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Talisman (Revised 4th Edition)» Forums » General

Subject: Lots of expansions - Good or Bad for Talisman? rss

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Ray
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Hello fellow Talisman gamers. Talisman 4th has lots of expansions now. I mean, just take a look at these:

The Blood Moon Expansion
The City Expansion
The Deep Realms Expansion
The Dragon Expansion
The Dungeon Expansion
The Firelands Expansion
The Frostmarch Expansion
The Harbinger Expansion
The Highland Expansion
The Nether Realm Expansion
The Reaper Expansion
The Sacred Pool Expansion
The Woodland Expansion


Certainly, the more expansions you use the more diluted the core game gets, but has all these expansions made the game better or worse?

Yes, you can pick a choose expansions if you wish, and everyone has their favorite expansion, but if you put it all together into one game massive game, would it be a good game or bad game?

Poll
Choose best response:
I think Talisman didn't really need expansions.
I think there are too many expansions for Talisman.
I think there needs to be more expansions for Talisman.
I am indifferent to the number of expansions for Talisman.
      91 answers
Poll created by RayGuns



Now for something different...
Poll
Of all the expansions, what is your one (1) favorite expansion?
The Blood Moon Expansion
The City Expansion
The Deep Realms Expansion
The Dragon Expansion
The Dungeon Expansion
The Firelands Expansion
The Frostmarch Expansion
The Harbinger Expansion
The Highland Expansion
The Nether Realm Expansion
The Reaper Expansion
The Sacred Pool Expansion
The Woodland Expansion
      93 answers
Poll created by RayGuns



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Ron
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For me, Talisman (Revised 4th Edition) goes down the same way as Arkham Horror - too many expansions, not enough space on the game table and nearly impossible to explain to newbies. That game is now a Pandora's Box!

I'm not willing to separate all the expansions before or after I play, therefore I own all the stuff, but I don't play it; it just sits on the shelf.

I totally like how they solved this issue in Arkham Horror's successor, Eldritch Horror - I hope for a similar way in Talisman (Revised 4th Edition)'s sister game, Relic!
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POUM
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I have every expansion except The Harbinger Expansion (doesn't seem that interesting). We play with everything except The Firelands Expansion and The Dragon Expansion (they seem to mess up game play and ain't that fun).

If we run out of pace, we skip The Highland Expansion (even do it's good we can live without it).

Then again with everything else, a 4 player session took 8,5 hours last weekend. meeple That's not a problem for us.
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Simon Wiese
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Talisman base game definitely needed expansions. In Germany, the old 2nd edition base game already included the first expansion without stating it anywhere, so we always thought those cards belonged to the base game back then. When I got my 4th edition game, I wondered why they took so many characters out (14 characters less than I used to play with!) and also why there where many Adventure cards missing. Then I learned, that those where never part of the original English game. So I was definitely looking forward to the Reaper and Frostmarch, which re-introduced many of those cards. Also, I consider the Dungeon a crucial expansion and I prefer the 4th ed. dungeon over the 2nd edition dungeon.
That being said, I am not sure about the necessity of the other expansions, although we play with all of them most of the time. Some of them brought very interesting options (like the City) and Adventure cards (especially Bloodmoon and Firelands) but I am a bit unsure about all the fiddly mechanics that were introduced over the course of the expansions (Werewolf NPC, Reaper NPC, Lycantrophe, Day/Night, Harbinger, Dragon, Dark/light fate, Fireland-tokens...)

That's why I rated for the Reaper Expansion (although I don't really care for the Reaper NPC) - those additional Adventure cards just always belonged to my Talisman experience, since I started with 2nd edition. Without them, 4th edition felt "naked", as if something was missing.
 
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Wolfgang Kunz
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IMHO Talisman needs Expansions - but I assume that harbinger was the last one.
We usually play Talisman with all of the expansions except Dragons (which we sometimes add) and Harbinger (which we haven't tried yet) and the Netherworld one.

Talisman lives from / thru the expansions because it keeps the experience fresh and no game is like the one before.

Same goes - as a sidenote - for Arkham Horror which is a blast with all of the expansions included. Yes, it is huge but the immersion in the game and the mythology is amazing (we might see the same with Eldritch Horror which grows expansionwise...).

Talsiman is much simpler and therefore needs the expansions. I have the room / the table for it and look forward to these cold autum / winter days, when I go down with my son in our gaming room and fight whatever the game throws at us.
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DomaGB
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You didn't offer enough options in the 1st poll:

I think Talisman didn't really need expansions.
I think there are too many expansions for Talisman.
I think there needs to be more expansions for Talisman.
I am indifferent to the number of expansions for Talisman.


I disagree with all those choices. I don't need more, but accept the current number of expansions. You cannot say I am indifferent because there needs to be some.

I dislike the Dragon expansion, and put up a poll myself in how many people like it. But found I liked it with variants/house rules, but when Harbinger came out, I now like Dragons because you can avoid the judgment of the Harbinger by pulling Dragon cards through tokens!

Also the Harbinger shines with the maximum board expansions because you can avoid the Harbinger in the different boards.

I like Talisman, and will take anything they give me, in reality I would only want Timescape for 4th edition to be made next, but beyond that they can end the expansions or make more.
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Paolo Tosolini
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The problems of using all of the expansions at once have already been described in the first post:

1) They require space
2) The game is difficult to present to newbies or casual players

Space problem is an issue for all games where expansions are not "scenarios" but "add-ons". Talisman is nothing new. I just bought a very big table for my new house, and I did it with an eye to board games.

If the mechanics of each expansion are introduced slowly, game after game, they are quite easy to understand. You never rack your brain when playing Talisman. However, throwing everything in the face of somebody who has never played this game, or last played it when Dungeon came out, it's just wrong towards them. You know I did it a couple of times, and games turned out horrible. You don't need all of the expansions to have a fresh and funny game, but they make up for incredible variety for your experienced fellow players.

Still surprised that the most voted expansion is the Reaper... it's a very basic expansion with just some more basic cards. I cannot see how it could be somebody's favourite after 6 years of 4th edition, but the poll speaks for the people. The problem is... almost everybody that has bought Talisman bought also the Reaper and probably the Dungeon, while long-term fans have bought all the other expansions and their votes are scattered among a lot of options.
 
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Brant Benoit
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For expanding the base game, Reaper has been the best since release.
The reason being is because it adds just enough for more variety, but not so many rules anyone new isn't going to find it any more difficult than the base game.

I find it adds the most for the least amount of money without making things fiddly, or longer. This is probably why so many folks voted it as the best expansion.
 
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chris thatcher
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I only have the Reaper and Sacred Pool expansions and I think that's enough variety for how much I get it to the table.

Ive never agreed with this "dilution" thang people bring up regarding adventure type games.

I have all of Arkham and it plays great using all the expansions. Talisman is not exactly a hard system to learn, it will work fine with everything but may play a little long.

Just determine for yourself what you "need".
 
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Grarrrg Grarrrgowski
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pevsfreedom wrote:
In researching my first expansion I noticed overwhelmingly everyone said get the REAPER and then get the DUNGEON. Very funny how after I make my choices I find this thread and see this poll, backing up what I found!



So people say to get Reaper/Dungeon, and you're surprised that those same people like Reaper/Dungeon??
 
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Rauli Kettunen
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The_Warlock wrote:
Still surprised that the most voted expansion is the Reaper... it's a very basic expansion with just some more basic cards. I cannot see how it could be somebody's favourite after 6 years of 4th edition, but the poll speaks for the people. The problem is... almost everybody that has bought Talisman bought also the Reaper and probably the Dungeon, while long-term fans have bought all the other expansions and their votes are scattered among a lot of options.


I mentioned this regarding Marvel Legendary, but I like it if the first expansion is "more of the same", buffing up the decks without adding too many new things to keep track of. For Talisman, Reaper does just that and to a T. Plus, it gives us the Reaper figure itself, while it might range from uncommon to rare or very rare, the threat of instadeath is ever-present (apart from the Inner Region). Looking back at Reaper, one thing it didn't quite bring to the table were variant endings.
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Ray
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Dam the Man wrote:
Looking back at Reaper, one thing it didn't quite bring to the table were variant endings.


For me, I think variant endings are overrated. Most of them seem to make the game last longer. Some Talismaners might like that, but there are enough expansions out there that do that plenty good.
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Rauli Kettunen
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RayGuns wrote:
Dam the Man wrote:
Looking back at Reaper, one thing it didn't quite bring to the table were variant endings.


For me, I think variant endings are overrated. Most of them seem to make the game last longer. Some Talismaners might like that, but there are enough expansions out there that do that plenty good.


I haven't found them to add much, if any, to playing time. Plus, having them means at least the Alchemist is beatable, unlike vanilla CoC . Of course, for me, Talisman was't really Talisman until we got the Horrible Black Void in Blood Moon devil .
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Ray
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Dam the Man wrote:
RayGuns wrote:
Dam the Man wrote:
Looking back at Reaper, one thing it didn't quite bring to the table were variant endings.


For me, I think variant endings are overrated. Most of them seem to make the game last longer. Some Talismaners might like that, but there are enough expansions out there that do that plenty good.


I haven't found them to add much, if any, to playing time. Plus, having them means at least the Alchemist is beatable, unlike vanilla CoC . Of course, for me, Talisman was't really Talisman until we got the Horrible Black Void in Blood Moon devil .


I lost count how many times I got sucked into the Horrible Black Void. I draw that thing like a magnet!

A few times we have played Talisman without CoC or alternate endings. The first play to reach the space wins... simple as that: fast and easy with no fussing about.
 
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Chris Turner
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We played yesterday and there was a discussion of what to leave out. We have everything except Harbringer and Dragons and it's an absolute monster of a game even without those.

I'm cool with expansions, bring them on, but actually playing with all of them at the same time is a big question. Especially I'm not sure about the board expansions at this point now that there are all four. I really like the Dungeon and Highlands, but players are really not near each other to interact any more except via spells.

What do you guys leave out? We usually drop Day/Night and the Werewolf (or play with either Death or the Werewolf, but not both) otherwise it's everything else.
 
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Jonathan A
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Wow, I'm not the only one who voted for The Woodlands.

ninja
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Simon Wiese
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littlemute wrote:
What do you guys leave out? We usually drop Day/Night and the Werewolf (or play with either Death or the Werewolf, but not both) otherwise it's everything else.


In our normal games, we typically leave out the Werewolf and the Lycantrophe Cards and sometimes the Deep Realms (because of space issues). That also means that I have sorted out all cards that depend on the Lycantrophe/Werewolf mechanic. I have still left those cards in that mention it, but do not necesserely need it (like for example the Peasent Mob - you can still use it as a "space cleaner"). We actually use the day/Night card, but don't apply the +1/-1 Bonus (so we use it just for card effects that need the Day/Night mechanic). Also, we don't use the Dragonlords or the Alternative endings and typically play with Standard CoC ending. As for the Dragon expansion: Because I did not like howcertain expansion mechanics get triggered with the roll of a 1 (Reaper, Werewolf), the drawing of Event cards (Harbinger, Time card) or even fiddlier things (Dragons), we use this die here, which we roll along with any movement die:
https://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic2297687_md.jpg
(This is an older pic, I've also added the Harbinger symbol now)
This way, we can very easily keep track of the expansion effects.
 
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C F
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PzVIE wrote:
For me, Talisman (Revised 4th Edition) goes down the same way as Arkham Horror - too many expansions, not enough space on the game table and nearly impossible to explain to newbies. That game is now a Pandora's Box!


I have to disagree with this. Talisman expansions don't add nearly the amount of new rules and difficulty as Arkham Horror's expansions do. So I really have no problem with expanding Talisman.

Expansions (for the most part) in Talisman just give you more options. In my games, players sometimes never even visit certain corner boards because there are so many paths to victory. The expansions (in most cases) just provide more variety and content to explore. In this case more expansions = better.

Arkham Horror expansions, on the other hand, change drastic parts of the game-play and theme and I never play with more than one at a time. For example, Dunwich is a scenario centered around the Dunwich Horror's arrival and your attempts to stop it. Innsmouth is about people turning into fish creatures. The King In Yellow is about a festival in Arkham. Etc. It doesn't make much sense to me to combine expansions because your theme gets really watered down and rules get out of hand. I wrote more about this on the AH forums if you're interested.
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Plaid Dragon
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Well, I wonder if this is all sort of moot.

They've given us all the corners now as well as added a very end-of-world themed small box: Harbinger. Given that, I wonder if 4th ed is going to be end-of-lifed?

The only thing I can see that might be left for FFG to do would be re-hashes of prior edition stuff like Timescape/Dragon's Tower. I can't see myself as very enthusiastic about such things.

Regardless, if there ARE more xpacs, what I don't want to see is the adventure deck growing any further. It's been very ungainly to deal with for some time now. Diluting it further and growing the size of this monster really doesn't serve imho.
 
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DomaGB
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More adventure cards please.
 
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Grarrrg Grarrrgowski
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Contestants ready...

Plaid_Dragon wrote:
I don't want to see is the adventure deck growing any further.

DomaGB wrote:
More adventure cards please.


FIGHT!
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