mind as you play and are prepared for them then you have a decent chance of winning. He also can wipe out all ongoing cards as well, although that particular card isn't as potentially damaging as the other two I mentioned.

Beyond that though he's pretty straightforward. His components die when you deal damage to Omnitron, so a lot of the time you can ignore the components and just hit Omnitron in the face. And his drones are somewhat distracting but don't typically hit that hard and die easily. So I agree with the people above who said he is one of the easier opponents once you know what to expect when you fight him.

Interesting,

I dread Sedative flechettes (5 damage per player then nuke all ongoing cards) far more than the singularity card (nuke all equipment and then deal damage to each player based on how many of their equipment cards git nuke). 5 damage to everyone seriously blows chunks.
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Roberta Yang
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Almost all of Omnitron's power is concentrated in 25% of his deck. His Electro-Pulse Explosives, ongoing nuke, and equipment nuke are scary. If they come out often enough and at inopportune moments, you will have trouble. If they don't, you will have an easy game.
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Scott Yavorski
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salty53 wrote:
Almost all of Omnitron's power is concentrated in 25% of his deck. His Electro-Pulse Explosives, ongoing nuke, and equipment nuke are scary. If they come out often enough and at inopportune moments, you will have trouble. If they don't, you will have an easy game.

Yeah, it sounds like we got a bad deal. We got EPE's 3 times, the third came out before we could completely deal with the 2nd and that's what killed us. The ongoing nuke twice, the equipment nuke 2 or 3 times.

Thanks for the tips guys. Can't wait to try him again (well, just to play again really; love this game)!
 
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Bill Stull
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scarecrowking wrote:
Stay away from Guise. He's cute, but not a 'real' deck, he's there mostly just for laughs in one-off games.
Guise is just as effective as any other hero. I would consider him similar to Absolute Zero in that he needs some build up to pull off his more powerful combos. Unlike Absolute Zero his buildup comes from having a lot of cards in hand rather then needing a lot of cards in play.

On to the original topic. A setup where EPE is the first card in play is a rough one no matter what hero team you have since you have no way to lessen the damage from that. Having all three show up in one game is nasty. Omnitron can be pretty rough with just a three hero team because of what he regularly gets out. With a three hero team you had I would hope to get Dual Crowbars or Jack Handle with Mr. Fixer to hit multiple targets regularly which I would try to combine with Grease Monkey Fist. For Ra I might suggest saving Fire Blasts for EPE or Omnnitron and after getting Staff of Ra out play Scroched Earth or Inferno to help less the blow from drones. With Guise I would save Retcon for Adaptive Plating Subroutine or a component you think you might not be able to deal enough damage to get rid. If Omnitron plays Interpolation Beam and Guise has Gritty Reboot you quickly fill up Guise's hand until you don't feel comfortable taking any more damage. If you can do that Guise should be set up to do a massive combo the next round. if EPE is the only target out Guise can redirect damage to the EPE with Total Beefcake. I would lastly suggest that a unless you have multiple copies in hand you save Look What I Found from Guise and Charge or Overdrive from Mr Fixer for that EPE or dealing the finals blows on Omnitron.
A few notes about battling Omnitron. On the first round if only drone is played dont destroy it but leave it low on health for the next round. Similar applies if he plays two drones and you can't take both out as you'll just get that one drone back at full health. Second, the one drone only deals damage bass on it's health and sometimes it is not worth it to take it but to leave it at one HP. Lastly, don't forget about Terraforming when you pick an environment as playing ones that keep a lot of cards in play could make that devastating.
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Dennison Milenkaya
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Playing Tachyon against Omnitron = easy mode enabled.
 
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Jason Farris
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FlatOnHisFace wrote:
Playing Tachyon against Omnitron = easy mode enabled.

Tachyon is particularly vulnerable to adaptive plating due to having most of her damage being melee.

Beyond that I don't see her being anymore effective than any other hero.
 
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Dennison Milenkaya
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You haven't seen her sonic damage, how frequently she can stop many Devices from dealing damage, or what a simple Synaptic Interruption can do to an Electo-Pulse Explosive?
 
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Bill Stull
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Almost forgot but if a turn looks really bad for incoming damage Mr. Fixer can always lay down a Grease Gun if you have one. If you want to keep it out for a second round if Guise goes before Mr. Fixer you can have Guise take it with Lemme See That...
 
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Jason Farris
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FlatOnHisFace wrote:
You haven't seen her sonic damage, how frequently she can stop many Devices from dealing damage, or what a simple Synaptic Interruption can do to an Electo-Pulse Explosive?


As a matter of fact I have. And I already gave several other examples of heroes that can stop damage for a round, none of which require damage to be dealt to trigger the effect. Synaptic interruption is nice as it effectively destroys the explosive. So, while I like Tachyon (especially super scientific Tachyon), she is no more effective than most of the cool heroes. Unless you are using one of her variant cards.

She has exactly two types of cards that deal straight sonic damage in the deck (and a third that can deal sonic damage if Tachyon was damaged by the target this round). She has four types of cards that deal melee damage.

So 5 cards in her entire deck that consistently deal sonic damage (1 in 8 cards drawn in average), and 12 cards that always deal melee damage (1 in every 3 1/3 draws). Long story short, you are going to run across melee cards much more and thus adaptive plating can be a pain.

So there you go.
 
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Gamer D

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Smilinbrax wrote:
FlatOnHisFace wrote:
You haven't seen her sonic damage, how frequently she can stop many Devices from dealing damage, or what a simple Synaptic Interruption can do to an Electo-Pulse Explosive?


As a matter of fact I have. And I already gave several other examples of heroes that can stop damage for a round, none of which require damage to be dealt to trigger the effect. Synaptic interruption is nice as it effectively destroys the explosive. So, while I like Tachyon (especially super scientific Tachyon), she is no more effective than most of the cool heroes. Unless you are using one of her variant cards.

She has exactly two types of cards that deal straight sonic damage in the deck (and a third that can deal sonic damage if Tachyon was damaged by the target this round). She has four types of cards that deal melee damage.

So 5 cards in her entire deck that consistently deal sonic damage (1 in 8 cards drawn in average), and 12 cards that always deal melee damage (1 in every 3 1/3 draws). Long story short, you are going to run across melee cards much more and thus adaptive plating can be a pain.

So there you go.

She also has Blinding Speed that can destroy the ongoing Adaptive Plating and has enhanced card draw to give her a higher probability of having her Blinding Speed in hand when Adaptive Plating hits the table. And since all the rest of Omnitron's Ongoing cards are components that die due to damage it's usually worth saving the cards that specifically destroy Ongoing cards for the Adaptive Plating (ie as Tachyon I wouldn't bother using Blinding Speed on a component, I would just punch Omnitron in the face instead.)

I'm not saying she's good or bad against Omnitron compared to other heroes, I'm just saying I never found Adaptive Plating to be much of an issue.
 
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Jason Farris
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dugman wrote:
Smilinbrax wrote:
FlatOnHisFace wrote:
You haven't seen her sonic damage, how frequently she can stop many Devices from dealing damage, or what a simple Synaptic Interruption can do to an Electo-Pulse Explosive?


As a matter of fact I have. And I already gave several other examples of heroes that can stop damage for a round, none of which require damage to be dealt to trigger the effect. Synaptic interruption is nice as it effectively destroys the explosive. So, while I like Tachyon (especially super scientific Tachyon), she is no more effective than most of the cool heroes. Unless you are using one of her variant cards.

She has exactly two types of cards that deal straight sonic damage in the deck (and a third that can deal sonic damage if Tachyon was damaged by the target this round). She has four types of cards that deal melee damage.

So 5 cards in her entire deck that consistently deal sonic damage (1 in 8 cards drawn in average), and 12 cards that always deal melee damage (1 in every 3 1/3 draws). Long story short, you are going to run across melee cards much more and thus adaptive plating can be a pain.

So there you go.

She also has Blinding Speed that can destroy the ongoing Adaptive Plating and has enhanced card draw to give her a higher probability of having her Blinding Speed in hand when Adaptive Plating hits the table. And since all the rest of Omnitron's Ongoing cards are components that die due to damage it's usually worth saving the cards that specifically destroy Ongoing cards for the Adaptive Plating (ie as Tachyon I wouldn't bother using Blinding Speed on a component, I would just punch Omnitron in the face instead.)

I'm not saying she's good or bad against Omnitron compared to other heroes, I'm just saying I never found Adaptive Plating to be much of an issue.


I was objecting to the comment that Tachyon equals easy mode with omnitron. That title, in my opinion, can only go to to visionary. Of course I think visionary is easy mode for most villains.

I think Tachyon is a solid hero, and an absolute beast in her super scientific and team leader incarnations.

And never confuse card draw with getting the cards you need. I have had so many instances where tachyon can dig and dig for the right card and come up empty. It's all probability after all. Only 3 cards in her deck allow her to nuke an ongoing. I usually run 2-3 heroes that have ongoing/environment nuke cards just to make sure you have one when you need it and even then...
 
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Gamer D

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Smilinbrax wrote:
dugman wrote:
Smilinbrax wrote:
FlatOnHisFace wrote:
You haven't seen her sonic damage, how frequently she can stop many Devices from dealing damage, or what a simple Synaptic Interruption can do to an Electo-Pulse Explosive?


As a matter of fact I have. And I already gave several other examples of heroes that can stop damage for a round, none of which require damage to be dealt to trigger the effect. Synaptic interruption is nice as it effectively destroys the explosive. So, while I like Tachyon (especially super scientific Tachyon), she is no more effective than most of the cool heroes. Unless you are using one of her variant cards.

She has exactly two types of cards that deal straight sonic damage in the deck (and a third that can deal sonic damage if Tachyon was damaged by the target this round). She has four types of cards that deal melee damage.

So 5 cards in her entire deck that consistently deal sonic damage (1 in 8 cards drawn in average), and 12 cards that always deal melee damage (1 in every 3 1/3 draws). Long story short, you are going to run across melee cards much more and thus adaptive plating can be a pain.

So there you go.

She also has Blinding Speed that can destroy the ongoing Adaptive Plating and has enhanced card draw to give her a higher probability of having her Blinding Speed in hand when Adaptive Plating hits the table. And since all the rest of Omnitron's Ongoing cards are components that die due to damage it's usually worth saving the cards that specifically destroy Ongoing cards for the Adaptive Plating (ie as Tachyon I wouldn't bother using Blinding Speed on a component, I would just punch Omnitron in the face instead.)

I'm not saying she's good or bad against Omnitron compared to other heroes, I'm just saying I never found Adaptive Plating to be much of an issue.


I was objecting to the comment that Tachyon equals easy mode with omnitron. That title, in my opinion, can only go to to visionary. Of course I think visionary is easy mode for most villains.

I think Tachyon is a solid hero, and an absolute beast in her super scientific and team leader incarnations.

And never confuse card draw with getting the cards you need. I have had so many instances where tachyon can dig and dig for the right card and come up empty. It's all probability after all. Only 3 cards in her deck allow her to nuke an ongoing. I usually run 2-3 heroes that have ongoing/environment nuke cards just to make sure you have one when you need it and even then...

Noone said extra card draw is perfect, but it does significantly increase the probability of getting the card you want.

And my point was that you were overestimating how often Adaptive Plating hurts Tachyon, it usually doesn't matter much or at all with her. I honestly can't remember a single game off hand with or without Tachyon where the Adaptive Plating seemed to make a difference (Worst case I've seen it keeps Haku from hitting sometimes since he uses both melee attack cards and melee attack powers, same with Ra and fire attacks, etc, but otherwise that's about all I can think of), whereas the big threat cards like the Explosive lightning attack and the equipment destruction have at times been backbreaking.
 
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Jason Farris
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In the core set, Legacy, Haka, and Tachyon all primarily deal melee damage. Fanatic also primsrily deals melee but her core power deals melee+radiant damage and her sword can deal fire, radiant, or melee (if she gets it out) so she is a special case. Wraith is primarily projectile, as is Bunker. Zero is cold and fire, Ra is mostly fire, and visionary is mostly psychic. Tempest doesn't give a royal rats rear about adaptive plating as he can deal pretty much any damage type, although he is primarily projectile and lightning.

If you play a random set up against Omnitron and/or don't cherry pick pick order, then it can be a pain. I will grant you that it is not as much of a problem with the larger pool of heroes now as long as you have all the expansions.


 
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Dennison Milenkaya
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Smilinbrax wrote:
In the core set, Legacy, Haka, and Tachyon all primarily deal melee damage.
You really are over-stating the Subroutine's worth. The reason it hurts Legacy and Haka so much is they haven't other damage type options (except Savage Mana, which is usually best used as trash control) and no way to get rid of it. Tachyon has both multiple damage types and easy Ongoing destruction. She also tends to see every card in her deck once-per-game, so she isn't on par with someone like Legacy who actually needs a bit of luck to draw what he wants.

Omnitron has no forced discards from hand nor top-of-deck. He can't make Tachyon miss a Blinding Speed, Hypersonic Assualt, or Lightspeed Barrage. Tachyon can gaurentee 66 damage to finish off the massive robot when she's ready to end the game. With HUD Goggles, Pushing The Limits (just leave it in play), and a couple Lightning Reflexes, she can do it all in one turn, despite the Adaptive Plating. I've seen it; I've done it. It isn't hard.

Even if you can't do it all at once, there's little to stop you from playing just one Barrage per round, letting another hero reset the Subroutine. Knowing that damage is going through is worth it.

Dugman already explained that three Blinding Speeds to take out two Subroutines is enough. I might pitch one just for a Burst in the trash, depending on the harshness of the environment and contributions of teammates. The Subroutines just aren't problematic enough to play subpar in order to compensate around.

I'll also add that I only play Quick Recon Tachyon. Her alternate characters are stupidly over-powered for a deck that didn't need it -- to the point they remove all challenge. For the likes of a tier 1 villain, they wouldn't even make playing an enjoyable experience.

Tachyon vs. Omnitron = easy mode
Alternate Tachyon vs. Omnitron = boring
 
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I don't agree with Tachyon being easy mode against Omnitron but I would agree she has a lot of good counters to things Omnitron will play. Tachyon loses some effectiveness when facing Omnitron on advanced without any damage buffs.
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Jason Farris
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FlatOnHisFace wrote:
Smilinbrax wrote:
In the core set, Legacy, Haka, and Tachyon all primarily deal melee damage.
You really are over-stating the Subroutine's worth. The reason it hurts Legacy and Haka so much is they haven't other damage type options (except Savage Mana, which is usually best used as trash control) and no way to get rid of it. Tachyon has both multiple damage types and easy Ongoing destruction. She also tends to see every card in her deck once-per-game, so she isn't on par with someone like Legacy who actually needs a bit of luck to draw what he wants.

Omnitron has no forced discards from hand nor top-of-deck. He can't make Tachyon miss a Blinding Speed, Hypersonic Assualt, or Lightspeed Barrage. Tachyon can gaurentee 66 damage to finish off the massive robot when she's ready to end the game. With HUD Goggles, Pushing The Limits (just leave it in play), and a couple Lightning Reflexes, she can do it all in one turn, despite the Adaptive Plating. I've seen it; I've done it. It isn't hard.

Even if you can't do it all at once, there's little to stop you from playing just one Barrage per round, letting another hero reset the Subroutine. Knowing that damage is going through is worth it.

Dugman already explained that three Blinding Speeds to take out two Subroutines is enough. I might pitch one just for a Burst in the trash, depending on the harshness of the environment and contributions of teammates. The Subroutines just aren't problematic enough to play subpar in order to compensate around.

I'll also add that I only play Quick Recon Tachyon. Her alternate characters are stupidly over-powered for a deck that didn't need it -- to the point they remove all challenge. For the likes of a tier 1 villain, they wouldn't even make playing an enjoyable experience.

Tachyon vs. Omnitron = easy mode
Alternate Tachyon vs. Omnitron = boring

And I've already explained how tachyon only deals 2 types of damage and most of it is melee.

I argue that relying on Tachyon to save you against Omnitron is subpar. You are certain that she is awesome and are convinced that she will plow through her deck in every game and you make a lot of assumptions based on this. As has already been mentioned, Omnitron will beat the hell out of you early game when it is on, and any combination of heroes can beat it when it is off. If Tachyon has time to draw her whole deck, then the heroes already have it sewn up before she got there.

You also seriously overestimate Tachyon's card draw ability. Many of her cards are subpar (being very limited in use or weak), She does not consistently pull Miracle combos on turns 1-3, her card that stops damage dealing must be able to deal damage first, and she easily runs out of viable cards and gets stuck with poor draws. l

You also treat Omnitron as if it is alone and Tachyon will only be using those three ongoing killers on adaptive subroutine instead of getting rid of environment cards.

It's really easy to say "Card Draw, Tachyon wins," but that is most definitely not the case. It's far more nuanced than that.
 
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