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Subject: Card treatment? rss

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Drake Coker
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The card finish, IMO, is a little disappointing for such a deluxe game. In particular, they really don't like to separate from each other. This makes shuffling a little annoying along with handling the cards in general.

This is easily solved by sleeving the cards, but that pushes the card tray to the very limits, plus it's a lot of sleeves to buy

Other than sleeving or just playing with the cards so long they pick up wear-and-hand-oil finish, has anyone tried anything else to address this issue?

Not the most pressing question of the day, but I am curious.


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Team Ski
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Olvenskol wrote:
The card finish, IMO, is a little disappointing for such a deluxe game. In particular, they really don't like to separate from each other. This makes shuffling a little annoying along with handling the cards in general.

This is easily solved by sleeving the cards, but that pushes the card tray to the very limits, plus it's a lot of sleeves to buy

Other than sleeving or just playing with the cards so long they pick up wear-and-hand-oil finish, has anyone tried anything else to address this issue?

Not the most pressing question of the day, but I am curious.


The finish is actually top quality. I don't think people realize that since you never see this type of card in games. Regardless, I sleeved all of my cards with Ultra Pro quality sleeves and had no problem with them fitting the trays.

-Ski
 
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Drake Coker
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Teamski wrote:
Olvenskol wrote:
The card finish, IMO, is a little disappointing for such a deluxe game. In particular, they really don't like to separate from each other. This makes shuffling a little annoying along with handling the cards in general.

This is easily solved by sleeving the cards, but that pushes the card tray to the very limits, plus it's a lot of sleeves to buy

Other than sleeving or just playing with the cards so long they pick up wear-and-hand-oil finish, has anyone tried anything else to address this issue?

Not the most pressing question of the day, but I am curious.


The finish is actually top quality. I don't think people realize that since you never see this type of card in games. Regardless, I sleeved all of my cards with Ultra Pro quality sleeves and had no problem with them fitting the trays.

-Ski
Not really sure what you mean by "top quality" here. In my book, top quality cards should fan nicely (along with being durable and crease resistant, which these seem to be). These don't fan at all! Cards should be pleasing to handle.

To each his own, I guess.
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Nick Wirtz
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It's a very nice finish if what you're doing is making a magazine or mat or something, but I disagree that it's optimal for cards: linen coated is pretty obviously the optimal (i.e. top) coating for cards, since they shuffle better and are more durable, and I'd say that regular card coating is still more functional than what KD has.

Don't get me wrong, they're gorgeous, but just not the most functional.
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Team Ski
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Fair enough. You could say that they were overproduced. How's that?

-Ski
 
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Nick Wirtz
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Overproduced implies more than necessary. I think they're nice production values, but just plain not the best medium for what they're supposed to do.
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Corporal Joe Bauers
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I'm not an expert, they just feel nice to me.

The thing that sticks out to me was the other persons thread about how they've held up with little to no wear after the MASSIVE amount of shuffling in this game.

In fact, the promo settlement card I have seems to be worse, and is immediately identifiable in the pile due to the wear it has received while the others haven't..

What's a game with an example of better cards? I may own it?
 
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Corporal Joe Bauers
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baylock wrote:
Symmetrical Docking wrote:
The thing that sticks out to me was the other persons thread about how they've held up with little to no wear after the MASSIVE amount of shuffling in this game.

In fact, the promo settlement card I have seems to be worse, and is immediately identifiable in the pile due to the wear it has received while the others haven't..

What's a game with an example of better cards? I may own it?
The OP concern is not about the wear at all. It is about the shuffling.
He says the cards don't like to separate from each other.
Can you answer this instead?
No, however, it is relevant to mention that these cards are extremely durable, even if they don't shuffle as well.

To call them lower quality because they don't shuffle as well as other cards while ignoring superior durability is to obfuscate details of the issue.

I can ask for an example of what people consider better cards, since that's the thread topic. I need that kind of information to find any solution.

The topic isn't you trying to, wrongly, police other posters...
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anthony
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I agree that these cards do not like to be shuffled and desperately cling to each other to avoid it!

They are beautiful cards, but that is not the issue being raised.

I found that if I give the deck a 'pile shuffle' or two to separate the cards out, it becomes a little easier to handle them.

However, for most of the ancillary decks (disorders, fighting arts, ect) I just cut the deck as I cannot be bothered with the hassle

An example of cards that shuffle perfectly? Magic: the gathering (they are also fairly durable and crease resistant, though I have yet to test KD durability - but shuffling and handling is what is being talked about).
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Corporal Joe Bauers
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How about riffle shuffling? It is specifically designed for unsleeved cards and I'm positive that Olvenskol already knows how to do it!

You just have to get over the sinking feeling you get when you abrasively push the cards together, and bending them maybe.

I just tried it with my Watcher deck (the only one I don't have sleeved) and it seems to work alright.

Obviously pile shuffling works too.
 
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If you are worried about randomization just pile shuffle into 5 separate stacks and roll a hit location die with the locations treated as numbers going top-to-bottom, 1-5.

The stickiness of the cards decreases with use: my WLion cards hardly clump anymore because of how frequently they see action. As for random draws for things like disorders and fighting arts, I just give a quick shuffle, cut the deck randomly, and draw from the first three.

The card quality is really good, it just needs a bit of use to get familiar with your techniques, whatever those might be. Play solo for a while and really spend some time handling the cards. They'll get used to it.
 
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Drake Coker
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Symmetrical Docking wrote:
How about riffle shuffling? It is specifically designed for unsleeved cards and I'm positive that Olvenskol already knows how to do it!

You just have to get over the sinking feeling you get when you abrasively push the cards together, and bending them maybe.

I just tried it with my Watcher deck (the only one I don't have sleeved) and it seems to work alright.

Obviously pile shuffling works too.
I can riffle shuffle

For my taste, these cards cling a bit more than I like for riffle shuffling (creating small clumps, which I suspect are fairly invariant between shuffles). Obviously, this will go away with normal wear and handling.

Personally, I Faro shuffle them, which works fine. Faro shuffling is a technique that is similar to riffle shuffling, but avoids bending the cards and will usually produce close-to-perfect interleaving once you get the technique down. Like most cards in games, you have to Faro shuffle upside down to get it to go smoothly (game cards are often cut from the backside in the machine, and it makes a very noticeable difference with this shuffling technique). I do a few overhands too. And sometimes piles. Plus another technique that doesn't have a name. I'm kind of a fanatic about randomization

As for good quality cards? Bicycle are nice (I assume too expensive for a limited run). In games, Magic: the Gathering cards are decent. The decks in the Combat Commander handle very well and good durability (my friend has over 500 plays unsleeved!). Most FFG game cards are similar.

Anyhow, while I'm a bit disappointed in these cards, it's a minor complaint. I've started sleeving them which makes for quick, effective shuffling and nicer hand feel. They just don't fit in the box quite as nicely.
 
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