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Subject: Games like A Victory Lost? rss

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Kai Mayer
United States
Minneapolis
Minnesota
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Hi there! I'm relatively new to wargaming, but have been playing A Victory Lost pretty frequently and loving it. Are there any other similar games that you all would recommend?

I would like to note that I'm indifferent about the chit-pull mechanic, and definitely wish the game was shorter (our games tend to last in the 7-9 hour range). What I'm really looking for is another game that has the same blend of simplicity + depth of AVL (being as pretty as AVL wouldn't hurt either!). I've looked at getting A Victory Denied but heard mixed reviews.

Any help would appreciated, thanks!
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Mike Szarka
Canada
Waterloo
Ontario
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When it is your turn to send a VASSAL move, the wait is excruciating. When it's my turn, well, I've been busy.
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Simple but Deep Wargames

Not everyone will agree on every item in this list, but it's a good place to start.
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Kevin Moody
United States
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Bulbous also tapered?
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I think anything will be a bit of a let down after AVL.

However, Adam has done a good job sorting through numerous games of foreign origin for MMP's Special Ops magazine. I'd recommend the games in issues 2,3,4, and 6. (3 will have similar mechanisms to AVL, and is also a very good game).

They're a bargain anywhere, especially here:

http://yhst-12000246778232.stores.yahoo.net/mupuse.html
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Matt Logan
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Peoria
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This thread may be of some use to you. I was looking for a low counter density, low rules complexity, chit-pull game a couple weeks ago.
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Adam Starkweather
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Glad you enjoyed it...you might want to look at A Victory Complete: The Battle of Tannenberg, 1914 in Special Ops. It is the same system.

Sorry you heard bad things about my version of the system but for what it is worth, there are some very avid fans of A Victory Denied: Crisis at Smolensk, July-September, 1941 as well.

We have more coming in the system.

I would also suggest you look at Ukraine '44 in Special Ops. Different system but many fans of AVL really liked that one too. It isn't chit pull but seems similar to me in the type of game. Also good is Bravery in the Sand (also in the MMP mag)...there you get the chit pull too.
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Jon Gautier

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I've never played a game that is as simple mechanically as AVL but was so tense and variable. It's a pretty special game. For the People offers the same tension for me, but it is pretty involved.
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Iain K
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Arvada
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I would second both A Victory Complete: The Battle of Tannenberg, 1914 and Bravery in the Sand. They're affordable, quicker playing than AVL, and yet have depth. See my review of BITS and comments in Tannenburg's comment section.
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Kai Mayer
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Thanks for the replies everyone! I'll definitely be looking into these magazine games, as they're cheap and seem to play fast. I only hesitate because, well, they're magazine games!
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Kevin Moody
United States
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Unlike some...many?...most?...magazine games, these weren't rushed through due to time pressures, or the knowledge they'd be purchased by consumers regardless of play value because of a larger subscription (magazine game sales formula: subject + pretty graphics = sales).

These are all tried-and-true "magazine" games that have been gone over one last time by Adam and the MMP people. You won't be disappointed.
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Some of the games that Kevin mention belong to the "Storm Over" family of games, and I think that's a nice recommendation. The games are fun, low complexity, and generally play quickly too. A few examples:
* Storm Over Stalingrad
* Storm Over Dien Bien Phu
* Storm Over Taierzhuang

Have you played any block games? I'm not sure if they meet your criteria, as they are quite different from AVL... but they are also good entry-level wargames. My favorite is probably still Hammer of the Scots although there are many others available - look for a subject that appeals to you.

MMP has also released the very interesting Warriors of God: The Wars of England & France, 1135-1453 that covers the Hundred Years' War. It mixes area-control into a war game, and provides a strong sense of narrative. (There is also a pretty high amount of randomness though as leaders can unexpectedly kick the bucket at inopportune moments. Some people dislike the game because of that.) The timing is interesting because another game in the same series is very close to being published: Warriors of Japan uses the same base system but has quite a few differences.
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