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Subject: Am I allowed to score the tile where I don't have any species? rss

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Povilas Šimonis
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The whole question is placed in threat;]
Am I allowed to score the tile where I don't have any species?
Asking because in this way, during last turn winner can be affected greatly by losing side;]
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Geoff Burkman
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Unless this is some sort of trick question, the answer is no.
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Kristof Bodric
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Pseudomonass wrote:
The whole question is placed in threat;]
Am I allowed to score the tile where I don't have any species?
Asking because in this way, during last turn winner can be affected greatly by losing side;]


Hi Povilas,
If your question was "Am I allowed to choose a tile I have no species on for the Domination action?" then the answer is yes. You will get no points, though, but you can give the points/card to someone else to affect final scoring.
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Chris Stimpson
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In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.
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Povilas Šimonis
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cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.
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Steve Bachman
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cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.

What if the player has no tiles he can score for points? What if it is a return favor from a prior deal or offered for similar future considerations?

Some people are very quick to throw the Kingmaker label out there, but there is a lot to most games beyond the immediate impact of an action.
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Jeff Pratt
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Pseudomonass wrote:
cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.


I know Chad's opinion on this, because I read the rulebook and his rules are always airtight. You can do exactly what the rules say you can do and that is "select one tile on earth that has not been scored...". there is no mention of cubes whatsoever.

You guys are looking at it from the wrong angle anyway. You don't score a hex where you have no cubes as a kingmaker move. You score a hex where you don't have any cubes to block a Dominance action from your opponents. You select dominance then target a tundra hex that is worthless to everyone or a hex where no one can claim a Dominance card.
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Dan Axford
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vladdswrath wrote:
Pseudomonass wrote:
cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.


I know Chad's opinion on this, because I read the rulebook and his rules are always airtight. You can do exactly what the rules say you can do and that is "select one tile on earth that has not been scored...". there is no mention of cubes whatsoever.

You guys are looking at it from the wrong angle anyway. You don't score a hex where you have no cubes as a kingmaker move. You score a hex where you don't have any cubes to block a Dominance action from your opponents. You select dominance then target a tundra hex that is worthless to everyone or a hex where no one can claim a Dominance card.


Wouldn't you just pass on taking the action in that case though? As I recall, the instructions say that all actions are optional.
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Jeff Pratt
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Danzo wrote:
vladdswrath wrote:
Pseudomonass wrote:
cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.


I know Chad's opinion on this, because I read the rulebook and his rules are always airtight. You can do exactly what the rules say you can do and that is "select one tile on earth that has not been scored...". there is no mention of cubes whatsoever.

You guys are looking at it from the wrong angle anyway. You don't score a hex where you have no cubes as a kingmaker move. You score a hex where you don't have any cubes to block a Dominance action from your opponents. You select dominance then target a tundra hex that is worthless to everyone or a hex where no one can claim a Dominance card.


Wouldn't you just pass on taking the action in that case though? As I recall, the instructions say that all actions are optional.


Well, there is that too. I like to try and use that space as leverage for negotiations myself, or just to burn cards out of the Dominance card market when they are less damaging. I don't think passing is the best option, but if none of the options can be leveraged to your advantage, then passing is both legal and the right move, for sure. Good catch. it's right at the beginning of the resolving action spaces section of the rules.
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Geoff Burkman
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Wow, did I ever misinterpret that question! I stand abashedly corrected, while admitting that the situation has never presented itself in any of the handful of games I've managed to play. blush
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Steve Bachman
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Danzo wrote:
vladdswrath wrote:
Pseudomonass wrote:
cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.


I know Chad's opinion on this, because I read the rulebook and his rules are always airtight. You can do exactly what the rules say you can do and that is "select one tile on earth that has not been scored...". there is no mention of cubes whatsoever.

You guys are looking at it from the wrong angle anyway. You don't score a hex where you have no cubes as a kingmaker move. You score a hex where you don't have any cubes to block a Dominance action from your opponents. You select dominance then target a tundra hex that is worthless to everyone or a hex where no one can claim a Dominance card.


Wouldn't you just pass on taking the action in that case though? As I recall, the instructions say that all actions are optional.

There are a lot of cards that I would NOT want to be hit by. If I can't score domination myself, the best option may be to let an opponent who has a better target than me use it rather than passing and having the card remain for an opponent I am in direct conflict with to grab.
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Dan Axford
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Ward wrote:
Danzo wrote:
vladdswrath wrote:
Pseudomonass wrote:
cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


Does anyone knows Chad Jensens opinion on this? When we played one player used this since it suited rules, but in my opinion since you don't have any species there at all, this 'Kingmaker' move is to strong in evolutionary point of view.


I know Chad's opinion on this, because I read the rulebook and his rules are always airtight. You can do exactly what the rules say you can do and that is "select one tile on earth that has not been scored...". there is no mention of cubes whatsoever.

You guys are looking at it from the wrong angle anyway. You don't score a hex where you have no cubes as a kingmaker move. You score a hex where you don't have any cubes to block a Dominance action from your opponents. You select dominance then target a tundra hex that is worthless to everyone or a hex where no one can claim a Dominance card.


Wouldn't you just pass on taking the action in that case though? As I recall, the instructions say that all actions are optional.

There are a lot of cards that I would NOT want to be hit by. If I can't score domination myself, the best option may be to let an opponent who has a better target than me use it rather than passing and having the card remain for an opponent I am in direct conflict with to grab.

Ah yes, of course, your point and the above bargaining idea are good. It's been over a year since I had a game that wasn't 2-player, so these ideas haven't been on my radar for a while.
 
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Stephen Stewart
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cstimpson wrote:
In other words, a 'Kingmaker' move where you know you can't win but can determine who DOES win. Not illegal, but not good gaming protocol.


In no way this is a kingmaker move.

If you think it's only a kingmaker move you haven't played the game.

There are dozens of instances where this can help the Player.

 
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Povilas Šimonis
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Does it work well with two players? How long does it take approximately?;]
Btw thank you for answers, all of you;]
 
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Dan Axford
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Pseudomonass wrote:
Does it work well with two players? How long does it take approximately?;]
Btw thank you for answers, all of you;]

I've enjoyed it a lot with two. There are two options: either you take one animal each (like in larger games) or you take two animals each; I've only ever played with one animal each. It's a lot easier to plan your turn at the lower player counts since only one eyeball space will be taken between your turns, as opposed to, say, five eyeball spaces in a six-player game.

I can't quite remember how long it takes, but I think it was about two hours - certainly towards the bottom end of the given playing time range.

 
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