Richard Herrera
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I'm assuming that if Stannis has gained power on previous turns he keeps it, but just for clarification: if Lightbringer is removed as an attachment, does the power get removed from Stannis or does it remain?
 
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Jeff Kayati
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Re: Stamina + Lightbringer and discarding attachments
Lightbringer gives Stannis Renown. It diesn't have the trait itself. So, any gained power from Renown goes on Stannis.

Discarding Lightbringer could not have any effect on the power on Stannis.
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Barry Miller
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While I couldn't find a rule that specifically says that Stannis gets to keep any Power that may be on his card when Lightbringer is removed as an attachment, it can be inferred as such from the rule on pg 12 of the Rules Reference, in the "Leaves Play" section:
"All lasting effects...affecting the card while it is in play expire for that card."

So basically, when Lightbringer leaves play, its effect of gaining Renown for Stannis simply expires. As I said, I couldn't find a rule that specifically discusses what happens to the Power in this situation so it must be inferred that it remains on Stannis' card. But his Renown keyword expires.

If anyone can cite a specific rule to better answer the OP's question (and support both replies provided so far), I'm all ears!






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Cameron McKenzie
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Losing renown does not cause the character to lose any power on them. In fact, the characters don't have to have renown to gain power in the first place (it's just the easiest way to do it).
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Barry Miller
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MasterDinadan wrote:
Losing renown does not cause the character to lose any power on them.

Yeah, while this is intuitively obvious and is the way we all [would] play, I nonetheless couldn't find a rule to support this specific statement.

While I agree that this statement doesn't need a specific rule due to its intuitive nature (though FFG's rules can be pretty specific!), I always appreciate it when a rules answer is supported with a rules reference and so thusly I always try to provide one when I'm providing an answer

Thx!

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Ian
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Wow, that would make several cards more powerful if they could wipe Power tokens by removing the Renown keyword! Catelyn Stark for one, but even more so the plot card Fortified Position!
 
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Barry Miller
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defensiveian wrote:
Wow, that would make several cards more powerful if they could wipe Power tokens by removing the Renown keyword! Catelyn Stark for one, but even more so the plot card Fortified Position!

Keep in mind that I'm not saying this is the case. I just couldn't find a specific rule wrt what happens when a non-printed keyword is removed from a character.

I.e. do the gains/losses enabled by that [non-printed] keyword remain in play only while that keyword is in effect? Or are the gains/losses permanent regardless of the state of the keyword (and as long as the character remains in play)?

While I couldn't find a rule discussing this, I agree that intuitively, in the OP's example, the gains would be permanent. So if Lightbringer is removed from play Stannis gets to keep any Power earned by it. But again while an intuitive assumption, I had nothing to back it up.


Though I'm sure, given FFG's meticulous nature in writing their LCG rules, that there is something in the RR - I just couldn't find it!
.

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James Ludlow
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Renown is one method of adding power to a character. Renown is not a prerequisite for having power on a character.

Removing renown does nothing to the power on that character.
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Barry Miller
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Thanks to James' post above, I've taken a different approach to addressing my "can't find it in the rules" dilemma. Using his words, I took a fresh look at the definition of Renown on pg 18, which is clear as James says, that each participating character with the Renown keyword may gain 1 power.

Then you go to the definition for, "Gains" on pg 9, where it says, "If a player gains Power for a card under his or her control, the player takes [power] and adds it to the card."

The key thing here is that there is no rule to the contrary. I.e., there is no rule written that instructs a player to remove, or how to remove, power once gained (except written elsewhere for when losing a Power claim).

So as I also asserted in a different thread, as there's no rule to the contrary, then it must be inferred/implied that he power stays on the card.

Thanks James, for clearing my head! Not easy to do BTW, as it's full of clutter.

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James Ludlow
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bgm1961 wrote:
I.e., there is no rule written that instructs a player to remove, or how to remove, power once gained (except written elsewhere for when losing a Power claim).


Nearly true.

Rules Reference Page 12 wrote:
Leaves Play
The phrase “leaves play” refers to any time a card
makes a transition from an in play state to an out of
play state.

If a card leaves play, the following consequences occur
simultaneously with the card leaving play:

* All tokens on the card are returned to the treasury.

* All duplicates on the card are discarded.

* All attachments that are on the card are returned
to their owners’ hands.

* All lasting effects and/or delayed effects affecting
the card while it is in play expire for that card.
 
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Barry Miller
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My bad. I assumed it goes without saying that when a card leaves play, any power on it goes too. That's clear in the rules in several places. And as the subject of that sentence which you quoted was a card which remains in play while losing it's non-printed keyword ability, I didn't think of mentioning it. Though I should have just to ne clear.

Thx


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