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Subject: Neat video posted (Watch It Played) rss

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Enon Sci
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This is posted in the video section, but I wanted to call attention to it.

It's probably the most indepth video we've had, so enjoy.

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Kain
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Really feels like everyone should be hiring Rodney to explain their game. Kind of hate him, he always sells me on almost everything he demos
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Robin Vermeersch
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So close, yet still so far away...

Can't wait!!
 
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Ryan Cullen
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I was really excited to see this come out. Now that I've seen a game play, and the price being $63 CAD plus tax, I'm extremely underwhelmed. I don't see how this game components and gameplay justify the price tag of $65 CAD + tax. I mean come on, dice that you put stickers on? I could understand keeping quality low to have a more competitive price on the game, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

Some people won't care because they only intend on playing the game a handful of times before trading it away, but I buy games with the intent of keeping them for a long time and I don't see how these components will last before the stickers start peeling or the combat tokens get all banged up and tearing.

Don't mean to be a Negative Nancy here, just disappointed and guess I'll have to resume my search for a 2nd edition with some expansions. soblue
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MoppyD wrote:
I would probably make clay runes for the castable tokens. This sounds like a fun hobby project. The cardboard chits themselves should last YEARS. Even so, you can get likely spares for less than what Runebound 2 would cost.

It's not like you can't reprint dice stickers (assuming they are stickers and not printed).
Yeah, I was initially worried about the combat tokens & dice stickers. I believe someone did confirm they are stickers in the release version?.

But as I understand it, neither of those components contain any hidden information? (not entirely clear how you earn the tokens... is any of that randomised?) And I think the combat tokens even have little icons showing what's on the reverse side.

So I agree, there is no reason you can't substitute home-made components for both dice & tokens, if they ever wear out - certainly a reason to make a record of what's on both sides of all the tokens

Still, I am just as dissapointed the dice use stickers. Makes me wonder if there might ever be a revised version with better dice. And I recall someone (half-jokingly I guess) saying they wouldn't be surprised if "premium dice" became available.
 
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Ryan Cullen
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MoppyD wrote:

If you have issues with the gameplay and price, why do you want Runebound 2's similar gameplay at a higher price?
Where did you get that I have a problem with gameplay? I don't have a problem with the game, I have a problem with the quality.
MoppyD wrote:

Even if you buy Runebound 2 cheap at a house clearance sale, you have to value it at the sale price. By keeping the game you lost the $300 you could have sold it for, therefore you choose the game instead of $300, therefore you paid $300 for it.
Where do you get that a copy of Runebound 2e is $300? There are plenty in the marketplace for $50-$75 and some come with expansions. I don't think you can look at the most expensive copy available on Ebay and say that is the going rate.

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Christopher Senn
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Dorrax wrote:
I was really excited to see this come out. Now that I've seen a game play, and the price being $63 CAD plus tax, I'm extremely underwhelmed. I don't see how this game components and gameplay justify the price tag of $65 CAD + tax. I mean come on, dice that you put stickers on? I could understand keeping quality low to have a more competitive price on the game, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

Some people won't care because they only intend on playing the game a handful of times before trading it away, but I buy games with the intent of keeping them for a long time and I don't see how these components will last before the stickers start peeling or the combat tokens get all banged up and tearing.

Don't mean to be a Negative Nancy here, just disappointed and guess I'll have to resume my search for a 2nd edition with some expansions. soblue
Have you played 2E? Why would you rather go hunting for a used 2nd Ed version as opposed to a more fine tuned brand new 3rd edition with better rules for making players interact and give them more options to play with.

The new minis are way better in 3rd than the 2Ed if you are worried about justifying cost. I agree the stickers are a horrible choice. But I dont mind since the overall quality of everything else seems better
 
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Thomas King
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Grove123 wrote:
Why would you rather go hunting for a used 2nd Ed version as opposed to a more fine tuned brand new 3rd?
To be fair, it's not really a fine tuning, it's basically a new game.
 
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Enon Sci
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Montag451 wrote:
Grove123 wrote:
Why would you rather go hunting for a used 2nd Ed version as opposed to a more fine tuned brand new 3rd?
To be fair, it's not really a fine tuning, it's basically a new game.
No, it really isn't.

The map is virtually the same.

The basic gameplay (moving across said map to activate gems and visit cities) is virtually the same.

The movement system is a fine tuning (virtually the same, but tweaked).

The combat is new -- I will give you that. Combat isn't the only definition of game play.

The objective of the two included scenarios play out like base 2e (kill the big bad).

The emphasis on item and gem acquisition seem the same.

Honestly, if they had called it anything else besides Runebound 3e we'd all be calling fowl at the similarities to Runebound as we knew it.

True, there is a lot that wasn't in 2e (baked in timer, narrative twists associated with said timer, non-combat scenarios, pick-up and deliver missions, surges, etc), but I can certainly see Runebound 2e underneath the added chrome.

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Thomas King
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Anarchosyn wrote:
Montag451 wrote:
Grove123 wrote:
Why would you rather go hunting for a used 2nd Ed version as opposed to a more fine tuned brand new 3rd?
To be fair, it's not really a fine tuning, it's basically a new game.
No, it really isn't.

The map is virtually the same.
New locations (strongholds, towns, shrines), fewer terrain types, and overall smaller scope that removes several cities.

Anarchosyn wrote:
The basic gameplay (moving across said map to activate gems and visit cities) is virtually the same.
Moving around on a map to go on adventures is the basic design of every adventure game. But in 2nd, each gem was a random card from a deck of level specific cards. 3rd has 3 types of adventure decks, all of one level.


You're also leaving out the new exploration mechanic for questing, the new attribute test mechanic, the time track, unique scenario deck, removal of allies, the overhaul of leveling up, removal of the 2d10 that were used for most things in 2nd. The only real mechanism from 2nd that's in 3rd is movement, which has been tweaked quite a bit with new rules and fewer terrain types.

edit: Ah, you edited in more of the changes.

And I disagree that if they called it something else, we'd be calling fowl. We've seen it many times before. "Oh, they recycled this mechanic from a previous game." Even the new Warhammer Quest card game has distinct similarities with the Space Hulk and LotR card game, but I don't recall anyone crying fowl "hey, you just copied these games!"
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James Ludlow
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Around 10:20 the FFG rep says that he has an ability that he can use once per combat round. He does so, and then says that he could do it again if he wanted to. What am I missing?

 
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Montag451 wrote:

New locations (strongholds, towns, shrines), fewer terrain types, and overall smaller scope that removes several cities.
I'm just saying you're being a touch hyperbolic if you can't admit to seeing the similarities outweigh the differences in this experience. The moment to moment play, outside of combat, seems very similar. It isn't like switching to Runewars, or even Talisman -- those are distinctly different experiences. This game seems very much in the mold of the originals versions.


Montag451 wrote:

The only real mechanism from 2nd that's in 3rd is movement, which has been tweaked quite a bit with new rules and fewer terrain types.

Depends on what you want to call a mechanism. The general thrust of play is exactly the same -- go out and encounter gems to attain power to defeat, via combat, the big bad at the end before anybody else at the table. That, much more so than any specific mechanism involving combat, is the heart of what makes Runebound the game we know. Does that sound like Talisman too? Yes, it does, but what makes Runebound distinct is the non-linear nature of map travel, which is retained in this version too.

Is it changed greatly? Yes. Is it unrecognizable as Runebound? No, that would be hyperbole.
 
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Thomas King
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Again, you're confusing similarities of game design with similarities in theme. Most of these similarities are shared between all adventure games, not just the Runebound series.
 
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I've had my sticker'd Runebound dice from 2nd ed. for over 10 years.
It's one of the most-played games in my collection.

The dice stickers and counters show zero wear. None. Nada. Zip.

My 2nd. edition copy has been played hundreds of times and it still looks like new. I don't see what the problem everyone seems to suddenly have with the 'quality' of the dice just because they have stickers.

I have screen printed dice which have rubbed off almost completely within a year of steady use. Since RB's dice are full colour, this would have been the only option.

I'll take stickers over screen printed dice any day.

Why is everyone so worried about the dice stickers wearing out?
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Ghool wrote:

Why is everyone so worried about the dice stickers wearing out?
I really don't know. As some one who grew up with stickers and loved sticking them everywhere, I can attest to their remarkable durability and refusal to come off the side of dressers. Stickers stick, and they tend to stick pretty damn well.
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Montag451 wrote:
Again, you're confusing similarities of game design with similarities in theme. Most of these similarities are shared between all adventure games, not just the Runebound series.
So you can't recognize Runebound in this design? Why do you see it as a complimentary to intellect (anybody's intellect) to stress an inability to see elements of similarity?

That aside, you speak in generalities. If you probed your last statement a bit, you would see it wasn't true. Talism isn't non-linear in the same fashion (movement, of course). Prophecy is similarly restrictive, though a step closer to Runebound's nonlinearity. Etc.
 
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Looks like downtime may have, if anything, increased, due to the more intense combat system.

I like the addition of more narrative but wonder if it would be worth playing with more than 2.
 
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mydnight wrote:
Looks like downtime may have, if anything, increased, due to the more intense combat system.

I like the addition of more narrative but wonder if it would be worth playing with more than 2.
I won't play 2E with any more than 2. I would consider playing 3E with 3 players though. While downtime may be slightly longer, it appears as though you'll be more involved in other player's turns, either by casting tokens or just seeing how the combat plays out.
 
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Ken Marley
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Well combat might be longer, there will be fewer combats, so you will spend less time overall in combat.
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Thomas King
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Anarchosyn wrote:
Montag451 wrote:
Again, you're confusing similarities of game design with similarities in theme. Most of these similarities are shared between all adventure games, not just the Runebound series.
So you can't recognize Runebound in this design? Why do you see it as a complimentary to intellect (anybody's intellect) to stress an inability to see elements of similarity?

That aside, you speak in generalities. If you probed your last statement a bit, you would see it wasn't true. Talism isn't non-linear in the same fashion (movement, of course). Prophecy is similarly restrictive, though a step closer to Runebound's nonlinearity. Etc.
I think you need to play more adventure games.
 
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I think you need to stop speaking in generalities.

See, speaking in generalities is the last vestige of security for a position that knows scrutiny will destabilize it.

I've cited specific games in my comparative analysis, you haven't.

.. Anyhoo, you can pat yourself on the back for not being able to see the similarities in design all you want. It doesn't change the fact this game is called Runebound, and it is the successor to 2nd E.

This chat between us is beginning to bore.

p.s. Let me reiterate: being blind to similarity with regards to disparate items is not a virtue, but a limitation of imagination.
 
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Anarchosyn wrote:
This chat between us is beginning to bore.
Beginning?
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Thomas King
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Anarchosyn wrote:
I think you need to stop speaking in generalities.

See, speaking in generalities is the last vestige of security for a position that knows scrutiny will destabilize it.

I've cited specific games in my comparative analysis, you haven't.

.. Anyhoo, you can pat yourself on the back for not being able to see the similarities in design all you want. It doesn't change the fact this game is called Runebound, and it is the successor to 2nd E.

This chat between us is beginning to bore.

p.s. Let me reiterate: being blind to similarity with regards to disparate items is not a virtue, but a limitation of imagination.
You take things way too personally. I've seen you especially get pretty heated in multiple Runebound topics now. You really need to keep a cooler head and chill out.

Also, if you want more adventure games, try Mage Knight (explore freely on a hex grid, fight enemies, improve your hero), or Shadows of Malice (explore freely on a hex grid, fight enemies, improve your hero). There's also one of the original classics, Magic Realm (explore freely, etc.). Comparing Talisman to other adventure games is kind of like comparing Monopoly to economic Euros.
 
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Perhaps. Or perhaps you phrase things in a rude manner. Food for thought.

 
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David desJardins
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Can't it be both?
 
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