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Subject: Multiple Followers - have I been scoring wrongly. rss

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James
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Hello,

I think I may have been scoring wrongly all this time, but I prefer the way I have been doing it!

Currently we play that if 2 or more followers on a road, city or farm join up during game that the player (with most meeples) scores points for each follower rather than just to determine who wins a contested feature.

For example a player joins 2 separately claimed roads which form 1 long road, Instead of scoring 1 point for each road tile they score 2 because they have 2 followers on the completed feature. Playing this way allows for clever strategy to gain more points as well as wipe out other players. It is great for farmers too as you can really mess people up with lots of sneaky farmers clocking up points in a mega field.

I know that the big meeple and meeples on hills (Hills & Sheep) only count as 1 meeple for scoring but are the power of 2 for determining contested features - we still play this way.

I just started playing the Android app version and noticed that multiple meeples don't contribute to a bigger score. So I assume I have been scoring wrongly all this time.... but I don't think I will change as I really like the way we score!

Please can you confirm the 'official' rules and also does anyone else play/score the way I have been doing?

Thanks
 
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Jiri "Sleepy"
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Yep. More meeples only determine who "wins" region if there are more players. It doesn´t multiply score.
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James
Australia
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Thanks. However we will continue playing the wrong way as we like that way too much!

I wonder does anyone else play these house rules?
 
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Connor Cranston
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BC2014 wrote:
Thanks. However we will continue playing the wrong way as we like that way too much!

I wonder does anyone else play these house rules?


So, do you play if there are 2 blue and 1 red on a feature, red will also score points?
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James
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Khonnor wrote:
BC2014 wrote:
Thanks. However we will continue playing the wrong way as we like that way too much!

I wonder does anyone else play these house rules?


So, do you play if there are 2 blue and 1 red on a feature, red will also score points?


No. Blue would score double points and red would be wiped out.
 
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Connor Cranston
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BC2014 wrote:
No. Blue would score double points and red would be wiped out.


In that case, I would say no to your variant. It would put the other player at a greater disadvantage. So yeah, I would advise to just play according the rules or have all meeples score. But, like you said you can play any way you like. Although in that case this should not have been posted in the rules section, but more in the variant section.
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James
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Khonnor wrote:
BC2014 wrote:
No. Blue would score double points and red would be wiped out.


In that case, I would say no to your variant. It would put the other player at a greater disadvantage. So yeah, I would advise to just play according the rules or have all meeples score. But, like you said you can play any way you like. Although in that case this should not have been posted in the rules section, but more in the variant section.


Well the thread was about clarifying the official rules so I thought this was the appropriate thread.If necessary the mods can move the thread. Sorry if it is in the wrong location.

As for the scoring it pushes your opponent to invest in a feature and find different ways to secure it. Our group has never had any issues or imbalances playing this way as it has made all players play more strategically.
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Pasi Ojala
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Scoring for every meeple in a feature would certainly encourage building big cities with as many meeples in them as you can afford. How have you managed to avoid this?

(There is no longer a trade-off between protecting a feature and losing other scoring opportunities. You are rewarded for protecting your features.)
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Tomello Visello
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BC2014 wrote:
Please can you confirm the 'official' rules and also does anyone else play/score the way I have been doing?

A simple way to confirm is to check a copy of the printed rules. Here is a quote from page 5 of the current Z-Man rules with pretty explicit wording.

* If there are multiple meeples in a single scored feature, the player with the most meeples is awarded full points and all other players receive nothing. When more than one player have the most meeples in a scored feature, the tied players all score full points.


EDIT:
The earlier Rio Grande rules did not make it stand out in a summary section as done by Z-Man, yet it is just as clear,


What if a completed city or road has more than one follower?
It is possible through clever placement of land tiles for there to be more than one thief on a road or more than one knight in a city. In a completed road or city, the player with the most thieves (on a road) or the most knights (in a city) earns all the points. When two or more players tie with the most thieves or knights, they each earn the total points for the road or city.


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Tomello Visello
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a1bert wrote:
(There is no longer a trade-off between protecting a feature and losing other scoring opportunities. You are rewarded for protecting your features.)

That states this alternate scoring from the winner's view. I am much discouraged when I take the loser's viewpoint, e.g., I just lost a competition 3 to 2, and for all my work my opponent got triple points out of it.

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Tim Schmitt
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If you like the intensity of competition for big point swings, try adding the Inns & Cathedrals expansion. These features make roads & cities more valuable (but worth points only if completed); also the big meeple encourages that kind of competition.
 
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TVis wrote:
a1bert wrote:
(There is no longer a trade-off between protecting a feature and losing other scoring opportunities. You are rewarded for protecting your features.)

That states this alternate scoring from the winner's view. I am much discouraged when I take the loser's viewpoint, e.g., I just lost a competition 3 to 2, and for all my work my opponent got triple points out of it.



Yeah, if you are going to play this variant, the quantity of the loser's meeples should cancel out the same number of the winner's meeples with the winner only scoring for the number of meeples that remain.
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Abdiel Xordium
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BC2014 wrote:
Currently we play that if 2 or more followers on a road, city or farm join up during game that the player (with most meeples) scores points for each follower rather than just to determine who wins a contested feature.

Yes, you are playing it wrong.

This seems like it would encourage players to play on their own side of the board and play multi-player solitaire games of getting the most meeples on their own structures.

Additionally the incentive to put many meeples into their structures would make it a waste of time for opponents to try to horn in--further promoting player isolation.

Overall it seems like your variant would create a game about puzzling out how to connect your meeples to each other instead of a game about how to connect your meeples to your opponents'. Less player interaction is always bad in my opinion.
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Chuck Hurd
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abdiel wrote:
BC2014 wrote:
Currently we play that if 2 or more followers on a road, city or farm join up during game that the player (with most meeples) scores points for each follower rather than just to determine who wins a contested feature.

Yes, you are playing it wrong.

This seems like it would encourage players to play on their own side of the board and play multi-player solitaire games of getting the most meeples on their own structures.

Additionally the incentive to put many meeples into their structures would make it a waste of time for opponents to try to horn in--further promoting player isolation.

Overall it seems like your variant would create a game about puzzling out how to connect your meeples to each other instead of a game about how to connect your meeples to your opponents'. Less player interaction is always bad in my opinion.

Well put! thumbsup

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Joshua Ryan
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BC2014 wrote:
Playing this way allows for clever strategy to gain more points as well as wipe out other players.


By design, Carcassonne is already a very strategic game when played correctly, so I don't see how your variant really adds much.

You should at least try playing the official rules a few times with your group (not just the app version) and see if your variant is actually something worth continuing.
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A real world example would go like...

Where to eat?

2 people say they want to go to "restaurant X". The other 8 people have no preference. "restaurant X" it is!

Next time around, 2 people say they want to go back to "restaurant X", and 2 others say they liked it and agree. 6 other people are still neutral. So now we're getting 2 meals at "restaurant X"!? Nope! The result doesn't change in anyway, just whether or not it happens.
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Bryan Doughty
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BC2014 wrote:
I know that the big meeple and meeples on hills (Hills & Sheep) only count as 1 meeple for scoring but are the power of 2 for determining contested features - we still play this way.


The large meeple and hills counting differently for determining control and determining score is not part of the game, but another result of your variant as the number of meeple in a feature has no barring on the value of that feature.

Only a large meeple on a hill counts as two because it always counts as two. A regular meeple on a hill is still, just one meeple. Hills don't add virtual meeple to a feature. A player with a meeple in a feature and on a hill, wins ties amongst players that have an equal number of meeple in that feature.
 
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James
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bryanldoughty wrote:
BC2014 wrote:
I know that the big meeple and meeples on hills (Hills & Sheep) only count as 1 meeple for scoring but are the power of 2 for determining contested features - we still play this way.


The large meeple and hills counting differently for determining control and determining score is not part of the game, but another result of your variant as the number of meeple in a feature has no barring on the value of that feature.

Only a large meeple on a hill counts as two because it always counts as two. A regular meeple on a hill is still, just one meeple. Hills don't add virtual meeple to a feature. A player with a meeple in a feature and on a hill, wins ties amongst players that have an equal number of meeple in that feature.


I guess I didn't word it correctly. We are playing exactly as you state above in regard to big meeples and meeples on hills.

What I meant was that placing a meeple on a hill only has the value of 1 meeple for scoring purposes, but in our circle we describe it as having the power of 2 meeples (or 1.5 if you like) when determining who wins in a tie and who gets knocked out.

The player still only receives the points for 1 meeple. It is a matter of the words and description we use rather than actually playing that rule differently.

Value = score
Power = who wins in a tie.

The same applies to big meeple in cities, roads and farms.
 
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