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Subject: Disallowed pairings? rss

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Ryan R

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Does your group consider certain faction pairs overpowered and disallow those combinations?

For example, while I don't have the Cthulhu expansion, the guy at my FLGS told me he doesn't allow any two factions from that box to be paired up.

With so many possible pairs, I don't feel like I have enough experience with the game to make these decisions, so I'm wondering how the veterans handle it.
 
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Sachin Daniels
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Play with all but Geeks really. Any other combo is allowed. We just play random though.
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Radical Rhino
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Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.
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Andre Oliveira
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All factions have some sort of counter.

If people don't draft accordingly, gang up on the person with the stronger combination.
After all, if someone is glaring the strongest in a multi-player environment , people will gang up against him.

---
I suppose robot ponies would be very strong.
Minions of Cthulhu and Miskatonic University is probably the combo your friend had in mind.

Here a few strong ones from core.
Ninja-Aliens
Wizard-Tricksters
Zombie-Dinosaurs
Dinosaurs-Robots
Pirate-Robots

 
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David Lee
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Eh, there's really nothing wrong with pairing the Cthulu factions. It's no Robot/Zombie.

My group doesn't have any disallowed pairings, but we do have a bit of an unspoken agreement not to spam the powerful stuff. When it comes to 2v2, drafting usually takes care of the really overpowered stuff.
 
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Andre Oliveira
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Parsat wrote:
Eh, there's really nothing wrong with pairing the Cthulu factions. It's no Robot/Zombie.

My group doesn't have any disallowed pairings, but we do have a bit of an unspoken agreement not to spam the powerful stuff. When it comes to 2v2, drafting usually takes care of the really overpowered stuff.

You really find that combo so good?
While resurrecting Alpha and Fixer is nice. It doesn't pack a punch like a ninja master or King Rex.
 
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Peter Cooper
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We play random, but one of our players, when he got robots/zombies, offered to re-roll his choices because he thought (correctly) it would be no fun for the rest of us.
 
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Michael F
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We do it randomly, but the robots and aliens are seen as being pretty OP. I still find myself winning most games of Smash Up despite the combinations though. I think it's easy for me to see how the strengths of each team play off each other. For example, I mopped the floor in a 4p game recently as killer plants and mad scientists. I don't know anyone who considers those factions to be OP.
 
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robert
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desocupado wrote:
Parsat wrote:
Eh, there's really nothing wrong with pairing the Cthulu factions. It's no Robot/Zombie.

My group doesn't have any disallowed pairings, but we do have a bit of an unspoken agreement not to spam the powerful stuff. When it comes to 2v2, drafting usually takes care of the really overpowered stuff.

You really find that combo so good?
While resurrecting Alpha and Fixer is nice. It doesn't pack a punch like a ninja master or King Rex.


its not just resurrecting alpha and fixer. Its grabbing minions that let you start minion chains again. Also using the action that lets you play minions from your discard instead of your hand. With that action you can do a huge chain from your hand, then do it again from your discard on a new base. Zombie/Robot essentially plays 10+ power at least every other turn in one turn.

Zombies in general are amazing, best faction to combo with any other faction in almost any situation.
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Daniel Matteo
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Radical Rhino wrote:
Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.


This combo also has a borderline infinite with Time Walk, Scry, Repeater Perfect & Neophyte. It's ridiculous.

My group bans Wizard Zombies for the same reason (10 minute turns are not fun).

& While there IS a Turn 1 win for Alien Cultists, it requires such a ridiculously perfect set-up, it's not worth worrying about.
 
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Jay Young
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My Group of friends play with a ban draft, so at the start of every game we can choose to ban X faction from even being picked. So how it works is we all ban 1 faction everyone does their normal A,B,C Pick then ban another faction after picks then go back C,B,A . Cause people to think a bit harder when picking. but to do this you need most the expansions else not enough bans. You could also try just banning at the start and no middle ban.
 
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Tyler R. Springfield
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Robot Zombie could be good but it is hard because one wants minions in a hand and the other in a discard pile. super hero princesses is really good. play that enough times and people will keep you from picking it in the draft without a rule needed
 
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Jay Young
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Since this thread has been necro'd I'd like to say my group stopped doing bans and started playing the the exact rules of the games and we have just been better at counter picking.

Not allowing pairs is still silly to us. There is no single over powered pair that can beat everything in the game no matter what situation. Even though we mainly do 2 player games even aliens have about a 40% win rate.
 
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Andre Oliveira
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By rules you mean draft 8 random factions, regardless of the number of players, Jay Young (zyocuh)?

But what I said before still stands, some combinations shouldn't be drafted in a serious draft process. Like the robot plants or some others like this the one in thisthread.
 
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Anonymous Person
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sonus wrote:
[q="desocupado"]Also using the action that lets you play minions from your discard instead of your hand. With that action you can do a huge chain from your hand, then do it again from your discard on a new base. Zombie/Robot essentially plays 10+ power at least every other turn in one turn.


The one that attaches to a base only applies to one minion per turn. At least that's what I've heard.
 
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Anonymous Person
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CNightmare072 wrote:
Radical Rhino wrote:
Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.


This combo also has a borderline infinite with Time Walk, Scry, Repeater Perfect & Neophyte. It's ridiculous.

My group bans Wizard Zombies for the same reason (10 minute turns are not fun).

& While there IS a Turn 1 win for Alien Cultists, it requires such a ridiculously perfect set-up, it's not worth worrying about.


What is the turn 1 win? I've seen the infinite actions combo but how does that guarantee a win (assuming that's what you're referring to)?
 
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Daniel Matteo
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Father Time wrote:
CNightmare072 wrote:
Radical Rhino wrote:
Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.


This combo also has a borderline infinite with Time Walk, Scry, Repeater Perfect & Neophyte. It's ridiculous.

My group bans Wizard Zombies for the same reason (10 minute turns are not fun).

& While there IS a Turn 1 win for Alien Cultists, it requires such a ridiculously perfect set-up, it's not worth worrying about.


What is the turn 1 win? I've seen the infinite actions combo but how does that guarantee a win (assuming that's what you're referring to)?


In your opening hand you need:
Collector
Servitor of Cthulhu
Altar to Cthulhu
The Seal is Broken


And The Homeworld needs to be in play.

Play Altar on Homeworld, then play & return Collector an infinite # of times. You now have infinite actions & power 2 or less plays. Play the Seal is Broken for 1 VP. Play Servitor to get back Seal, use the Madness from Seal to draw 2 more, play Seal again, repeat.
You will also need to draw into more Servitors and/or Recruit by Force for this to work.
 
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Anonymous Person
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Radical Rhino wrote:
Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.


My brother and I once played a game where we both picked the worst combos we could think of. I picked robot wizards because I honestly thought it would be awful. It isn't and I won, partly through an amazing stroke of luck. Hoverbot -> Neophyte -> Mass Enchantment -> InstaGrow from the plants deck.

Anyway the combo I've seen that takes the longest turns is Shapeshifting Ghosts. You've got a ton of options and "can/should I empty my hand" becomes a lot harder to answer when you can turn your minions into ghosts or spirits or hauntings.
 
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Anonymous Person
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CNightmare072 wrote:
Father Time wrote:
CNightmare072 wrote:
Radical Rhino wrote:
Wizard Time Travelers. Not for being op, but for turns taking 10 minutes.


This combo also has a borderline infinite with Time Walk, Scry, Repeater Perfect & Neophyte. It's ridiculous.

My group bans Wizard Zombies for the same reason (10 minute turns are not fun).

& While there IS a Turn 1 win for Alien Cultists, it requires such a ridiculously perfect set-up, it's not worth worrying about.


What is the turn 1 win? I've seen the infinite actions combo but how does that guarantee a win (assuming that's what you're referring to)?


In your opening hand you need:
Collector
Servitor of Cthulhu
Altar to Cthulhu
The Seal is Broken


And The Homeworld needs to be in play.

Play Altar on Homeworld, then play & return Collector an infinite # of times. You now have infinite actions & power 2 or less plays. Play the Seal is Broken for 1 VP. Play Servitor to get back Seal, use the Madness from Seal to draw 2 more, play Seal again, repeat.
You will also need to draw into more Servitors and/or Recruit by Force for this to work.


I don't know if this will work I think you need recruit by force and a minimum of 2 servitors. Let's see

Infinite actions, play 2 servitors.

Play Seal.
Destroy servitor to put seal back on top of the deck
Discard Madness. Draw 2 cards. You now have Seal in your hand.
Use recruit by force
You now have Servitor on the top of the deck. And one servitor in play
Play Seal
Destroy other Servitor to put recruit by force on the top.

Play madness to get servitor and recruit back.

Play servitor you just got, destroy it to put seal on top. But now you don't have a madness to draw more cards from/.


Arrgh this is confusing, do you have a system to keep recycling recruit from force, seal and enough servitors to keep this going in one turn forever?

Edit: I'm 99% sure this impossible. You could use 4 servitors to get 4VP + 4 madness but 15? I don't think so.

If you could use Madness to redraw Seal + Recruit by force it might be possible but you can't unless you use recruit to put 0 minions on top of your deck. Once you use Madness you got from playing Seal to get Recruit By force and a Servitor back you no longer have the Madness needed to re-draw Seal. So it's not an infinite loop despite infinite actions and infinite servitor plays.

I suppose you could use Servitor to put Madness back on top of your deck but you'd still need another card to draw that.

Maybe you could also use Cthulhu Fhtagn (Reveal cards from the top of your deck until you have revealed two actions. Place them into your hand and put the rest of the cards on the bottom of your deck.) but I haven't looked into it.
 
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Anonymous Person
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Also to answer OP my brother and I disallow Robot Horses and look down on Zombie robots.

Also we discourage Aliens in a 1v1 game.
 
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Andre Oliveira
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Father Time wrote:
Also to answer OP my brother and I disallow Robot Horses and look down on Zombie robots.

Also we discourage Aliens in a 1v1 game.

Put dragons against them
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Anonymous Person
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desocupado wrote:
Father Time wrote:
Also to answer OP my brother and I disallow Robot Horses and look down on Zombie robots.

Also we discourage Aliens in a 1v1 game.

Put dragons against them


The robot horses or the aliens?

Also to be fair we made these bans well before It's Your Fault came out.
 
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Andre Oliveira
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Alien x Dragons

Robot horses can face alien-zombie.
Zombie-cats, elder-cats, shape-zombies might be worth trying.
And maybe zombie-ninja or elder-trickster can try too.
 
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Daniel Matteo
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Father Time wrote:
CNightmare072 wrote:


In your opening hand you need:
Collector
Servitor of Cthulhu
Altar to Cthulhu
The Seal is Broken


And The Homeworld needs to be in play.

Play Altar on Homeworld, then play & return Collector an infinite # of times. You now have infinite actions & power 2 or less plays. Play the Seal is Broken for 1 VP. Play Servitor to get back Seal, use the Madness from Seal to draw 2 more, play Seal again, repeat.
You will also need to draw into more Servitors and/or Recruit by Force for this to work.


I don't know if this will work I think you need recruit by force and a minimum of 2 servitors. Let's see

Infinite actions, play 2 servitors.

Play Seal.
Destroy servitor to put seal back on top of the deck
Discard Madness. Draw 2 cards. You now have Seal in your hand.
Use recruit by force
You now have Servitor on the top of the deck. And one servitor in play
Play Seal
Destroy other Servitor to put recruit by force on the top.

Play madness to get servitor and recruit back.

Play servitor you just got, destroy it to put seal on top. But now you don't have a madness to draw more cards from/.


Arrgh this is confusing, do you have a system to keep recycling recruit from force, seal and enough servitors to keep this going in one turn forever?


Remember there's a lot of Cultist actions that give you Madness. Since you have infinite actions, use those cards to draw the Madness & immediately use them to draw more cards.

It's tough & incredibly situational, but it can happen.
 
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Anonymous Person
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CNightmare072 wrote:
Father Time wrote:
CNightmare072 wrote:


In your opening hand you need:
Collector
Servitor of Cthulhu
Altar to Cthulhu
The Seal is Broken


And The Homeworld needs to be in play.

Play Altar on Homeworld, then play & return Collector an infinite # of times. You now have infinite actions & power 2 or less plays. Play the Seal is Broken for 1 VP. Play Servitor to get back Seal, use the Madness from Seal to draw 2 more, play Seal again, repeat.
You will also need to draw into more Servitors and/or Recruit by Force for this to work.


I don't know if this will work I think you need recruit by force and a minimum of 2 servitors. Let's see

Infinite actions, play 2 servitors.

Play Seal.
Destroy servitor to put seal back on top of the deck
Discard Madness. Draw 2 cards. You now have Seal in your hand.
Use recruit by force
You now have Servitor on the top of the deck. And one servitor in play
Play Seal
Destroy other Servitor to put recruit by force on the top.

Play madness to get servitor and recruit back.

Play servitor you just got, destroy it to put seal on top. But now you don't have a madness to draw more cards from/.


Arrgh this is confusing, do you have a system to keep recycling recruit from force, seal and enough servitors to keep this going in one turn forever?


Remember there's a lot of Cultist actions that give you Madness. Since you have infinite actions, use those cards to draw the Madness & immediately use them to draw more cards.

It's tough & incredibly situational, but it can happen.


Has it happened to you?
 
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