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Subject: Failed Dice rss

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Tom Debiec
Australia
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Hi Agents

Just got the game, talk about production value, the box is heavier then then my late grandfathers oak coffin.

But to the question at hand,
The marines defence ability states: " re roll all faild defence dice" i took it to mean re roll all dice except shields ( shields being successes not fails) but i'm not so sure now.
On page 17 of the rule book there is a table describing all possible die results and the very last one with the alien symbol states: "This symbol indicates a failed result.
Is it possible that Chromium can only re roll alien results?
Any take on this would be appriciated.

 
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Jonathan Arnold
United States
Medford
Massachusetts
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Actually, it's the other way 'round. You can't reroll alien results, like it says in the rulebook. The marine can reroll other results that failed to defend, like hit symbols.
 
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Tom Debiec
Australia
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Yes, normally you could,nt but special abilities over rule the rule book.
So if marines special ability is to re roll failed dice, which are the alien symbol then it is allowed..... We'll at least that's how I see it
 
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Tom Debiec
Australia
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The problem is in the statement "failed dice" which is connected to the alien symbol.
If that is the case then his armour sucks
 
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Hero Guy
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jdarnold wrote:
Actually, it's the other way 'round. You can't reroll alien results, like it says in the rulebook. The marine can reroll other results that failed to defend, like hit symbols.


This is correct. In the rules, it states that all alien results on dice are failed results and they can not be re-rolled unless an ability specifically says that you can re-roll it. The marines ability does not specify that it allows you to re-roll alien results, thus those can't be re-rolled. However, alien results are not the only failed results possible. Any result that is not a success is a failed result. Thus, when defending, lightning bolt, and hit results are failed results.

So as an example:

The marine is attacked and the alien rolls 4 successful hits. The marine rolls 4 defense dice and gets shield, lightning bolt, hit and alien. Since the lightning bolt was rolled, it triggers the special defense ability so the marine can now reroll 2 of the defense dice, the lightning bolt (even though it was used to trigger the special ability) and the hit.
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Tom Debiec
Australia
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Ahhhhh, yes makes sense

Thank you guys for your responses

It just that the frase failed dice bothered me it should say maybe all non shield results.... Or something
 
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Hero Guy
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akagi6 wrote:
Ahhhhh, yes makes sense

Thank you guys for your responses

It just that the frase failed dice bothered me it should say maybe all non shield results.... Or something


Much like all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares; all alien results are failed dice, but not all failed dice are alien results.

Having said that, I do agree that the way the rules are written, there seems to be extra emphasis that alien results are failed dice and that can make it seem like it is saying that only alien results are failed results. But what is actually being emphasized is the fact that alien results can't be re-rolled by agents unless there is another effect that specifically says that they can.
 
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Tom Debiec
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Thank you , you have been a great help.
Actually the rule book is quite good as rule books go, unlike some like sedition wars.... Boy was that a disaster.

 
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D Squish
Germany
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I'm glad I found this thread and that it confirmend my understanding of rerolling failed dice.
Unfortunatly I have another detail question regarding this topic. This is how I played it in the first two missions:
If you attack every dice showing at least a single hit is a success.
Likewise every shield is a success when defending.
In mission 3 I encountered the xeno-alpha for the first time and became confused.

If you are allowed, as an agent or an alien (xeno-alpha), to reroll failed dice using the bolt on a dice, is this dice counted as a success or a fail?
First of all an example using a defense roll with 4 dices.
Dice 1: Shield
Dice 2: Bolt/hit
Dice 3: Bolt/hit
Dice 4: Alien head

Dice 1 is a sucess while the dice 2-3 don't prevent a hit "failed". Does "using" the ability to reroll failed dice, turn dice 2 into a success because it is "used" and your may reroll dice 3 and 4 or are you allowed to reroll also dice 2 even though you did "use/spend" it to cause the reroll?

Of course dice 4 may only be rerolled by an alien. At least I haven't found an ability which states that an agent is allowed to reroll a dice with an alien head.


While the defense example is quite simple it's more interessting when the xeno-alpha attacks. The xeno-alpha could decide to go for maximum damage. In this case all red dices which don't show two hits could be counted as misses. If it's posibile to reroll dice than all other dice would be rerolled.
Since the jam and ammo symbol don't matter for the alien there's a 60% chance that a reroll doesn't change the number of hits of a single dice. In addition there's a 10% chance that the dice does two damage. On the contrary there's a 30% chance that no hits are shown. Depending on the situation this could be a valid option. Especially if you play with the high impact rule which limits the maximum defense dice to 5 and the alien is could drop the health to zero or if it would be killed during the next round.

Perhaps I should stop thinking about ways to make it even more difficult when I didn't even manage to complete a mission successfully.
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Skaak
United States
Seattle
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DSquish wrote:
Does "using" the ability to reroll failed dice, turn dice 2 into a success because it is "used" and your may reroll dice 3 and 4 or are you allowed to reroll also dice 2 even though you did "use/spend" it to cause the reroll?


No, the bolt ability does not transform the die into a "success". You would re-roll any dice without a SHIELD (unless an agent is doing the re-rolling, in which case the alien result is also unable to be re-rolled).

Similarly, a Xeno-Alpha attack only re-rolls dice without a HIT symbol. No need to do any statistical analysis to decide if he has a better chance to gain hits by re-rolling successful dice.
 
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D Squish
Germany
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Thanks for the clarification. I should stop coming up with stupid ideas making the game even more difficult.
 
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