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Subject: First Burger/Pizza Produced : Milestone rss

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K K
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Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?
 
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Karan R
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That's right afaik
You want to hold off and pair that with a first waitress played or first training if possible
Else wait for 2 waitress incomes
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K K
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Seems like a funny game design. Perhaps the game designer should have given $10 starting money to each player. It would close the gap on collecting milestones.
 
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Nikolas Co
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nikezz wrote:
Seems like a funny game design. Perhaps the game designer should have given $10 starting money to each player. It would close the gap on collecting milestones.
The only "gap" I can see is that some milestones are only desirable later, which doesn't seem like a problem in and of itself. It's also worth considering when to deny opponents milestones. For example, with a single trainee you can potentially deny both free cooks to opponents who might otherwise make good use of them. Of course, you also need to consider what you could be doing instead.

The first few rounds of FCM are things that would be done during setup in many games, but there are meaningful choices to be made.
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Bernhard Vierthaler
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And don´t forget the fridge for the first player who throws away food...
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Andi Hub
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nikezz wrote:
Seems like a funny game design. Perhaps the game designer should have given $10 starting money to each player. It would close the gap on collecting milestones.

What gap are you talking about? Why should you start with a kitchen trainee? There is no demand in the second round. If you want to get the fridge, use a errand boy instead.
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Jason Reid
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nikezz wrote:
Seems like a funny game design. Perhaps the game designer should have given $10 starting money to each player.


I'm sure they tested that.
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Thibaut Palfer-Sollier
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Not all milestones are meant to be grabbed on the first turn, even those that look like they should be grabbed early.
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Brian
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nikezz wrote:
Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?


I think generally everyone understands, but you do not lose the milestone, you lose the cook that the milestone provides. You still have the milestone (which admittedly has no inherent benefit left).
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Jennifer Schlickbernd
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nikezz wrote:
Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?


Where does it say you can lose milestones? I'm really confused about this.
 
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Mike Geller
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jschlickbernd wrote:
nikezz wrote:
Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?


Where does it say you can lose milestones? I'm really confused about this.


You can't have any money on the second turn, so you have to fire the cook.



Edit: you can have money if you first hired a waitress, but the question supposes you first hired a Kitchen Trainee
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Mindy Basi
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You would have to have two waitresses out in your tableau to afford the Pizza Cook (you need $5 for salaries unless you have a salary reduction card, which you won't on the second turn, waitress pays $3). You do not lose milestones.

It's a difficult game.
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mfl134
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Kwill2 wrote:
You would have to have two waitresses out in your tableau to afford the Pizza Cook (you need $5 for salaries unless you have a salary reduction card, which you won't on the second turn, waitress pays $3). You do not lose milestones.

It's a difficult game.


separately, what is the thematic reason that Waitress = money for you?
 
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Alessandro Cingolani
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mfl134 wrote:
separately, what is the thematic reason that Waitress = money for you?


You're a greedy CEO, you steal their tips.
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Alessandro Cingolani
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Kwill2 wrote:
You would have to have two waitresses out in your tableau to afford the Pizza Cook (you need $5 for salaries unless you have a salary reduction card, which you won't on the second turn, waitress pays $3). You do not lose milestones.

It's a difficult game.


Unless you're the first to hire a waitress, in which case you'll need only one of them to pay a single salary.
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mfl134
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Galandil wrote:
mfl134 wrote:
separately, what is the thematic reason that Waitress = money for you?


You're a greedy CEO, you steal their tips.


before you start producing food?
 
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Thibaut Palfer-Sollier
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They are THAT good-looking.
I see the no food/drink selling waitresses as just small restaurants selling too low to be represented in the game but still selling some food or drinks.
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Alessandro Cingolani
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mfl134 wrote:
before you start producing food?


What they do before producing and selling food/drinks it's under a strict "don't ask, don't tell" policy.
 
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Dave Eisen
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jschlickbernd wrote:
nikezz wrote:
Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?


Where does it say you can lose milestones? I'm really confused about this.


You cannot lose milestones. But the benefit this one provides, the burger cook or the pizza cook, can be lost and would be lost in the example being discussed. Saying the milestone is being lost is perhaps sloppy use of language, but does more or less describe the impact.
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mfl134
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NotJeff wrote:
nikezz wrote:
Hi,
For the 2 milestones,
"First burger/pizza produced, +1 burger/pizza cook"

If you took a Kitchen Trainee on the first turn, and you produced a burger/pizza on the second turn, do you lose the +1 burger/pizza cook milestone due to salary payment? You should have $0 on the second turn.

I was wondering if the above rule interpretation was correct, as that would eliminate 2 strategic options at the beginning?


I think generally everyone understands, but you do not lose the milestone, you lose the cook that the milestone provides. You still have the milestone (which admittedly has no inherent benefit left).
 
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Simon Goodwin
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In our first game, with 3 players, two of us went straight for the Kitchen Trainee while the other went for marketing.

We immediately produced a burger to throw away as we were very keen to get the freezer, not caring that we'd have to fire the bonus cook.

For the rest of the game it really helped us to be able to store up to 10 food/drink items each round while the other player had to throw away surplus.

Although he got underway with marketing a little earlier, our ability to meet the demands for multiple food items from single households using our freezer stores meant his marketing helped us more than him - he couldn't produce enough to satisfy demand so we got his customers instead, even from the other side of town.

So for us in that game at least, immediately going for the Kitchen Trainee led to success despite losing the bonus cook from the milestone.
 
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Thibaut Palfer-Sollier
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If you want the fridge, the Errand Boy looks to be a better way to get it as the associated milestone is useful in this context.
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mfl134
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2bit wrote:
In our first game, with 3 players, two of us went straight for the Kitchen Trainee while the other went for marketing.

We immediately produced a burger to throw away as we were very keen to get the freezer, not caring that we'd have to fire the bonus cook.

For the rest of the game it really helped us to be able to store up to 10 food/drink items each round while the other player had to throw away surplus.

Although he got underway with marketing a little earlier, our ability to meet the demands for multiple food items from single households using our freezer stores meant his marketing helped us more than him - he couldn't produce enough to satisfy demand so we got his customers instead, even from the other side of town.

So for us in that game at least, immediately going for the Kitchen Trainee led to success despite losing the bonus cook from the milestone.


also, it sounds like you are saying it worked because somebody was doing your advertising for you. Seems like doing lots of marketing while others have lots of food is a mistake.
 
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Simon Goodwin
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mfl134 wrote:
2bit wrote:
In our first game, with 3 players, two of us went straight for the Kitchen Trainee while the other went for marketing.

We immediately produced a burger to throw away as we were very keen to get the freezer, not caring that we'd have to fire the bonus cook.

For the rest of the game it really helped us to be able to store up to 10 food/drink items each round while the other player had to throw away surplus.

Although he got underway with marketing a little earlier, our ability to meet the demands for multiple food items from single households using our freezer stores meant his marketing helped us more than him - he couldn't produce enough to satisfy demand so we got his customers instead, even from the other side of town.

So for us in that game at least, immediately going for the Kitchen Trainee led to success despite losing the bonus cook from the milestone.


also, it sounds like you are saying it worked because somebody was doing your advertising for you. Seems like doing lots of marketing while others have lots of food is a mistake.


Absolutely! But it was our first game and mistakes were made

His problem with the marketing was that while we obtained the freezer milestone he obtained the First Billboard Placed milestone, so he paid no salaries for marketeers and gained eternal marketing. That seemed like a good thing.

But once he had placed eternal marketing tiles on the board he couldn't remove them - they remain on the board forever - so they were permanently helping his opponents with freezers!
 
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Pieter
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Galandil wrote:
mfl134 wrote:
before you start producing food?


What they do before producing and selling food/drinks it's under a strict "don't ask, don't tell" policy.

Reminds me of a story that a friend of mine once told me: she went into a coffee shop and asked for a cup of coffee -- and they laughed in her face because of course they did not sell coffee...
 
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