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Subject: Questions during first game rss

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Steve Austin
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First game.

1) I assume the first player remains the first player for the rest of the game unless someone takes the rebuild action and steals the start token? Seems a bit odd.

2) do the fishing dock and wheat fields count as part of your district? We have been counting them as part of the Max 4 you get at start of the game.

3) military cards left over do not get discarded, only covered up with new ones. So, you could have access to buying older cards once someone buys the top one of the pile?

4) there are colored banners on each military card, very small, being carried by the army. Do these count for end game banner scoring or are they only for looks?

5) each purchased army card must remain separate, or not? There is some confusion due to page 11: "...after buying, player must place it in one of his armies. If there are no 'open' armies, you must retire an active military card you already own...." Place it in one of his armies? I thought they remain seperate. What is an open army?

...okay, I think an open army is referring to a 'slot', meaning if you have capacity for two armies, and only one card out, you have an open slot. i understand the legacy part.

In two player, we are finding very little we can't do as far as actions, since there are three spots with special rules letting you match or go below any currently played citizens. This aspect seems a bit weak in two player, but I guess that is to be expected.
 
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Kris Ardianto
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Peepser wrote:

1) I assume the first player remains the first player for the rest of the game unless someone takes the rebuild action and steals the start token? Seems a bit odd.

Yes, so someone would grab that eventually. Turn order is important because the blocking mechanism of the workers.

Peepser wrote:

2) do the fishing dock and wheat fields count as part of your district? We have been counting them as part of the Max 4 you get at start of the game.

Yes, they're part of empire cards, in which you start with size 2 (max 4) and potentially increased from district card bonus.

Peepser wrote:

3) military cards left over do not get discarded, only covered up with new ones. So, you could have access to buying older cards once someone buys the top one of the pile?

I think empire cards and military cards are all get discarded at the end of each round.

Peepser wrote:

4) there are colored banners on each military card, very small, being carried by the army. Do these count for end game banner scoring or are they only for looks?

No.

Peepser wrote:

5) each purchased army card must remain separate, or not? There is some confusion due to page 11: "...after buying, player must place it in one of his armies. If there are no 'open' armies, you must retire an active military card you already own...." Place it in one of his armies? I thought they remain seperate. What is an open army?
...okay, I think an open army is referring to a 'slot', meaning if you have capacity for two armies, and only one card out, you have an open slot. i understand the legacy part.


Military units in your empire has limitation, at the start of the game you can only have 2, which is militia and city guard units already covered that. If you want to get another military card, then you need to expand the limit (some empire, district or titan cards give you this bonus) of your military unit. But if you don't have any additional slot, you can retire one of the available unit you have. Available here means the unit is not yet activated this round. If you retire a unit, flip that unit face down and place the new unit on top of it. The retired unit gives you legacy bonus to the new unit.
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Steve Austin
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Thanks for clarifying. See page 4 of rulebook: it says you do not discard military cards after the first round. New cards go over them, so I would assume that you still have a chance to buy older military cards if the top ones get recruited.
 
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Bryan Doughty
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Peepser wrote:
First game.

1) I assume the first player remains the first player for the rest of the game unless someone takes the rebuild action and steals the start token? Seems a bit odd.


Yes. If you want to be first, you have to take it.

Peepser wrote:
2) do the fishing dock and wheat fields count as part of your district? We have been counting them as part of the Max 4 you get at start of the game.


They are Empire cards. They do use your capacity.

Peepser wrote:
3) military cards left over do not get discarded, only covered up with new ones. So, you could have access to buying older cards once someone buys the top one of the pile?


Military cards are not discarded. They aren't covered up either. Between rounds just replace those that were recruited. If none were recruited, no new cards are revealed.

Peepser wrote:
4) there are colored banners on each military card, very small, being carried by the army. Do these count for end game banner scoring or are they only for looks?


It's just a picture. It has no function. Banners are on Titan and Empire cards only. They are always at the upper left corner. They come in five varieties.

Peepser wrote:
5) each purchased army card must remain separate, or not? There is some confusion due to page 11: "...after buying, player must place it in one of his armies. If there are no 'open' armies, you must retire an active military card you already own...." Place it in one of his armies? I thought they remain seperate. What is an open army?


Take a look at your Capital City. Do you see that along with a food, five income, and four capacity that you also have two grey rectangular icons? Those indicate your army limit; two. You begin with both being occupied. One has the City Guard, and the other has Militia. To have an "open" army you will first need to gain more of those army limit icons. If you do, then you may recruit a new Military card into a new army. If you don't then you may still recruit a new Military card, but must also retire one of your existing armies to place the card at the top of that army column. So no, Military cards don't need to be separate from each other, in fact generally you will be adding them to existing Armies.

Peepser wrote:
...okay, I think an open army is referring to a 'slot', meaning if you have capacity for two armies, and only one card out, you have an open slot. i understand the legacy part.


Yeah, there you go. Slot is how I usually think of it.

Peepser wrote:
In two player, we are finding very little we can't do as far as actions, since there are three spots with special rules letting you match or go below any currently played citizens. This aspect seems a bit weak in two player, but I guess that is to be expected.


Those three spaces are too basic/critical to game flow for the hard block possible with other actions. With some practice, I think you may find that The Ancient World can provide a very tight and competitive game for two players. Learning to use skill level to block where you can and to squeeze money from your opponents where you can't, learning to draft better cards before your opponent can take them, and learning to attack and rebuild before your opponent can rebuild so as to keep or take First Player will be useful in developing that more competitive game. It's a short game, so speed and efficiency are key. With only six rounds for play, if a player could be completely blocked from those actions in any player count, there wouldn't be much game.
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Bryan Doughty
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Peepser wrote:
Thanks for clarifying. See page 4 of rulebook: it says you do not discard military cards after the first round. New cards go over them, so I would assume that you still have a chance to buy older military cards if the top ones get recruited.


It is true that the Military cards are not discarded between rounds. There is nothing on page four about putting Military cards over other Military cards. What it says, is to draw cards until there are as many as there are players.
 
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Marc
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bryanldoughty wrote:
Peepser wrote:

Peepser wrote:
5) each purchased army card must remain separate, or not? There is some confusion due to page 11: "...after buying, player must place it in one of his armies. If there are no 'open' armies, you must retire an active military card you already own...." Place it in one of his armies? I thought they remain seperate. What is an open army?


Take a look at your Capital City. Do you see that along with a food, five income, and four capacity that you also have two grey rectangular icons? Those indicate your army limit; two. You begin with both being occupied. One has the City Guard, and the other has Militia. To have an "open" army you will first need to gain more of those army limit icons. If you do, then you may recruit a new Military card into a new army. If you don't then you may still recruit a new Military card, but must also retire one of your existing armies to place the card at the top of that army column. So no, Military cards don't need to be separate from each other, in fact generally you will be adding them to existing Armies.


these are a lot of "may's".... lets assume I have 3 slots, and 2 armies and I am going to take the "new army" action on the board:
so does that mean that I can hire a new army and retire an existing army even with one "slot" still open? or do I first have to put the new army in the open slot, before i am even able to retire an existing army? It can be a big difference, because retiring also means having to pay a lot less for the army to battle again etc.
 
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Kris Ardianto
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Elektro wrote:

these are a lot of "may's".... lets assume I have 3 slots, and 2 armies and I am going to take the "new army" action on the board:
so does that mean that I can hire a new army and retire an existing army even with one "slot" still open? or do I first have to put the new army in the open slot, before i am even able to retire an existing army? It can be a big difference, because retiring also means having to pay a lot less for the army to battle again etc.


It's a choice.
So you can hire a new army and put it into your empty slot or maybe place it on the existing army so the existing will retire.
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Tom Vandeweyer
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bryanldoughty wrote:
Peepser wrote:
Thanks for clarifying. See page 4 of rulebook: it says you do not discard military cards after the first round. New cards go over them, so I would assume that you still have a chance to buy older military cards if the top ones get recruited.


It is true that the Military cards are not discarded between rounds. There is nothing on page four about putting Military cards over other Military cards. What it says, is to draw cards until there are as many as there are players.


Hold it! There's 2 different things that are getting mixed up here!

>>> military slots ON THE GAMEBOARD:
they are replenished every round up to the amount of players.

>>> military slots IN YOUR PLAYING AREA:
starts with 2 slots (as indicated on the player board). New military cards are put on top of the old ones (which are flipped to the legacy side, with the legacy ability still visible).


So the military cards on the gameboard are never covered with other military cards. That part of the rules refers to the military cards in your playing area.
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Kris Ardianto
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Phanthomus wrote:

>>> military slots ON THE GAMEBOARD:
they are replenished every round up to the amount of players.


This is how I play the game!
That's why I kinda confused that the military cards are not discarded but get stacked over the new one. It's weird. Unless like Research card in Aquasphere, where it's explicitly stated.
 
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Greg
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Military cards on the game board stay there until they are purchased. Only the empty slots where a military card has been taken from gets refilled. Existing military cards on the game board don't get covered up or discarded. Leftover empire cards do however get discarded and fully replaced at the end of the round?
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Tom Vandeweyer
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Hahma wrote:
Military cards on the game board stay there until they are purchased. Only the empty slots where a military card has been taken from gets refilled. Existing military cards on the game board don't get covered up or discarded. Leftover empire cards do however get discarded and fully replaced at the end of the round?


Yes, only the empty slots are filled in. Is the definition of "to replenish" not "to fill up the empty spaces"?

The left over empire cards are ALL discarded and replaced by all new ones.
 
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Bryan Doughty
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I find it is useful to distinguish between the terms Military and Army. Military is a type of card; a component. Army is a collection of Military cards in the possession of a single player. Each player begins with two Armies each composed of one Military card. Part of game set-up is drawing a number of Military cards from the deck of Military cards equal to the number of players. Part of the between round process is drawing additional Military cards to replace those previously purchased. When a player recruits a new Army by purchasing a Military card he may place it into an Army with zero cards (an "open" Army), or he may retire an existing Army adding those legacy abilities to the new Army.
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Marc
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That's a very good clarification, Bryan.
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Greg
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Phanthomus wrote:
Hahma wrote:
Military cards on the game board stay there until they are purchased. Only the empty slots where a military card has been taken from gets refilled. Existing military cards on the game board don't get covered up or discarded. Leftover empire cards do however get discarded and fully replaced at the end of the round?


Yes, only the empty slots are filled in. Is the definition of "to replenish" not "to fill up the empty spaces"?

The left over empire cards are ALL discarded and replaced by all new ones.


Yes, you had it right Tom, but then Kris quoted you and mentioned about how its weird to stack army cards. I think I was confused about his intent as he quoted you but mentioned stacking. You were talking about the board and he was talking about next to the player mat.
 
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Steve Austin
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Thanks for answering. However, I still see page 4 as not being very clear regarding military cards, and this is why I placed new cards right over the old ones.

It says "do not discard any military cards that remain on the board. Draw new cards from the military deck and place them face up in the military card track until there are a number of cards equal to the number of players."

It would be better to say 'do not discard any military cards that remain on the board. Refill any empty military card slots with new cards."
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