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Subject: Marco Polo vs Navegador vs Keyflower rss

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Robert Sanchez
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Hi, mi sister is traveling Germany and could bring me one game. I think this three are hard to find right now in USA. Which do you recommend?
Navegador
Marco Polo
Keyflower
Thanks!
Robert
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Lenz Poh
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Keyflower with an expansion. Unless you're a die hard completionist.
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Hilda Lirsch
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All three are good games. One possibly relevant statistic is that Marco Polo is 2-4 players, Navegador is 2-5 players, and Keyflower is 2-6 players.
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Florian Trabert
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I do not like Navegador, and I think it is particular bad with two players. Marco Polo is an excellent Euro in my opinion, and very good with all player counts. Can't say anything about Keyflower.
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jamuki (Jueguetistorias)
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I think that the games are very different. I can't speak of Navegador, but Keyflower and Marco Polo are very different games.

Main mechanism of Keyflower is bidding with meeples to buy tiles to grow your home zone, and then use your tiles to get resources to get points. All bid are resolved at the end of the turn. If you are losing a bid, you may relocate your bidding to other titles - or use your meeples in zone tiles. Only whoever wins the bid pays. You can only bid with meeples of the same color than the previous bidder, and that introduces a strategy element. You can use the tiles that are being bidded for or tiles in other players' home zone, but then you lose the meeples.

Marco Polo is a game where the actions you need to use dice that is rolled at the beginning of the turn to select actions. Some actions cost more dice than others - some actions give you resources, some actions allow you to move your pawn around the board. Moving the pawn allow you to visit big cities, that unlock extra actions for you, and small cities, that give you a bonus for visiting and after that, each new turn. The resources can be used to fulfill contracts, which give victory points. You also get victory points for visiting some cities (some in common - like small cities with bonus or Beijing, and some are secret targets of you).

This is a very brief summary of both games. I prefer Marco Polo, but both games are excellent. I'd advise you to choose based on your preferred mechanics.
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ab48720 wrote:
Hi, mi sister is traveling Germany and could bring me one game. I think this three are hard to find right now in USA. Which do you recommend?
Navegador
Marco Polo
Keyflower
Thanks!
Robert


Navegador-There are better similar games. Buy Concordia instead.

Marco Polo-If you like dice placement games then this is the best one out there.

Keyflower-If you like bidding then this is quite good, also if you need a game that fits five or six players quite well.

I have not played "Thanks!" but I have played "No Thanks!" which is a nice little filler.
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Duarte
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It depends on what type of game you prefer, they're all different.
 
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Jack Francisco
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I second RoadHouse in buying Concordia over Navegador and I certainly wouldn't play Nav with 2p. Concordia plays just fine with 2.

Marco Polo is good, but there is something that doesn't sit perfectly right with me about it. Then again, I'm jaded by Troyes - THE best dice placement game out there.

Keyflower is also an entertaining game, but I've only ever played with 3/4 players. Not sure how it is with 2.
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Geoff Speare
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Navegador is not in the same class as the other two IMO (not that it's bad). I would pick Keyflower over Marco Polo, but both are very good!

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Chris Puram
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I actually like Navegador more than Concordia. It's very similar in terms of how scoring works but it doesn't suffer from two flaws inherent in Concordia. Ownership of scoring multipliers is hidden on cards in players hands is one thing. The ability to purchase cards is also very much luck based due to the way cards come out randomly, and resources required to purchase vary from turn to turn as cards slide down the purchase track.

In addition I prefer the rondel mechanic over cards as it lends itself towards more strategic play as you can determine players abilities and positions with a glance at the rondel. I also find the board play and marketplace in Navegador both more interesting and more thematic with more player interaction. Some people may think there is too much player interaction as you definitely have to be aware of what the player(s) to your right is doing when planning your strategies.

Keyflower is my favorite game, so that's also a no brainer.

Marco Polo is a good modern euro with a mish mash of mechanics that work well together, so you also can't go wrong there.

All in all, good choices, and I'd be happy to play any of those games any time.
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Dont know about Navegador but I own Marco Polo and Keyflower. I have played each one of them dozens of times and always 2-players. Both work really good as 2p games.

I enjoy both games but if I had to compare them fast I'd say that Keyflower is a better game but Marco Polo is more fun. And I'd add that Marco Polo is almost as well done as Keyflower but Keyflower will never be as fun as Marco Polo.
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Scott O'Brien
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ab48720 wrote:
Hi, mi sister is traveling Germany and could bring me one game. I think this three are hard to find right now in USA. Which do you recommend?
Navegador
Marco Polo
Keyflower
Thanks!
Robert



Both if you can afford it
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Larry Levy
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How many players are you trying to accommodate? Navegador is a brilliant game and plays particularly well with 5. Marco Polo can't handle 5 players and for me, at least, Keyflower would be overwhelming at that number. Navegador is also excellent with 4 and pretty good with 3, but probably not too good with 2. Marco Polo is fantastic with all numbers of players. Keyflower is very good as well, although I prefer it at lower player counts.

Also, how important is player interaction to you? Keyflower has more direct player interaction. The other two are more classic Euros, in that you can certainly affect your opponents, but you do so more indirectly.

They're three excellent games, so I'd take into account what your situation is and your personal preferences.
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Robert Sanchez
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Hi, thanks to everyone. I don't know how to reply to all.

Right now they just can bring me one, I live in México and the games take too much space for her.

I have seen that Marco Polo and Keyflower might get a reprint soon in the USA, so maybe I can buy them there on Amazon, but Navegador will not be easy to find, so this time I picked Navegador.

Thanks for the recommendation on Concordia, this one is easy to get but my wike don't like cards a lot, so the rondel might be better this time.

We usually play 2p, but I do jave a nice gaming group so I will be playing more player also.

I saw a thread of the designer of Race for the Galaxy about a Navegador 2p variant, I will try it also.

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Robert Sanchez
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Robot74 wrote:
Dont know about Navegador but I own Marco Polo and Keyflower. I have played each one of them dozens of times and always 2-players. Both work really good as 2p games.

I enjoy both games but if I had to compare them fast I'd say that Keyflower is a better game but Marco Polo is more fun. And I'd add that Marco Polo is almost as well done as Keyflower but Keyflower will never be as fun as Marco Polo.


Thats was my impression, that Marco Polo is funnier, but there is lot of praise to Keyflower so i wanted to know a little more, I do like bidding
 
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Robert Sanchez
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RoadHouse wrote:
ab48720 wrote:
Hi, mi sister is traveling Germany and could bring me one game. I think this three are hard to find right now in USA. Which do you recommend?
Navegador
Marco Polo
Keyflower
Thanks!
Robert


Navegador-There are better similar games. Buy Concordia instead.

Marco Polo-If you like dice placement games then this is the best one out there.

Keyflower-If you like bidding then this is quite good, also if you need a game that fits five or six players quite well.

I have not played "Thanks!" but I have played "No Thanks!" which is a nice little filler.


Jajaja, Nice one with the Thanks!
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Matt Gustafson
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Shane Larsen
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RoadHouse wrote:
Marco Polo-If you like dice placement games then thisTroyes is the best one out there.

FTFY
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Shane Larsen
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A lot of hate for Navegador with 2 players. I think it works quite well as a 2p game, especially if you use Tom Lehmann's 2p variant:

2-Player setup variant (minor change)
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Jack Francisco
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thedacker wrote:
RoadHouse wrote:
Marco Polo-If you like dice placement games then thisTroyes is the best one out there.

FTFY


Shane - I'm with you. Troyes is fantastic, especially with 3p. With 4p, I'd probably prefer Bora Bora, which is also very good.
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Shane Larsen
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senorcoo wrote:
thedacker wrote:
RoadHouse wrote:
Marco Polo-If you like dice placement games then thisTroyes is the best one out there.

FTFY


Shane - I'm with you. Troyes is fantastic, especially with 3p. With 4p, I'd probably prefer Bora Bora, which is also very good.

Hi Jack! I enjoy Troyes at all play counts. But your comment has finally tipped me over the edge with giving Bora Bora a try. I've heard too much good. And with dice manipulation being one of my favorite mechanisms, I definitely need to know what it offers.

Thanks!
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Jack Francisco
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Glad to hear that I helped tip you over. It's definitely got Feld's handprint on it with all of the interlocking mechanisms. Very fun game! Hope you enjoy it!
 
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Feld Fan
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Yes, definitely give Bora Bora a try. Plus, for as much game as it comes with, it is quite cheap to buy! It does scale/play well at all player counts, too, which is especially nice.
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Kenneth Lewandowski
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If space is an issue coming back from Germany...
Buy two games, open then and put all components into one box. There is usually extra space in the box.
 
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Trent Hamm
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The choice changes depending on the player count you're talking about. How many are playing?

2P: Marco Polo
3P: Marco Polo or Keyflower
4P: It's a dead heat at 4P in my opinion - all are good
5P: Navegador is the best at this count
6P: Keyflower (it's the only choice)

Basically, Navegador really shines at 4P and especially 5P, but at 3P or 2P I would definitely not pick it. I think Marco Polo is the best choice for lower player counts - 2P especially. Keyflower is very good at all player counts - it's either first or second at every single player count.

If you usually game with 2 or 3 or occasionally 4, get Marco Polo. If you usually game with 4 or 5, get Navegador. If your player count varies wildly, get Keyflower.
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