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Super Dungeon Explore: Forgotten King» Forums » General

Subject: 7 Days left for Legends, should I be a backer? rss

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Jonahdel
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Hi all!

I'm a relatively new board gamer and so are my friends. Basically, about a year ago we just went in one FLGS around our area out of curiosity and came out with Pandemic.

For the most part, I take on the 'burden' of funding for games so I can have a collection and we can avoid friendships being broken.

Anyway, what we'd like to know is: Is it a good idea to back the current KS for Super Dungeon Explore: Legends given the following:

1. We pre-ordered Kingdom Death: Monster, and are about 700 CAD invested already.
2. We backed Gloom haven at the highest pledge (100 USD?).
3. We are currently running Descent 2.0 (no expansions as of yet).

We recently saw this kickstarter and found the lighthearted chibiness approach something our/my collection lacks and really would like to back, most likely at the Legendary level. If however, our games and awaited games can cover most of what Chibi Dungeon Explore can offer, I would like to save some money instead to buy gifts in the coming holiday season

Thank you for your objective responses!
 
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Sebastian Beck
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I was part of the KS campaign of Forgotten King and the game was sold after the first play because it felt very flat in comparison to other games for us.

We do not like Descent 2.0 at all. We do like Imperial Assault, Galaxy Defenders, Shadows of Brimstone etc.

But Forgotten King lacked according to atmosphere, tactics and....fun.

So I would say - because you own Kingdom Death and Gloomhaven - pass on it!
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Bors
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You could take a look at the Sword and Sorcery KS that is going on right now. The company made previously mentioned Galaxy Defenders and it looks to be a decent fantasy coop. Or if you looking for something a little bit on the liter side you could wait for Arcadia Quest: Inferno.
 
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Nicholas Kelsch
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AQ is a fantastic group game... TFK rules are too troublesome for people not 'sold' on it and there has not been enough details if the legends or adventures solves any of these issues.

Besides, no exclusives, not a huge MSRP discount, you can always get it later at retail.
 
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Jonahdel
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nkelsch wrote:
AQ is a fantastic group game... TFK rules are too troublesome for people not 'sold' on it and there has not been enough details if the legends or adventures solves any of these issues.

Besides, no exclusives, not a huge MSRP discount, you can always get it later at retail.
Looks like I won't be missing anything then.

Thanks guys!
 
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Daniel Theuerkaufer
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Friendships broken? Why would that happen?
 
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Jonah Rees
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Xairen wrote:
nkelsch wrote:
AQ is a fantastic group game... TFK rules are too troublesome for people not 'sold' on it and there has not been enough details if the legends or adventures solves any of these issues.

Besides, no exclusives, not a huge MSRP discount, you can always get it later at retail.
Looks like I won't be missing anything then.

Thanks guys!
You will be missing a significant discount though. My $150 spend from the last KS is probably worth $300+ at retail so depends whether you'd like to take the risk on whether you'll like the game and get a load of freebies. I do think the freebies are a little less impressive this time (a lot of alt gender characters which are nice but not necessary (and personally I would have just put in the new SDE box anyway) and pets which aren't used in the game that much) but it still makes significant savings. If you think that you will like the game and can afford to pledge on the KS for something you won't get for over a year then I would do so because at worst you would break even selling it on once it's arrived if you read reviews and decide it's not for you.
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Kevin Outlaw
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jonahmaul wrote:
Xairen wrote:
nkelsch wrote:
AQ is a fantastic group game... TFK rules are too troublesome for people not 'sold' on it and there has not been enough details if the legends or adventures solves any of these issues.

Besides, no exclusives, not a huge MSRP discount, you can always get it later at retail.
Looks like I won't be missing anything then.

Thanks guys!
You will be missing a significant discount though. My $150 spend from the last KS is probably worth $300+ at retail so depends whether you'd like to take the risk on whether you'll like the game and get a load of freebies. I do think the freebies are a little less impressive this time (a lot of alt gender characters which are nice but not necessary (and personally I would have just put in the new SDE box anyway) and pets which aren't used in the game that much) but it still makes significant savings. If you think that you will like the game and can afford to pledge on the KS for something you won't get for over a year then I would do so because at worst you would break even selling it on once it's arrived if you read reviews and decide it's not for you.

I love SDE, but I have started to waver on whether or not to back this campaign - mainly because the stretch goals aren't doing it for me, and I am not sure I care about Legends.

The problem is, I love the miniatures, but I am more into playing the game rather than just painting, and nobody I play with cares if their character is male or female. That means I don't really see any value in alt-gender characters or duplicates of models that are already in the pledge.

The pins are nice, but again, not really something I am going to worry about not having, and I have never seen a pet used in a game yet, so I don't see the point in having a dozen more. Legends might be the best thing since chips, but we don't really know how it plays, and I am not really into campaign play at the moment because it is so difficult to find enough time when there are so many great games we like to cycle through. That means I am not sure there is any reason for me to worry about the NPC characters either.

The painting guide is of no interest to me (I'm not painting my set).

Finally, while I love all the creatures and heroes in SDE, I really wanted to focus on getting all the haunted house stuff - tiles, Von Drak, Stilt town zombies, Beatrix, Jack Scarecrow - so I am wondering if I am better off buying those things piecemeal, over time, rather than buying a big wedge of stuff now that is not necessarily the stuff I would have chosen to buy first.

Long story short, at the moment I am really only interested in the 2.0 base set, the level pack, the three new mini-bosses, and the three new heroes.

In my head, I know that buying those things separately here in the UK will cost more than $150, but at the same time... Maybe I just want to put that money into haunted house stuff, after all.

None of which really answers the OP... Should you back? I think SDE is a really cool game. It's fun, surprisingly "thinky," and it obviously has a wonderful aesthetic. I really enjoy it, but there are plenty of people who think it's terrible.

However, as an introduction to the game, I am not sure this campaign is the way to go... Yet.

Maybe a stretch goal for more tiles will turn up.
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Jonahdel
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Styfen wrote:

I hope that's a joke or oversimplification of the truth, because if friendships would get broken because they have to share the burden of purchasing games I'd be in the market for new friends.

With what you've already backed I'd say you want to wait and see on SDE: Legends and review it after more information is released, however I will note that Descent 2.0 is awful when compared to the other three games you've mentioned here.

It's a joke in the same category as "Diplomacy destroys friendships!"

In any case, there doesnt seem to be a clear answer if the game will be worth my $150.

There are people who plainly do not like it.
There are people who are all for it.
And then, there are people who loved it but lost it over time.

The aesthetics are definitely unique but the gameplay, which is where a lot of people are divided, is what holds me back.

As for Descent 2.0, can you tell me why it's awful when compared to the other ones I listed? It's the first dungeon crawler that we have and was recommended by one of my coworkers
 
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Jonah Rees
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Xairen wrote:
In any case, there doesnt seem to be a clear answer if the game will be worth my $150.

There are people who plainly do not like it.
There are people who are all for it.
And then, there are people who loved it but lost it over time
Unfortunately there isn't going to be a clear answer! You are going to fall into one of the three categories that you list but you're only going to know that once you've played it. I fall into the middle category in that I'm all for it. That doesn't mean that there aren't some issues with it which have been highlighted but I can overlook those because it is fun and it does well enough what I want it to. I would advise checking out some reviews/unboxing/watch it plays of Forgotten King to get a more overall view of the game and then you can form your own opinion.

I would reiterate that if you can afford the $150 now then go for it because if you end up buying it all later it'll cost you a lot more so you may as well save some money now and if you don't like it then you'll be able too re-coup that money pretty easily. If your budget is stretched and you have other places where you think you might want your money to go (it is Christmas around the corner after all) then I would wait and see how it plays once it's released.
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Jonahdel
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keeop5000 wrote:

Descent 2e has seen a lot of tabletime with my group over the years. At one point I'd say it was a table favorite. With that said I'm not sure why it gets called a dungeon crawler. It's a 1-vs-many objective race set on modular components. I suppose with the story and the aesthetics it does give off a D&D-esque vibe but as soon as you realize that as Overlord your whole strategy is "ignore/block heroes and rush to the goal" it sort of loses a bit of it's charm. Imperial Assault replaced apples with oranges but largely delivers the same result. I've enjoyed my time with that game greatly, but in hindsight I wish I had just bought the core with no expansions, played it a few times, and traded it away for something with a little more... something
I see. A little off-topic here but, should I assume that you're recommending that my group run through the campaign 1-2 times and then trade it for a different game later? I mean, I just have the base 2.0 at the moment


jonahmaul wrote:

Unfortunately there isn't going to be a clear answer! You are going to fall into one of the three categories that you list but you're only going to know that once you've played it. I fall into the middle category in that I'm all for it. That doesn't mean that there aren't some issues with it which have been highlighted but I can overlook those because it is fun and it does well enough what I want it to. I would advise checking out some reviews/unboxing/watch it plays of Forgotten King to get a more overall view of the game and then you can form your own opinion.

I would reiterate that if you can afford the $150 now then go for it because if you end up buying it all later it'll cost you a lot more so you may as well save some money now and if you don't like it then you'll be able too re-coup that money pretty easily. If your budget is stretched and you have other places where you think you might want your money to go (it is Christmas around the corner after all) then I would wait and see how it plays once it's released.
I'll do some extensive review & play session research before deciding. There's still a few days. I'm back to "on the fence" instead of "pass", thanks to you! Hahahaha!
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G Rowls
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In regards to the pets very rarely being drawn - legends has corrected this by allowing the character to purchase a pet master skill, so you may start the game with a pet.
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Chris Lawson
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growlley wrote:
In regards to the pets very rarely being drawn - legends has corrected this by allowing the character to purchase a pet master skill, so you may start the game with a pet.
Where did you pick this up from?
 
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Chozo Tull
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^ this was mentioned in the KS comments by SPM people
 
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Cat O\'Mighty
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Xairen wrote:

There are people who plainly do not like it.
There are people who are all for it.
And then, there are people who loved it but lost it over time.

The aesthetics are definitely unique but the gameplay, which is where a lot of people are divided, is what holds me back.
I'm in the camp of:
People who like it enough, but still would be very happy with more streamlined polishing than we got with Forgotten King.

The unique aesthetics are what keep me out of the losing it over time category.
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Kevin Outlaw
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growlley wrote:
In regards to the pets very rarely being drawn - legends has corrected this by allowing the character to purchase a pet master skill, so you may start the game with a pet.
Legends has the potential to resolve many of the minor niggles with the game...

More frequent pets, quicker play time, alternative objectives, more exploration.

It could be amazing. I just wish there was more of it to see right now, rather than putting down money and hoping. Hopefully, there will be more than enough value to justify Kickstarting, even if Legends isn't great, but for me it isn't quite there yet...
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Chozo Tull
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I think we are going to be disappointed at first in the Legends ruleset, but the fact that there will be an open beta (as bad as it sounds for a board game) actually gives me hope considering that the SDE community is extremely dedicated (just look at the lootimeter thread on the spm forum).

So hopefully we will be able to steer the game into good enough directions ... I'd rather have that than a lukewarm game heavily modded by the community
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Daniel Barrett
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I'm really on the fence about this also. I'm interested in the base game and wouldn't mind some of the additional backer mini's but some of the content seems more aimed at the existing player base.

Most of the digital content seems to be aimed at the players with previous expansions and seems useless for players with just the content from this Kickstarter.
 
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The digital content will be useful to current owners for being able to beta test and give feedback before the tangibles ship.

The digital content will be useful to new backers after the tangibles ship if you backed at least at the Explorer level. That will give you plenty of stuff to play the adventures, and to swap in spawn points and figures that you will have.

If you only want the base game, then no the digital content will not be useful (unless you decide you like the game enough to buy more things later).
 
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Legends doesn't have any miniatures, so you need A base game to play, either TFK or SDE 2nd edition.
But with all the stretch goals from the KS, you could say backers DO get lots of miniatures with Legends.
So the value is there. I'm backing at the Explorer level. If I like the game, I can always get those 2 expansions and perhaps the bosses later at retail. Assuming they'll all be available retail.
 
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Cat O\'Mighty
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Yes, everything will be available at retail eventually. Not all of the items from Forgotten King have made it into retail stock yet, but they have gradually been added.
 
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Cat_O wrote:
Yes, everything will be available at retail eventually. Not all of the items from Forgotten King have made it into retail stock yet, but they have gradually been added.
Whats left?
 
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Daniel Barrett
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I dropped to a $1 and will decide whether or not to back this when the pledge manager comes out.

I can't get past the Starfire mini, it looks like its getting ready to hump a dong shaped rock.



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Jonah Rees
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VaeVictis666 wrote:
Cat_O wrote:
Yes, everything will be available at retail eventually. Not all of the items from Forgotten King have made it into retail stock yet, but they have gradually been added.
Whats left?
In the UK at least the Goro box and Emerald Valley are not available yet (and haven't been). I believe some of the hero boxes have also not become available yet.
 
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Kevin Outlaw
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Well, I ended up caving in and backed. The reveal of the stretch goals up to £1m convinced me that even if Legends was utter dross, I was still going to get my value out of the pledge, despite a lot of stretch goals that I am not particularly interested in.

With the level box, the duplicate monster spawn points, the extra themed mini-bosses, creeps, and a new set of tiles, that's basically a big box game's worth of content.
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