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Subject: Question - new victory conditoin rss

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Andrzej Kaczor
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Hello,

I have a question about new victory condition, it says:

1. if none of his opponents possesses more VP than he does, he immediately wins the game (it is therefore possible for a player to win the game while one of his opponents has as many VP as he does).


This is simple one, I have 8 points, the rest of players have 8 or less and it is beginig of my turn = I win immediately


2. if one or more of his opponents possess more VP than he does, no one wins at this time.
The current Day phase is the last of the game


This is quite simple too but:

- If I have for example 8 points at the start or my turn and other player have 9 current day phase is the last of the game - not a problem


but what if in next turn, after situation where I had 8 points and other player 9, I will have 9 points and other players also 9? Do I still win because of first condition? Or we have to play until the end of the say because second condition exclude the first one?

Thanks in advance
 
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Iain Brown
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Yes you win instantly.
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Andrzej Kaczor
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FritzBraun wrote:
Yes you win instantly.
So second condition does not exclude the first one yes?
 
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Ian Clévy
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AkitaInu wrote:
Hello,
but what if in next turn, after situation where I had 8 points and other player 9, I will have 9 points and other players also 9? Do I still win because of first condition? Or we have to play until the end of the say because second condition exclude the first one?
To be picky, I don't think your situation would ever happen because if you have 8 at the start of your turn, and the other person has 9. Let's say you get 1 point during your turn (to get to 9 points), the other player would win at the start of his/her turn before play gets back to you. whistle

That aside Iain is right: if you meet condition 1 before any of your actions, then you win no matter what has happened previously.
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Andrzej Kaczor
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Rapzoph wrote:

To be picky, I don't think your situation would ever happen because if you have 8 at the start of your turn, and the other person has 9. Let's say you get 1 point during your turn (to get to 9 points), the other player would win at the start of his/her turn before play gets back to you. whistle

That aside Iain is right: if you meet condition 1 before any of your actions, then you win no matter what has happened previously.
Ok, but what if I will get my points to 10 instead of 9? Then he will have 9 and I 10. And what If I will keep my 10 points and others will have equal or less at the start of placing my second action disk?

Rules state:

Quote:
If during the Day phase, before placing one of his action tokens,


Which means, I think, It is not before entire turn but before placing your action disks ( 1, 2, 3, 4 or even 5)
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AkitaInu wrote:
Hello,


but what if in next turn, after situation where I had 8 points and other player 9, I will have 9 points and other players also 9? Do I still win because of first condition? Or we have to play until the end of the say because second condition exclude the first one?

Thanks in advance

There is no next turn, the Game will end this turn, no matter what.

From the rule book, just under the rules you cited:
Quote:
If, at the end of this Day phase, no player has won the game, the winner of the game is
determined like in the base game, that is, taking into account the following criteria (in that
order):
•The player who has the most VP

•In case of a tie, the player who has the most Battle VP

•In case of another tie, the tied player who played the first during the last action phase."
 
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Andrzej Kaczor
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Ok so let me write this in another day as I think we don't understand each other (no offence)

we have 3 players. 1st, 2nd and 3rd

We are starting new day phase.

I am playing my first action disk as 1st, the next is 2nd player and then 3rd player.

That was first turn.


On second turn, I am starting first (this is the same day of course). And on the second, before placing my action token turn I have 8 points, 2nd have 9 points and 3rd have 7 points.

So now, we have a condition:

if one or more of his opponents possess more VP than he does, no one wins at this time. The current Day phase is the last of the game.

That's easy, no one wins and we have last day of the game. In the second turn I am getting 2 more points, none of the opponents get any points.

we play further.

On the third turn, before placing my action disk I have 10 points, 3nd have still 9 points and 3rd have still 7 points.

So now we have condition:

if none of his opponents possesses more VP than he does, he immediately wins the game (it is therefore possible for a player to win the game while one of his opponents has as many VP as he does)

Yes, I have more that other players so I should win the game or now?

This is the question I hope it's clear
 
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Spieler Gott
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Czesc Andrzej!

First of all, don't mess up turn and round.
turn= day phase
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1460543/wrong-wording-rules

After you missed the immediately win, the day phase is played to the very end, no matter who will have what amount of points during the day. And just at the end of the day phase you are comparing your points and see who has won.

 
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Andrzej Kaczor
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kackarschen wrote:
Czesc Andrzej!

First of all, don't mess up turn and round.
turn= day phase
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1460543/wrong-wording-rules

After you missed the immediately win, the day phase is played to the very end, no matter who will have what amount of points during the day. And just at the end of the day phase you are comparing your points and see who has won.

Hello Kackarschen.

Nice to know that someone exactly knows what I am talking about : )

But please tell me one more thing.

Regarding amount of points. If before placing my third action (when second condition was not triggered) I, as a first player in entire game, have 8 points and other players have 8 or less I still win yes?

It's before any of my actions or all of my actions?
 
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kackarschen wrote:

After you missed the immediately win, the day phase is played to the very end, no matter who will have what amount of points during the day. And just at the end of the day phase you are comparing your points and see who has won.
I would disagree with that then.

I think winning conditions are checked each time someone becomes the active player, before placing a token.

So in the scenario described, if it is 9-9 on the 3rd action play, the active player would win.
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AkitaInu wrote:

Yes, I have more that other players so I should win the game or now?
Yes, you win the game immediately.
 
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ebqz wrote:
kackarschen wrote:

After you missed the immediately win, the day phase is played to the very end, no matter who will have what amount of points during the day. And just at the end of the day phase you are comparing your points and see who has won.
I would disagree with that then.

I think winning conditions are checked each time someone becomes the active player, before placing a token.

So in the scenario described, if it is 9-9 on the 3rd action play, the active player would win.
Yes you are right. I thought the winning condition for an immediately win are just checked once for the player who triggered the winning condition.
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Andrzej Kaczor
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kackarschen wrote:
ebqz wrote:
kackarschen wrote:

After you missed the immediately win, the day phase is played to the very end, no matter who will have what amount of points during the day. And just at the end of the day phase you are comparing your points and see who has won.
I would disagree with that then.

I think winning conditions are checked each time someone becomes the active player, before placing a token.

So in the scenario described, if it is 9-9 on the 3rd action play, the active player would win.
Yes you are right. I thought the winning condition for an immediately win are just checked once for the player who triggered the winning condition.
So we can say that new winning condition is checked every time when you have to place action token yes?
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Tak!
 
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Shoosh shoo
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I think i misunderstood something here.

You said at one point in your example of three players, p1 has 8 points, p2 has 9 points Nd p3 has 7 points. I guess the only way this could happen is on a previous action p3 tried to fight p2... P2 was sitting at 8 points and after the fight, p3 loses and p2 gains their 9th point with an ability that lets defender get a vp for winning.

That aside, in the following actions, p1 has 8 points before he places an action token, but since p2 has 9, you have to play through an entire round??

Why doesnt p2 win before they place their action token?? They have 9 points and the others have 8 and 7....
 
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shooshoo wrote:
That aside, in the following actions, p1 has 8 points before he places an action token, but since p2 has 9, you have to play through an entire round??
No.

Because...

AkitaInu wrote:

So we can say that new winning condition is checked every time when you have to place action token yes?
kackarschen wrote:
Tak! (Polish= yes)
 
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Shoosh shoo
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This is what i was talking about...

The first player checks if he can win. He has 7 pts, but player 2 has 8 and player 3 has 9 (this is my own example).

Player 1 cannot win on his turn because he only has 7. They play one.

Player 2 checks on his turn. He has 8 but player 3 has 9, so although player 2 does not win, he triggers last round. So play continues till the end of this day phase.

Player 3 doesnt need to check on his turn bc the final round has already been triggered (even though he has 9 pts).

If player 2 only had 7 and we got to player 3s turn THEN he could have checked for victory and won right away. But becuase the last round was triggered everone finishes the day phase.

This is how im understanding it now.
 
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Iain Brown
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No, even if the final day condition has been triggered you still check for the instant win. So, in your example if the scores remained the same then Player 3 would win at the start of his turn.
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Shoosh shoo
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Oh ok. I dont know if that was made clear in the rules i will check again
Thanks!
 
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I also played it wrong. First it sounded like you have to play to the end of the day phase if the trigger player doesn't manage to make his "sudden death" win.
 
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Another example:

To make it simple. A 2-player game.

Day 10:
Player A plays his 5th action token and reaches his 8th victory point (winning condition reached).
Player B plays his 5th action token and reaches his 8th victory point (winning condition reached).


Day 11:
Who wins the game? Is it the player who places his action token first in the new day phase?

If turn order is A then B. A wins?
and
If turn order is B then A. B wins?

Am I correct?
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