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Subject: The Holy Lands and other powers within KDM rss

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Sid Rain
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Update: Apparently the King/Scribe/Hand/King's Men aren't a part of the Holy Lands? I had always assumed so, but apparently that can't be substantiated. Not entirely certain about who is higher up between the King and the Scribe. Flavor text seems to suggest the Scribe, but the King seems to be the "face" of the Lantern Festival expansion, so who knows?

Perusing through flavor text for the various models in the KDM shop I started compiling flavor text together for everything there is on the Holy Lands. Of all the factions/groups/powers in the world of KDM, we have the most information about the Holy Lands, although there's still quite a bit not known about it.

Here's a vaguely hierarchical listing of all the entities within the Holy Lands, with flavor text pulled from their entries on shop.kingdomdeath.com where applicable, along with some of the other factions/powers that are known about in Kingdom Death

The Holy Lands

The Golden Entity
The Golden Entity is mentioned again and again, yet we know almost nothing about who or what the Golden Entity actually is. Does it represent the King? The Scribe? Or some other greater power? Sometimes mentioned in the singular as the Golden Entity and sometimes mentioned as the Golden Entities, does it even refer to a single creature or a class of creatures?


Lion Knight 1st
"The first Lion Knight was a failure. Its vision permanently fixed a few moments into the future, it was driven mad living outside of time and deemed too unstable to lead the Golden Entity’s armies. Now imprisoned deep within the Golden Labyrinth, the first Lion Knight stews in its derangement, the heady stench attracting Wailing Smoke from all corners of the abyss. The first Lion Knight spends its lonely days in lively conversation with them."


Lion Knight 2nd
"Three brother generals command the vast armies of the Golden Entities domain. Each imbued with a different temperament and a strong will of their own. The middle brother is the most attached to the human industry and artistry. He cultivates a courtly civilized appearance and graceful swordsmanship, surrounding himself with human thralls allowing them to enjoy their short tragic existence in his awesome presence."

"The Lion Knight is the most human of the Golden Entities [sp?] creations and is forever obsessed with truly understanding man.

Ash, Ryan, and Sam are scholars raised and educated from the Lion Knight's private museums. They share a life of luxury and discovery, often traveling with the Lion Knight on grand art collecting expeditions. Their unique life makes them some of the most knowledgeable women in all of Kingdom Death. Granting them domain over even some White Speaker stories, including the secrets of ageing, giving them eternally healthy and youthful bodies."


Chosen
"The apotheosis of the Entity's bottomless narcissism, the Chosen are created in the Entity's self-image. Its glory made flesh. Imbued with savage beauty matched by their intense vanity. The grinding machinery of the Holy Lands freezes wherever they pass. Through their eyes the Entity casts its self-loving gaze upon the vastness of its creation.
Although they walk the land unchallenged their impetuous rage leave swaths of smoldering ruin in their wake."


Forge God
"The Forge God minds the furnaces of the Holy Lands, a massive creature who's very pores produce the holy steel that the edifices of the Holy Lands are made of. He is consumed by the desire for perfection in his works, the Mothers, Grandmothers and White Knights are his personal masterworks. "


Forge Priest
"The master of the forge of the Holy Lands."


Grand Mothers + Mothers
"Few chosen victims survive the treatment of raw god metal that prepares a womb to withstand and nurture the ghastly cocktail that gives rise to the monsters of the Holy Lands. The truly holy mothers are beatified as Grand Mothers, transformed into creatures embodying the maternal life-giving ideal of the Entity. These special few give birth to the Entity's most precious children, the massive winged Blessed Ones. The Grand Mother's womb is braced heavy ornate gut plates. Within, a hostile furnace of creation churns. She has a mouthed cord growing from her belly that devours male organs of her mates to better the chances of divine conception.

The Grand Mother is a rare, horrifying foe, possessing a master the Other and protected by the watchful eye of the Entity itself."


Wet Nurse
"The Wet Nurse is a single minded monster that serves the Entity of the Holy Lands. It's only purpose is to nourish the creatures born in the Holy Lands with the molten milk it produces. This is the nutrition that carries within it the imperatives and instincts to serve the Entity of the Holy Lands. The monsters birthed by the Mothers and Grand Mothers of the Holy Lands are taken by the Wet Nurses who's milk is the very will of the Entity. Humans taken from their mothers at birth are nursed by the Wet Nurses to create the mindless shambling masses of Holy Landers that live in the Entity's fiefdom."


White Knight
"The glorious White Knights are the military might of the Holy Lands and enforcers of the Golden Entity's capricious whims. Their exquisitely crafted white and gold armor makes no sound as they march through the dark, narrow passages of the Holy City and beyond. What dwells inside the fully-enclosed armor is a mystery. Many speculate they are born from the furnace guts of the Mothers, unfeeling, loyal byproducts of human birth experimentation."

"The glorious White Knights are the military might of the Holy Lands and enforcers of the Golden Entity's capricious whims. What dwells inside the exquisitely crafted armor is a mystery born in the furnace guts of the Mothers. A byproduct of generations of eugenic experimentation transforming the people of the Holy Lands in the service of the Golden Entity.

The White Knight Heavy is the backbone of the military ranks, their enormous weapons bringing up the rear of the Holy Lands' brutal martial forces."


White Lion
"Huge terrifying lions with a strange human curiosity and human hands. Their white fur shines with flecks of gold when the sunlight hits them directly, a strange contrast to their bloated and sad faces. They are a dominant predator in the holy lands and have become a symbol of inspiration and beauty for the entity that resides over all. Occasionally they are trained and kept as partners by Man-Hunters."



The Plain of Faces Maybe linked to the Holy Lands?


The Scribe
"The Scribe is the power behind the Kings and their armies. To men, he is a god made flesh, appearing in repose atop his throne with his tome hoisted by a grotesque tableau of slaves. In his book his words are writ into reality, sewing the seeds of small human settlements into existence with the stroke of his quill. Once the humans grow and reproduce the Scribe will return to harvest his crop."


The King
"The rhythmic scape and clang of the King's Men's march heralds the arrival of the King. The King's ornate carapace is wrapped in shifting robes that hide the ravenous creature within. Everyone in the King's path is consumed without mercy as the King's Men look on from behind their passive, cherub masks."


The Hand
"The Hand are the King's highest ranking guard. They see through the eyes of every Kingsmen that patrols the King's territory. The Hands are highly intelligent and master swordsmen."


King's Man
"The King's Men herald the appearance of powerful entities such as the Scribe and the King. From a distance the strangely fashioned lantern halberds are glowing harbingers of the mountainous King lumbering behind."



The Great City

Great Game Hunters
"The Great Game Hunters hail from a bizarrely flourishing city. Many generations of families have survived astonishingly well, growing complacent and wealthy in the city. Beneath the worldly noble exterior of the city, inhuman forces breed intrigue and family rivalries. These hapless noblemen squabble over resources and knowledge risking their lives in competition for prestige, chasing rumors of ever more dangerous game."

"Great Game Hunters are a character class for Kingdom Death. They come from the largest standing human city. Great Game Hunters venture beyond the safety of the city gates to win fame and fortune on behalf of the bickering noble houses that control the city. Rich with finery and honed weapons, they confidently stride into the unknown, often never to return."

"When a lauded Great Game Hunter house falls to ruin, their loss is compounded by generations of shame. The fallen family is stripped of its heraldry and its lineage is sold into servitude among the remaining houses. The highest patriarch to the lowliest footman are given ignoble roles, as weapon caddies or cannon fodder to maximize their public humiliation."


Great Game Hunter Rogue
"Strong-willed sons and daughters of powerful Great Game Hunter houses sometimes find themselves bored of the intricate courtly intrigues they must entertain. These Rogues will eschew the stuffy machinery of the city, turning their attentions to mastering the wilderness beyond. Armed to the teeth and rich with all the advantages of their houses' resources, they set out to live rough, or as rough as nobleman of fine-breeding and plentiful wealth can live."



The Twilight Order

Twilight Knight
"The Order Knight is a paragon of the Twilight Order. Surviving countless battle with the darkness and within himself, he has powerful control over the relics and the blank slate of his mind remains sound. He bears the most treasured gear of the order."

"The Twilight Knights order once protected the recorded knowledge of humanity in Kingdom Death. Now in shambles, the Twilight Knights, with their archivists, struggle to keep the tiny flame of knowledge alive.

Initiates to the Twilight Knight order are permanently altered to protect their minds from the horrors they use face in their quest. Detached and unfeeling, they are prepared to pay any cost to salvage and protect the valuable records of wisdom that remain in the world."


Twilight Relic Knight
"The Relic Knight has lost control to the personality living inside his relic sword. The relic sword has no consideration for the lost knight's body. He sheds his bulky, restrictive armor, choosing light simple clothes to keep his movement fast and unrestricted. He fights with furious disregard for his corporeal well-being, pushing his muscles to the absolute limits."


Archivist
"Stories lament the fall of the Grand Library in hushed tones. The surviving archivists and their sworn knights fled clutching precious armfuls, all that remains of the knowledge assembled by humanty. Today the Twilight Order is scattered, working in isolated pairs to do and record what little good they can."


Deserter
"The Deserter Knight has experienced trauma so horrible that it destroys the Twilight Order's mind locks that remove the memories and personality of initiates. Suddenly faced with their humanity and unproteced from the horrors they face the Deserter will often flee. Without the careful aid of an Archivist, the Deserter loses control of the relic hood and sword which torture the Deserter. In order to continue wielding the relics, Deserters will often turn their hoods into tattered bandages and chain their swords to their bodies."



White Speakers

White Speakers
"Long ago, the White Speaker cult's savagery threatened the few enclaves of human civilization. The Order of Twilight Knights rose up nearly destroying the cult. Now, small covens of White Speakers can be found meeting in abandoned places, sharing the secrets of their blood magic, passed on from one White Speaker to another through intricate tales, whispered and screamed in frenzied, transcendental rituals."

"There was a settlement of humans so powerful that they defied one of the great entities. In response, the entity drank their only lake and waited for them to turn to dust. Undaunted, the humans grew plants rich in water and survived. The furious entity took up its mantle and invaded, wiping out the humans. It left one man as a warning, cursed with an unslakable thirst.

Desperate to end his suffering, the man took up the sword, mastering it with single-minded focus. Exactly 1000 years to the day, the Prince of the Sword stood triumphant over the dying entity. Drinking its blood quenched his thirst for the first time but did not end his torment. Eternally he wanders drinking the blood of worthy adversaries to momentarily satisfy his thirst.

White Speakers that tell the story of the Prince of Swords seek the taste of blood stains and remnants of gore on ancient weapons. In this way gaining the prowess of their former wielders."



The Abyssal Woods

The Flower Witch
"The Abyssal Woods exists on the precipice of obliteration, its heavy limbs pulled inexorably towards black hole at its center. The Flower Witch flickers through the woods, tending to inscrutable tasks that keep it from swallowing itself. Her seemingly random alterations create wonder and death for foolhardy travelers."


Disciples of the Witch
"A coven of disciples that assist in the care of the Abyssal Woods; clearing trails, calming boiling rivers, balancing bacterial colonies, and most importantly, clearing the clots from the infinity web that encloses the vacuum at the heart of the forest.

The staves of the disciples are topped with a dense mineral, so saturated with colors that it appears black to human eyes. The mineral is the heart of a plant that lives in warm nests deep within a great inverted mountain. The Flower Witch teaches its disciples to use their staves to manipulate plant life cycles, commanding them to grow or wither.

The uniforms of the disciples, their dresses and hats, are spun on the same loom that weaves the goblin's garments. The fabric is a woven parasite, its fibers absorbing the wearer's blood. These vestments enable the disciples to grip the ground with incredible strength allowing them to move freely through the Abyssal Woods even when everything around them is a swirling vortex.

A hole the size of a grain of sand breathes at the center of the Abyssal Woods. Every inhale threatens to devour the forest, an intense vacuum rips roots from the ground and sucks waves of tumbling debris through the air.

Above all else, the Flower Witch teaches the disciples about ego and the beauty of life and death. Cultivating immaculate beauty at the precipice of destruction strengthens the ego needed to wield the Flower Witch’s powers and maintain her knowledge.

Everything that lives in the Abyssal Woods evolves to survive the tantrums of a tiny, unpredictable orifice at its center. Insects with opposable thumbs cling tenaciously to trees, whose roots have become powerful, gnarled hands firmly gripping the ground. Seasoned visitors carry chains and hooks to secure themselves at a moment's notice to the largest things in sight when the winds pick up.

Beyond enabling the disciples to survive the hole of the forest, continued wear of their garments deepens a symbiotic relationship, granting them even greater understanding and power. However, an intense caloric intake is required to keep the fabric fed. This can pose a great challenge for young disciples, who often starve to death or are simply consumed by their hat.

The Sleeping Flower has 13 petals, which is as many disciples as the Flower Witch will ever keep. However, the fifth petal never uncurls, even when the flower is in full bloom. Its contents are a mystery to all but the Flower Witch, who privately muses that it will be the burden of the disciple that succeeds her, inheriting both her mask and her many mistakes."



People of the Sun

Adult Sunstalker
"A rarely seen entity that swims through light. As they reach adulthood they become voracious, attempting to ingest a lifetime of food before they lay their young and take to the sky. There, from immense altitudes, they shine a radiant, warm light that slowly matures their spawn over countless human generations."


Sunstalker Infant
"Sunstalkers are creatures that manipulate and swim through light, shifting the colors of the spectrum at their whim. A tribe of humans began to worship a very ancient Sunstalker as the sun itself when it stepped down from the sky to rest on a mountain top. Countless generations and centuries have past and a strange human & monster relationship has emerged. The human culture tends to the young spawn, feeding it with a combination of food and ritual sacrifice. Only the fairest of maidens are selected for the horrifying honor of being a caretaker and not many survive the creatures period of infancy.

In an attempt to create a lasting relationship between the human and monster, the child of a mighty sun warrior is umbilically attached to the young sunstalker. A highly dangerous practice that occasionally results in a symbiotic link between man and monster. Sometimes the human child gaining some of the creatures strange ability to manipulate light."


People of the Sun
"There was once a tribe of humans that worshiped the Sun. They warmed themselves in its radiance and grew strange vegetation around sacred pools rippling with light. The tribe looked forward to the Sun’s gifts, ever widening their pools to catch every drop of sacred water that the Sun regurgitated. Joining hands within the sometimes super-heated columns of the Sun's light is a tradition shared by two young warriors in love.

The Priest and the Miko reflect a moment within the tribe. A warrior that has reached a pinnacle of wisdom is allowed to soak at the bottom of the sacred pool, infusing their bodies with the powerful secretions from the eggs that lay within it."


Warriors of the Sun
"A tribe that has found a harsh but harmonious existence under the oldest sun. The warrior young are raised alongside the sun's offspring in the sacred spawning pools. The few that survive to adulthood among the voracious brood do so by learning from the sun's infants.

The grown warriors become masters of stealth, developing power over the light, bending and shifting beams of light to hide in plain sight. Their garments woven of valuable prismatic fibers that help the warriors remain invisible in the darkness and in the light."



Other Powers/Factions

The Dragon King and the People of the Dragon
He's big.


Satan
"So great was Satan’s self-obsession that it split into twin hermaphrodite lovers to share the world with itself. They roam Kingdom Death, drunk with self-lust and power, trapped by their own vanity in fragile human frames. Their armor of living tongues shares the taste of the world between the twins. Satan is a vicious masochist, poisoning the minds of any it comes across. The pair is well hated by other entities, as they only seek to disrupt balance for their own satisfaction."


The Forsakers
"The Forsaker has lost so much that his perspective has been skewed beyond repair. They see nothing but darkness and suffering, accordingly, they have abandoned their own humanity to better suit the struggle they see all around them. Ruthless, and fueled by despair, the berserk state of the Forsaker is dangerous to friend and foe alike.

The Forsaker's fury is so consuming and violent that they often fix their weapons with rope or chain to their hands in anticipation of succumbing to their mindless rage."

"The Forsakers lose or give up their grasp on sanity in trade for unbridled power and stamina. They see nothing but suffering and pitiful struggle around them, incapable of compassion, they channel their despair into unchecked furious berserk state that makes the Forsaker dangerous to friend and foe alike."


The Butcher
"The Butcher is the remains of a Forsaker swallowed by long years of wrestling with the primal rage that gave him power. Nothing remains of the man, just a mess of flesh clinging to the insides of the Forsaker's armor, animated by nihilistic fury to destroy on the road through oblivion.

The Butcher collects the lanterns and skinned faces of his victims, a perversion of the humanity that echoes inside its near hollow armor."


Illuminated Lady
"The Illuminated Lady appears to survivors hopelessly lost in the darkness. A nude figure glowing softly by the light of her lantern, other lanterns grow dim as she nears. Her presence fills survivors with comfort and serenity and she will guide them into the darkness never to be found again. Some joke meeting her is a kinder end than most."


Dung Beetle Knight
"Once, a species of beetle became intoxicated by the rare enzymes found in Phoenix droppings. This delicacy was impossible to reach because the Phoenix's domain was fiercely guarded by the Flower Knight and the beetles presented a threat to the natural balance the Flower Knight protects. Over countless generations, the insects evolved into the likeness of a hulking knight to avoid the Flower Knight which sees no threat from feeble humans. Clever and hungry, it savagely hunts for nourishment to fill its massive ball, which also serves as a repulsive weapon."


Gold Smoke Knight
"There was once a fertile land of golden grass and prideful lions. Uncounted centuries ago, a parasite took root and over time a corrupted city grew to engulf the plains. The Golden Knight, a mysterious guardian of these lands, waged a losing war against the corruption. As futile years passed, the knight’s appearance grew twisted and haggard as the land itself. It’s glorious mane fell out, replaced by angry wailing smoke billowing in its place and the Gold Smoke Knight was born."


Storm Knight
"A toothless survivor tells the story of the knight in the center of the clouds. It was a beautiful sight, obscured by jets of steam and water issuing from ornate faces in its armor. A bitter, metal taste in the storming air. A bolt of light struck him, twisting his body and knocking the teeth from his clenched jaw."


Nightmare Ram
"The nightmare ram is the living spawn of a parasitic plant. It subsists on the salt of creatures which it metabolizes to power the glowing bulbs that grow atop its tough horns and the large lantern organ on it carries outside its body. They are sensitive, lonesome creatures that carefully cultivate beautiful, hidden gardens containing the plants that produce them. They will often beat trespassers into a pulp and use them as salt-rich fertilizer.

Like any fruit that has been picked, their life span is short."


Slender Man
"White Speakers whisper stories of the walking water. An entity capable of making people vanish without a trace, like the water of an unwatched urn. It's motives inscrutable and it's description warping with each new telling. Little is known of the Slender Man as it leaves nothingness in it's wake."


The Black Knights
"Percival is a member of a small order called the Black Knights. The Black Knights were founded by a militaristic settlement that hoped to conqueror the darkness and provide a safe haven for humanity. A great crusade called the Black Knights into action and Percival left her home never to be seen again. Before leaving, she commanded her loyal companion, a young puppy, to wait for her safe return. He still waits to this day."


The People of the Craft
"The Cyclops Knight awards the black tuning fork to the best artisans of a generation. The Weaponsmith is chosen for her vitality and rude spark of creative energy that is reflected in the masterfully crafted, yet simply named, "Axe"."

True to her audacious nature, this playful pinup incarnation of the Weaponsmith character class depicts the cheeky Weaponsmith as she would appear for a stuffy ceremonial painting. Such a bold gesture mocks the People of the Craft’s tradition of honoring their greatest artisans."


The Fighter
"The Fighter is a host to parasitic worms that regenerate her body. They make her near-immortal, pale, and her eyes yellow. The worms feed off the water and salt in her body and thus she must consume copious amounts of both to stay alive but the resulting diet keeps her body swollen, obscuring her muscular frame. Her fighting style is sloppy and agressive, unhindered by fear of harm."


The Mage
"The Mage comes from settlement of Aromachologists. Their magic, distilled oils from a variety of eccentric entities. Maybe, the settlement met a terrible fate, the raw oil from the Vermillion Raven reducing the population to mere doll like husks. And it may be the Mage escaped with a fistful of her kin and the twisted will to burn them for power to ensure her continued prosperity."


The Thief
"Maybe she is a frantic Savior's painting come to life. Or perhaps she comes from a small village at the center of a rainbow-hued swamp that absorbs the life of its inhabitants for generations before it awakes and paints a tapestry across the horizon. She could also be a renegade from a far developed Sun Stalker settlement. One day we'll set the record straight."


People of the Ringtail Fox (?)
Survivors who live in underground tunnels below a dangerous swamp ruled by a great fox-like entity. Not sure if the survivors are ruled by the fox-like entity or if the dangerous swamp is ruled by the fox-like entity. Either way suggests a completely different relationship there.


Visionaries
"Most live a drab life, nurturing a fantasy of their world painted in bold striking colors. Visionaries are the few that come across a relic that empowers them and demands action. Often, they will lead many to their death, building a staircase of corpses towards their lofty ideals."


Warlords
"Warlords use their power to stoke the dim, delicate flame of humanity into a roaring fire of martial strength. Whether raising armies of bedraggled, simpering survivors or transforming settlements into martial fortresses, they are inspirational, practical and blood thirsty."
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Adam Lucas
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Re: The Holy Lands
I'm pretty sure the King and the Scribe are going to be in the Lantern Festival expansion, which means neither of them are really involved with the Holy Lands.
 
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Re: The Holy Lands
Svengaard wrote:
I'm pretty sure the King and the Scribe are going to be in the Lantern Festival expansion, which means neither of them are really involved with the Holy Lands.


Wait, does Monster take place primarily in the Holy Lands?
I may have mixed that up…

Also - According to what I've seen on the Golden Entity, it is a nebulous type of entity, one that does not hold a corporeal form… Instead, it can choose to live through some its creations… (see: Chosen).

Also, Adam has hinted that there are indeed multiple G. Entities out there… devil
 
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Re: The Holy Lands
Svengaard wrote:
I'm pretty sure the King and the Scribe are going to be in the Lantern Festival expansion, which means neither of them are really involved with the Holy Lands.


What? The Holy Lands are part of Kingdom Death. The inclusion of the Monsters in the game expansion doesn't imply they have nothing to do with the Holy Lands. And all this flavor text is official, pulled straight from what Adam has written down.

Also OP, the list looks good. Though if this is hierarchical, it seems to me that the Scribe should be above the King. Seems like the flavor text says that he is above them
 
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Re: The Holy Lands
Svengaard wrote:
I'm pretty sure the King and the Scribe are going to be in the Lantern Festival expansion, which means neither of them are really involved with the Holy Lands.
By that logic the Lion Knight 2nd has nothing to do with the Holy Lands, but his flavor text clearly links him to the Holy Lands.

Still, now that I reread it, there's nothing in there that specifically links the King or the Scribe to the Holy Lands, I think I had just always assumed them and the Hands and the King's men were somehow linked, but maybe not?
 
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Re: The Holy Lands
No, but the impression I'm getting is that whatever this world is is big and there are a lot of different beings ruling over different areas. The base game seems to be in some sort early civilization, with some knights thrown in. Game Hunters have developed their own city (or warring city states) so they don't feel like they are near the base game settlement either. Then there's the Dragon King and the Sun Stalkers [sic?] and both of them sound like they'll have different campaigns.

They all feel like they are the same world, yes, but to me they don't really feel like they are all in the same location.
 
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Robert Teves II
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I'm pretty sure it's been confirmed that the Gold Smoke Knight is the third brother (to the lion knights).
 
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Thanks for this extensive compilation Sid! For starters this list seems to be a good source for future reference. I did not go through the details since I want to explore the world of KDM by playing the game a couple of times first.
 
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poeticallybored wrote:
I'm pretty sure it's been confirmed that the Gold Smoke Knight is the third brother (to the lion knights).

If that's true then it provides some interesting backstory for the Holy Lands.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
And it also means that potentially the Survivors visit the Holy Lands in even the base game since they can have an encounter with the Gold Smoke Knight at one point.
 
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anthony dybacz
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Excellent work on this, Sid!

I would like to add my thoughts, if I may?
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[IN-GAME SPOILERS]
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[IN-GAME SPOILERS]
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[IN-GAME SPOILERS]
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Game locations other than Plain of Faces

The base game alludes to many different locations that the player's survivors can visit, meaning that, though the settlement itself exists within the 'Plane of Faces', the survivors seemingly travel outside of this. I am thinking, primarily, of the Mineral Gathering and Herb Gathering events.

In Herb Gathering the survivors can explore the swamp. Is this just a area of water within the Plane of Faces, or is it something to do with the Nightmare Ram's location or the Abyssal Woods (or both, if they are the same...). The accompanying artwork is inconclusive on this matter.

The Mineral Gathering event is even more intriguing. Here you travel down though various locations until you reach a Lantern City, apparently deep underground. There are... things (humans?) living here; remnants of a human civilisation?

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The King/Scribe and Humans

In relation to the King's Lands and the humans living there, there is an interesting relationship. It seems like the King/Scribes wants to nurture the humans, but like a farmer and his cattle rather than wanting them to thrive.

The visit by the King's Men can result in a population cull if you are getting too big. Why is this? Is is because the King does not want a Warlord to arise and raise human armies? (Spartacus?)

The visit by The Hand is also intriguing because he clearly does not want humanity to experiment with the Lanterns or to get too good at crafting equipment or for 1 survivor to get too strong (again, Warlord situation?).

However, he is pleased to help if you have embraced Darkness within, or if the King's Men helped you. The survival of the fittest help he gives is hard to reconcile with the idea that they don't want humans to get too strong, but then again that principle does keep the population down.

The Watcher clearly 'watches' over each human settlement. To what end? Simply to kill them? Harvest them for the Scribe?

What is the overall motive of the King towards Humans?
Its an interesting question.

---

A further point on the enigmatic Goblin:

According to the White Speaker event, the Goblin inspires emotion in monsters. I think they are afraid of the Goblin as the Screaming Antelope was driven mad by him (when The Hand trained it as a mount for the Goblin).

The Goblin is, for me, currently the most intriguing aspect.

This is like trying to figure out Dark Souls...
(and who else is reminded of Knight Artorias when the read about Percival and her puppy? Even the Gold Smoke Knight story has elements of Artorias).
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Another interesting tidbit I found, The Hand doesn't appear to be a single person/entity like we would think from Game of Thrones where there's a single position "Hand of the King". Instead, The Hand appears to be an elite unit of the King that carry out business on his behalf, like an order of Knights or Enforcers.
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anthony dybacz
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It's explicit in the use of plurals in the description, now you mention it.

Do we think the King and the Scribe's motives are aligned, particularly where humans are concerned?

I imagine that the King's men and The Hand are answerable to only the King (the Kingsmen appear to be his guard, while The Hand are, as you say, his enforcers or spies (as they see everything the Kingsmen see).

I ask as I am trying to make further sense of how these 2 interact with humans (either helping or hindering, based on criteria).
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[IN-GAME SPOILERS]
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The criteria for help is low population, embracing darkness, treating children with a heavy hand (the third criteria for the hand is based on what the Kingsmen decided).

The criteria for harm is mostly based on technology or age (wisdom?).

This does tally with the idea of humans as a sort of cattle but also recognises that the King is also afraid of humans and what they can become/achieve (their greatness is alluded to in the Twilight Knight info).

Why keep them around at all?

It's obvious that humans exist all over the world and are also 'slaves' at the court of the Golden Entity (does The King/Scribe have any relation to him?). But the Kingsmen or Hand don't take any humans away. It seems that these are kept around for another purpose that we are yet to discover.

That the Watcher wakes after a determined time and exterminates the humans is strange. If the human life is the King/Scribe's way of keeping meat fresh, why are they not just harvesting the humans throughout the years?
I'm not sure if the Watcher is there to simply harvest the wheat, so to speak.
But I cannot be certain.
 
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Robert Teves II
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CardboardAnt wrote:
Spoiler (click to reveal)
This does tally with the idea of humans as a sort of cattle but also recognises that the King is also afraid of humans and what they can become/achieve (their greatness is alluded to in the Twilight Knight info).

Why keep them around at all?


Because despite human potential, we are still quite low on the food chain. We're not at the direct bottom, but we're likely the lowest thing that's worth farming.

What's funny is that there's this idea of humans being just livestock to the Scribe/King/Watcher system, but even to the player, survivors are just a resource, each one as expendable as the next (at least until they develop).

Also, the "SP" button on the post form creates automatic spoiler tags, which I took the liberty of adding to your text that I've quoted. Though I don't think anyone reading this thread cares about spoilers or is already deep enough into the game that nothing is really being spoiled here.
 
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Sid Rain
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Bear in mind I'm playing slow and haven't even gotten to the Watcher yet, so maybe some of this is already explained, but perhaps the Human Settlement is almost like a nest of sorts meant to grow a Watcher? The Hand and the King's Men have to thin the herd a bit now and then such that when the Watcher finally hatches, the humans he's supposed to be feeding on don't pose too great a threat to him. Maybe this is just how the Scribe or King or whoever reproduces and they just need humans there to get the baby Watcher going?
 
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Robert Teves II
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The flavor text on Watched indicates that he's been slumbering this whole time, not incubating/gestating, but that could just be the survivors misunderstanding the situation. Perhaps Armored Strangers and Regal Visit are just the King's soldiers checking in on the "egg." The Scribe writes us into the game as a snack to nourish it as soon as it's hatched, and the King's Men and Hands try to keep us from getting too strong so that we don't overwhelm the infant Watcher.

It's an interesting thought, but I'm not sure I buy into it. The fact that it's called the Watcher and the event is called Watched implies that, though slumbering, we are being monitored by an intelligent being, not something gestating and being born, and like that he's keeping the other predators at bay like a watchdog.
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Joe Kiyoshi
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Some more info on the swamp

Ringtail Fox Survivors. A new expansion under development, that explores people living in underground tunnels below a dangerous swamp ruled by a great fox-like entity. Securing and expanding the underwater tunnels so you can increase your population capacity is one of the ideas going into this one.
 
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anthony dybacz
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I want to clarify my question/point. I know humans are comparatively weak (though I am not 100% sure I buy that argument considering the Twilight Order info). But my question is more fundamental:

Why are humans being created/hearded? Why go to the trouble? What does the Scribe gain? Is it simply for meat?
If it is for meat then why not be harvesting them throughout?
And how does this tally with Scribe writing them into existence in the first place?
 
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poeticallybored wrote:
The flavor text on Watched indicates that he's been slumbering this whole time, not incubating/gestating, but that could just be the survivors misunderstanding the situation. Perhaps Armored Strangers and Regal Visit are just the King's soldiers checking in on the "egg." The Scribe writes us into the game as a snack to nourish it as soon as it's hatched, and the King's Men and Hands try to keep us from getting too strong so that we don't overwhelm the infant Watcher.

It's an interesting thought, but I'm not sure I buy into it. The fact that it's called the Watcher and the event is called Watched implies that, though slumbering, we are being monitored by an intelligent being, not something gestating and being born, and like that he's keeping the other predators at bay like a watchdog.


Why does your phrasing give me feelings of the Reapers from Mass Effect for The Watcher...?
 
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I had the idea that the Watchers are actually placed as recorders and collators of the settlement's 'story'. When the story is over, the Watcher eats the experiences of everyone, wipes it out, and then goes to the Scribe. He writes some more survivors, Watchers go back out and wait.

Why? Well, writers like playing with characters. Who knows? Maybe the Scribe is trying to find an answer to a question. Maybe he's just working on a novel.

 
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anthony dybacz
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I actually get a bit of the vibe of the 'chosen undead' narrative from Dark Souls; perhapse the Scribe is looking for something in particular (as you say; an answer to a question)?

And the relationship between the Scribe and the Golden Entity is important to the question of humans; does the Scribe write all humans into existence or just the ones in the plane of faces?
 
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