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Subject: determining player order in 73x rss

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Joseph Anderson
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It seems like 3.2 has a higher priority than 7.1, but the 7.1 rules specifically refer to what to do with 3.2.

The rules in module 7 seem to state that module 7 determines the turn order and the taxes no longer do, at least from round 2.
Do you still have an auction at the start of the game to determine initial player order? (as in 3.2)

Have I missed something obvious or made a significant error above?
 
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Jack Spirio
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7.I has priority I so it determines always the turn order

with 3.II you pay taxes depending on income, but turn order is still after vp

I think, there is no turn order auction as 7 says that you choose turn order randomly and then place hqs in that order
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Yeah. 3.II has priority II for turn order while 7.I has priority I, it seems (from the rulebook... won't have my BoW until Monday).
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Jack Spirio
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I just looked throw all modules for turn order priority
TOP 1 has either priority IV or I(3,7,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or II(3,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or III(9)
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Travis Dean
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Jack Spirio wrote:
I just looked throw all modules for turn order priority
TOP 1 has either priority IV or I(7) or II(3,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or II(3,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or III(9)
This is what I have according to my notes. Slightly different, but mostly the same.
 
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Jack Spirio
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I have my info from the Book of Worlds, so it should be correct (although it wouldn't change much), but it states easier what happens in games with 39X or 93X (that the module in TOP 1 is more important)
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Henning Kröpke
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Dolus wrote:
Jack Spirio wrote:
I just looked throw all modules for turn order priority
TOP 1 has either priority IV or I(7) or II(3,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or II(3,9)
TOP 2 has either priority IV or III(9)
This is what I have according to my notes. Slightly different, but mostly the same.
Hi Travis,

your notes are not correct. Jack's short list is correct.

If either module 3, 7 or 9 is on TOP I, that module defines player order.

If non of these three are on TOP I, but either module 3 or 9 is on TOP II, that module defines player order.

If non of these three are on TOP I, and non of the two are on TOP II, but module 9 is on TOP III, that module defines player order.

In all these cases, you have a round-based player order.

In all other cases, you simply play in clockwise player order.

Henning
(2F-Spiele)
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Travis Dean
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Jack Spirio wrote:
I have my info from the Book of Worlds, so it should be correct (although it wouldn't change much), but it states easier what happens in games with 39X or 93X (that the module in TOP 1 is more important)
Awesome. I'll update what I've got noted. The rulebook is very clear on certain things with priorities (such as money and map), but very vague or ignorant of others. So I've had to make some (apparently wrong) guesses.
 
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Flying Arrow
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Just played 738. It was a really good combination. But I'm beginning to think that a beginning-of-game turn-order auction is something that should be in every game of 504.
 
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Travis Dean
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Just played 738. It was a really good combination. But I'm beginning to think that a beginning-of-game turn-order auction is something that should be in every game of 504.
In our first PBFs, as we were seeing how drastically different the game can be depending on if your first player or fourth player, I actually considered this. There are games that claim 'no-luck' outside of possibly starting player order, but after your first game they encourage players to bid end game VP to choose their initial turn order.
 
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Jack Spirio
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That seems like a really good idea if all player are used to playing new games or know all modules.
 
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Flying Arrow
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Of course, in 504, you're almost always playing a game for the first and possibly only time. So that auction is really tough to estimate. In 738, an opponent on the first turn built a factory in both his capital and mine. That automatically wastes $10 of my money. I certainly had not thought through that possibility before the game started.
 
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Sophia Lechner
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Of course, in 504, you're almost always playing a game for the first and possibly only time. So that auction is really tough to estimate. In 738, an opponent on the first turn built a factory in both his capital and mine. That automatically wastes $10 of my money. I certainly had not thought through that possibility before the game started.
Huh, I hadn't thought of that either. Interesting. You'd have to bid $0 on player order (or lose enough ties to get all your money back), win no auctions for privileges, and you'd be left with only two residents, and the ability to buy only two more the next turn, and you'd still have only $40 after taxes so it doesn't sound like a great strategy. But perhaps having the extra cash for bidding on privileges that are now at $0 min bid would make enough of a difference. How'd they do?
 
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Sophia Lechner
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JemL wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
Of course, in 504, you're almost always playing a game for the first and possibly only time. So that auction is really tough to estimate. In 738, an opponent on the first turn built a factory in both his capital and mine. That automatically wastes $10 of my money. I certainly had not thought through that possibility before the game started.
Huh, I hadn't thought of that either. Interesting. You'd have to bid $0 on player order (or lose enough ties to get all your money back), win no auctions for privileges, and you'd be left with only two residents, and the ability to buy only two more the next turn, and you'd still have only $40 after taxes so it doesn't sound like a great strategy. But perhaps having the extra cash for bidding on privileges that are now at $0 min bid would make enough of a difference. How'd they do?
No, wait, I take it back. I don't think it's possible. It would require $100 total. (getting to a city 3 spaces away requires buying 5 residents for $50, the trading house fee is $10, and two factories costs $40). What gives?
 
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Flying Arrow
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They came in 3rd. I came in 4th, but that was due to bad plays later more than it was due to the opening play.
 
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Flying Arrow
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JemL wrote:
JemL wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
Of course, in 504, you're almost always playing a game for the first and possibly only time. So that auction is really tough to estimate. In 738, an opponent on the first turn built a factory in both his capital and mine. That automatically wastes $10 of my money. I certainly had not thought through that possibility before the game started.
Huh, I hadn't thought of that either. Interesting. You'd have to bid $0 on player order (or lose enough ties to get all your money back), win no auctions for privileges, and you'd be left with only two residents, and the ability to buy only two more the next turn, and you'd still have only $40 after taxes so it doesn't sound like a great strategy. But perhaps having the extra cash for bidding on privileges that are now at $0 min bid would make enough of a difference. How'd they do?
No, wait, I take it back. I don't think it's possible. It would require $100 total. (getting to a city 3 spaces away requires buying 5 residents for $50, the trading house fee is $10, and two factories costs $40). What gives?
There's no Trading House fee for 8.III. Only for 8.I and 8.II.
 
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Sophia Lechner
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FlyingArrow wrote:
JemL wrote:
JemL wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
Of course, in 504, you're almost always playing a game for the first and possibly only time. So that auction is really tough to estimate. In 738, an opponent on the first turn built a factory in both his capital and mine. That automatically wastes $10 of my money. I certainly had not thought through that possibility before the game started.
Huh, I hadn't thought of that either. Interesting. You'd have to bid $0 on player order (or lose enough ties to get all your money back), win no auctions for privileges, and you'd be left with only two residents, and the ability to buy only two more the next turn, and you'd still have only $40 after taxes so it doesn't sound like a great strategy. But perhaps having the extra cash for bidding on privileges that are now at $0 min bid would make enough of a difference. How'd they do?
No, wait, I take it back. I don't think it's possible. It would require $100 total. (getting to a city 3 spaces away requires buying 5 residents for $50, the trading house fee is $10, and two factories costs $40). What gives?
There's no Trading House fee for 8.III. Only for 8.I and 8.II.
Ah, thank you.
 
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