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Subject: Tear Penalties rss

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SC
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Hey everyone,

The tear penalties are -1/-3 and -6. I initially thought that was just a penalty for the end of the game, but when scoring a trip it says to do that and any penalties immediately.

Does this mean tears should be scored immediately throughout the game? And if so does that mean I move only the difference between the penalties or the actual penalty? So -1/-2/-3 to make a maximum of -6, or the full amount each time making a maximum of -10?

Thanks!

S.
 
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Brendan Riley
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I think they get added to the score track as -1, -2, -3. The rule book says "One tear will give you a '-1.' Two Tears will give you a '-3.'..." If it were meant to accumulate, I'd think it would say "Two Tears will give you a '-1' and a '-3.'"

The scoring track is a convenience for the game, but the setup allows you to score everything at the end.
 
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Nathan Morse
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Dragonsrule wrote:
when scoring a trip it says to do that and any penalties immediately.
I think we are seeing an inconsistency not corrected when the rules evolved. Launch a Time Machine says that you take a token, and place it in your penalty area. (They score at the end of the game… unless you wink yourself out of existence by getting more than three, of course.) Then at the end of that very same section, it says quite clearly, twice, that you subtract any penalties. Because everything else in the rules counts only core points for trips immediately, and all bonuses and penalties at the end, I'm guessing this is a remnant of a prior version. I never even noticed it (I guess I automatically gloss over a wee paragraph that explains how to use a scoreboard ), and had to scour the rules several times after your post just to find it (right before Ending the 1st and 2nd Day for anyone who's looking). So, I bet that contradictory bit is an accidental leftover.

wombat929 wrote:
The scoring track is a convenience for the game, but the setup allows you to score everything at the end.
…except that the 2nd and 3rd iterations of the day start with the player who has the lowest score, so you need to know the current score. Yes, you can calculate it by adding up the trip scores where people have time machines, ignoring all bonuses and penalties (assuming all that business I typed above is correct).
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Andrew Watson
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zefquaavius wrote:
I think we are seeing an inconsistency not corrected when the rules evolved.
I agree. I was confused for a while about when to adjust scores. There are some references to scoring at game end (e.g., 2nd para of Ending the 1st and 2nd Day section).

I now score as I think is intended and best: as soon as anything affects the score. When I launch a time machine, I adjust my score, including any bonuses and penalties. There is no end game scoring (although there may be end of 3rd Day Ad penalties).

I score the Tear penalties as follows:
-1 for the first Tear
-2 for the second (so that the two Tears together inflict -3, as in rules)
-3 for the third (so that the three Tears together inflict -6, as in rules)
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Daniel Rocchi
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I have to admit, I was confused about this too, because of the rules telling two contradictory things. I also agree that WHEN you subtract those points matter, because of determining turn order.

I think I read that the scoretrack was added at a later iteration of the game, to allow players to better assess everyone's relative position in VP. So on the one hand, while I think it is much easier to just score for trips and subtract penalties at the end, keeping track of all penalties as they occur gives a truer representation of who is in last place and would benefit most by going first in the turn order. It also seems to be in keeping with the original intention.
 
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SC
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Thanks everyone, I am glad it isn't just me that was confused by all this.

Ok I will go with the consensus and score everything immediately and use -1/-2 and -3 for the tears.

I'm looking forward to getting this to the table tonight.
 
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Mr. Octavius
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Microbadge: So Very Wrong About Games fanMicrobadge: 'When playing a game, the goal is to win, but it is the goal that is important, not the winning' - Dr. Reiner Knizia
Is there any way to get rid of tears? I know office work can get rid of waste, so it may make more sense to score all penalties at the end of the game so you don't have to worry about someone forgetting to gain a point on the track when they lose a penalty. If there is a way to lose tears that just adds an extra opportunity for confusion as the value changes based on how many the have.
 
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Brendan Riley
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I don't know all the anomaly cards yet, but the main rules don't have any way to get rid of tears.

Does anyone else keep reading the word tears as sad eye water rather than rips? Maybe it's just me.

Also, I am proud of the phrase 'sad eye water.'
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Andrew Watson
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wombat929 wrote:
I am proud of the phrase 'sad eye water.'
And rightly so. Have a thumb; I'll try to avoid your eye!
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Jordan Booth
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wombat929 wrote:

Does anyone else keep reading the word tears as sad eye water rather than rips?
Yup, every time since I first read the rules.

The future trip "Develop Full Artificial Intelligence" allows you to return a single tear at the end of the game. (Good luck getting it back in your eye.)
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Mark Halsey
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I totally read this as:

1st Tear = -1pt
2nd Tear = -3pts
3rd Tear = -6pts

I've seen this same iconography on other games and that's exactly how it's handled. It think it's more confusing to say that they don't mean this. I see that the rules read "Two Tears will give you a '-3' but I think that's inconsistent with the tile.

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