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Dogs of War» Forums » Variants

Subject: Some variants (I didn't playtest yet) rss

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Paolo Mori
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Parma
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Hi Dogs of War! I hope you are enjoying the game and are having some good trash talk at the table.

In these days I've come up with some minor variants that could make the game experience a bit different. I didn't had the chance to playtest them yet, so if you'll ever decide to try them out, please let me know if they work and if they actually added something to your games.
Freely decide if you want to try them together, or choose the ones you want to add to the game.

Easier Crushing Victories
You only need to reach the "10" space of the battle track to achieve a crushing victory in a battle. You still can move the marker above the 10 space. At the beginning of the game, place House Flags on the second (0) space of the House influence track.

Sudden Death
If the marker reaches the last space of a battle track, the battle immediately comes to an end, and no player can place further Captains on the Order-of-Battle cards of the involved houses.

Decisive Fourth Year
Before the last round of the game, instead of shuffling the House cards together and place them on the board, look at the House influence track to match the 1st (most worth) house and the 2nd House in the first battle, the 3rd and 4th house in the second battle, the 5th and the 6th in the third battle.

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Thiago Aranha
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All of those variants sound extremely interesting. I can't wait to give them a go!
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Dan Keller
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Nice, I'll have to try these out. The first two variants actually make Perceval playable, though he might be huge with 10 as a Crushing Victory.
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Mark Bigney
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They look fascinating! Thank you, I'll try to test them out.
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Alberto Vitali
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Casalecchio di Reno
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Sooooo juicy zombie

... I'll try them this weekend!!!

Thanks Paolo!
 
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Paulo Renato
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Vila Nova Gaia
Porto
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I run through Rahdo's Runthroughs and make right what once went wrong (via annotations)
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They look pretty cool
 
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Rafal Glowacki
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Easier Crushing Victories
"10pts" could be too easy. What about "since 12"?

Sudden Death
Very good idea but also this way of ending the battle should also block Nameless Conqueror's special ability.

(and maybe Stormcrow's too devil devil - this player couldn't afford to lose a battle that way)

Decisive Fourth Year
Very very good idea devil But there is a problem with a tie between a few Houses. I have some idea to minimize that problem: in my opinion number of influence tokens taken by players should be also considered.
Maybe after 3rd year, players should calculate "Temporary Influence Ratio" for each House. (TIR)
Number of Influence Tokens taken (ITT) by players (12 in the stock at the beginning minus number of IT still in the stock after 3rd year) and multiply by position House Victory Token on Victory Track (HVT).

TIR = ITT * HVT

After that calculation Houses would be matched.
Still there is a probability that will be a tie between 2nd and 3rd position or 4th and 5th or more Houses on the same position.
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Paolo Mori
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DarkerSide wrote:
Easier Crushing Victories
"10pts" could be too easy. What about "since 12"?

Yeah, maybe, try and let me know :-)

Quote:
Sudden Death
Very good idea but also this way of ending the battle should also block Nameless Conqueror's special ability.

(and maybe Stormcrow's too devil devil - this player couldn't afford to lose a battle that way)

Only caveat: what happens if 2-3 players decide to cause a crushing victory (thus suddenly ending a battle) immediately placing 2-3 warmachines or knights on the same order-of-battle card, without giving other players the opportunity to play pieces on the other side? It could be a strategy, but also a bit frustrating.

Quote:
Decisive Fourth Year
Very very good idea devil But there is a problem with a tie between a few Houses. I have some idea to minimize that problem: in my opinion number of influence tokens taken by players should be also considered.
Maybe after 3rd year, players should calculate "Temporary Influence Ratio" for each House. (TIR)
Number of Influence Tokens taken (ITT) by players (12 in the stock at the beginning minus number of IT still in the stock after 3rd year) and multiply by position House Victory Token on Victory Track (HVT).

TIR = ITT * HVT

After that calculation Houses would be matched.
Still there is a probability that will be a tie between 2nd and 3rd position or 4th and 5th or more Houses on the same position.

I don't think this is actually necessary. Just, if more house are tied for the same place, randomize the choice among them.

Thanks for your comments!
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Mark Bigney
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Finally had a chance to try these yesterday, and each change seemed like an improvement.
There were many crushing victories, perhaps too many (at least 7 or 8 over the course of the game)--I'm inclined to agree that 12 might be a better threshold than 10.
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Giordano Segatta
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Agree about 12 point for the crushing victory.

Very interesting variant, thank you for sharing Paolo.

Cheers
Giò
 
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T.J.
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Have you playtested these yet? Any further thoughts about the game?
 
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Julien Suzor
Netherlands
Uithoorn
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For the people who play with variants, would you suggest using all three at the same time?

thank you!
 
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Mark Bigney
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Yes, absolutely.
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Van Willis
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To confirm then, it seems the consensus (at least from this thread) from those who have tried the variants is to 1) use them all and 2) use 12 as the threshold for crushing victory rather than the 10 originally proposed?

Having never played Dogs of War but being very excited to try it out- is there any reason not to start from my first play using these variants since they sound like they make the game shift even more toward my preferences?

Thanks in advance!
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Dominick Duhamel
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Vantastic wrote:
To confirm then, it seems the consensus (at least from this thread) from those who have tried the variants is to 1) use them all and 2) use 12 as the threshold for crushing victory rather than the 10 originally proposed?

Having never played Dogs of War but being very excited to try it out- is there any reason not to start from my first play using these variants since they sound like they make the game shift even more toward my preferences?

I would say that is the consensus and that there isn't any reason not to use these variants in your first play. It makes the game better and isn't really any more difficult, so why not?

Have fun!
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Mark Bigney
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Vantastic wrote:
To confirm then, it seems the consensus (at least from this thread) from those who have tried the variants is to 1) use them all and 2) use 12 as the threshold for crushing victory rather than the 10 originally proposed?

Having never played Dogs of War but being very excited to try it out- is there any reason not to start from my first play using these variants since they sound like they make the game shift even more toward my preferences?

Thanks in advance!

That's what I would suggest. Have at it.
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Alberto Vitali
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Vantastic wrote:
To confirm then, it seems the consensus (at least from this thread) from those who have tried the variants is to 1) use them all and 2) use 12 as the threshold for crushing victory rather than the 10 originally proposed?

Yes

Quote:
Having never played Dogs of War but being very excited to try it out- is there any reason not to start from my first play using these variants since they sound like they make the game shift even more toward my preferences?
Thanks in advance!

I suggest You to play the first game using the original rules, in order to feel and play the game as it was in origin; then You can decide if You like the game as it is, or if You want to try the optional rules.
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N. P.
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After playing normally for my first game, I dived into my second game with all three variants, with overwhelming victory at 12. I felt that the game was much better. Dogs of War is legitimately incredible.

It's just so snappy and satisfying.
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Elend Venture
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Do you think that 12 point for threshold will make The Nameless Conquerer too powerful? Since when its 15 he has to play at least two 7 or three 5 or one 7 one 5 and one 1 (two powerful 7s or three cards) to achieve a crushing with his ability. But 12 point will allow him to simply play two 5 to become a threat to the table. (two cards)
 
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Dominick Duhamel
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darklanx wrote:
Do you think that 12 point for threshold will make The Nameless Conquerer too powerful? Since when its 15 he has to play at least two 7 or three 5 or one 7 one 5 and one 1 (two powerful 7s or three cards) to achieve a crushing with his ability. But 12 point will allow him to simply play two 5 to become a threat to the table. (two cards)

I've actually found this variant gives the Nameless Conquerer a much-needed buff. Prior to using this variant, I played many games where his ability had absolutely zero effect. Since I started playing with this variant, it seems much more consequential and much more in line with the value of other factions' abilities.
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Elend Venture
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I see, thank you for your reply. I'm gonna try this variant right away tomorrow! But do you think if we make the threshold 13 will be better? I keep on wondering whether allowing a 5 and a 7 for a crushing victory or requiring two 7s will be more reasonable.
 
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Dominick Duhamel
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darklanx wrote:
I see, thank you for your reply. I'm gonna try this variant right away tomorrow! But do you think if we make the threshold 13 will be better? I keep on wondering whether allowing a 5 and a 7 for a crushing victory or requiring two 7s will be more reasonable.

I haven't had a problem with 12. It's true that playing a 5 and a 7 will get them a crushing victory but that assumes (a) they've paid for a 5 and 7, (b) no other player is opposing them on the other side of the battle, and (c) they don't mind if they get no points from generals on the other side of the battle if they do go unopposed. And I've never found all of those things to be a given.
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jbrier
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Just my two cents- I've played a dozen or so 5p games with Decisive 4th Year and Sudden Death, and the game is brilliant. Yet I'd say with these variants the Nameless Conqueror (faction that gets 3VP if it's part of a decisive victory, right?) is already a tad overpowered; with Easier Crushing Victories it would be ridiculous.

Nameless Conqueror in our games (without Easier Crushing Victories) has racked up 12-15 VP from his ability and has either won or come a close second. Now of course the game is very interactive so it allows for player balancing, but keeping Nameless Conqueror in check presents a dilemma for opponents, who are tempted to help him push their favored stock to a +2 bump on the track. It's a situation where his temporary 'ally' might come out ahead in that particular 'transaction', but add them all up and Nameless Conqueror has racked up tons of VP.

I've only played locally - so there's groupthink - but we're pretty savvy gamers that have enthusiastically given this game (with all its expansions) the scientific treatment and in our experience decisive victory already happens plenty (thanks to Sudden Death of course)

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Mark Bigney
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First, it's not the Nameless Conqueror, it's d'Hiver.
Second, his point bonus does not come from a crushing victory, but rather a victory at 15--so it is unaffected by easier crushing victories and is helped by sudden death. For what it's worth, in my group he hasn't felt overpowered when played with all three variants.
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Adam McLean
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I just picked up the game and after 1 play using base game rules we really enjoyed it ....

After looking at these variants, I think we'll include them next time. But how do you think it'll work with this slight change:

12vp for the crushing defeat as was already suggested, but instead of Sudden Death being at 12, it still has to get to 15?
 
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