Björn Grafström
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What would happen if the wildling cards turn up in this order:

1. Preemptive raid - Night's watch win

Highest bidder is removed from the bidding and the wildlings attack again with strength 6.

2. A king beyond the wall - Night's watch win

Would it be possible to claim a token held by the player who won against the Preemptive raid card?

And same thing as above but...

2. A king beyond the wall - wildlings win

What happens now? A possible jackpot for the winner of Preemptive raid?
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Andrew Rice
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It's helpful if you include the text from the cards, so we don't all have to go get our games out in order to answer your questions.
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Brendan
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Daniel Maxfield
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bagisbjorn wrote:
What would happen if the wildling cards turn up in this order:

1. Preemptive raid - Night's watch win

Highest bidder is removed from the bidding and the wildlings attack again with strength 6.

2. A king beyond the wall - Night's watch win

Would it be possible to claim a token held by the player who won against the Preemptive raid card?

And same thing as above but...

2. A king beyond the wall - wildlings win

What happens now? A possible jackpot for the winner of Preemptive raid?




I think for the second attack in Preemptive raid, you don't draw a new wilding card. They just attack again and use the victory conditions on preemptive raid card.
 
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Ziga Zupanek
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Here is how I understand these cards:

1. Night's Watch wins the Preemptive Raid and the winner doesn't participate in next A King Beyond the Wall wildling attack with strength of 6. As card's condition states in parentheses the winner doesn't recieve any rewards or penalties as a resault of the next attack.

2. All the remaining players bid on wilding attack with srength of 6.

3. If Night's Watch wins A King Boyond the Wall wildling attack, then only the Highest Bidder of this wildling attack moves one of his tokens to the top of one of the Influence tracks.

4. If the Wildlings win A King Beyond the Wall wildling attack, then everyone except the winner of the Preemptive Raid, as he doesn't suffer any penalties, most act as told. First the Lowest Bidder moves his tokens to the lowest position of every Influence Track. Then in turn order each bidding player (skipping the winner of the Preemptive Raid) chooses one of the two mentioned Influence tracks and moves his token to the lowest place.
The order of resolution if Wildlings win A King Boyond the Wall wildling attack was discused here: A king beyond the wall
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Tyler B
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Using your premise, I see no reason why the Highest Bidder in the A king Beyond the Wall - Night's Watch Victory can't take a dominance token from the winner of Preemptive Raid. In this scenario the player engaging in the reward is the one that bid the highest. It's a reward for him, not a punishment for the Dominance Token holder.

In the case of a Second Wildling Victory, as others have pointed out, the Preemptive Raid winner doesn't get punished in the "Everyone Else" clause based on the Preemptive Raid card telling him he doesn't.

==========

1. Player A wins Preemptive Raid. Does not get involved in A King Beyond the Wall.

2a. Players B-F beat the Wildlings against A King Beyond the Wall, player B bid the most. Player B is free to take player A's dominance token. Player B is getting a reward. Player A is not getting punished or rewarded by A King Beyond the Wall, thus satisfying the Preemptive Raid card. Player B is "punishing" Player A, not the card; but really is only taking the reward they earned.

2b. Players B-F lose to the Wildlings against A King Beyond the Wall, player B bid 0, everyone else bid 1. Player B is the low bidder because Preemptive Raid says that A cannot be chosen and everyone else outbid him. Player B moves his influence tokens, then players C-F in Iron Throne order.
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Tyler B
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zeta044 wrote:

I think for the second attack in Preemptive raid, you don't draw a new wilding card. They just attack again and use the victory conditions on preemptive raid card.


You definitely draw a new card. The card says "The wildlings immediately attack again ..." It's a totally different attack.

Wildling Attack rules, pp. 22-23

Quote:
A wildling attack is resolved over the following steps:
1. Determine Wildling Strength: Check the current
position of the Wildling Threat token. The number printed
on its position on the Wildlings track is the strength of the
wildling attack.
2. Bid Power: Each player hides his available power behind
his player screen, and then secretly bids a number of Power
tokens (from his available power) in a closed fist.
3. Calculate Night’s Watch Strength: Once all players
have made their secret bid, bids are simultaneously revealed.
Add together the total power bid by all players to determine
the strength of the Night’s Watch.
4. Determine Outcome: If the strength of the Night’s
Watch equals or exceeds the wildling strength, the wildling
attack has been defeated.
If the wildling strength exceeds the strength of the Night’s
Watch, the wildlings are victorious. Players now resolve
the “Consequences of a Wildling Attack” as described in the
section below.
5. Adjust Wildlings Track: If the Night’s Watch are
victorious, immediately reset the Wildling Threat token to “0“ on
the Wildlings track. If the wildlings are victorious, however, the
Wildling Threat token is only moved back two positions (to a
minimum of “0”).
6. Discard Power: All Power tokens bid by players,
regardless of victory or defeat, are discarded to the Power Pool.

Consequences of a Wildling Attack
After the outcome of a wildling attack has been determined
(during step 4 above), players face the ramifications of success or
failure, as follows:
1. Reveal Wildling Card: Draw
the top card of the Wildling deck
to determine the reward or penalty
players will receive.
2. Resolve Wildling Card:
If the Night’s Watch successfully
defeated the wildlings, the player
who bid the highest amount of
Power receives the reward indicated
under “Night’s Watch Victory” on the
Wildling card.
If the wildlings are victorious, the
player who bid the least amount of
Power suffers a severe penalty while the other players suffer a
lesser penalty. Both the severe and lesser penalties are described
on the Wildling card under “Wildling Victory”.
3. Bury Wildling Card: Place the used Wildling card
facedown on the bottom of the Wildling deck.


Part of step 4's Determine Outcome of the wildling attack is Reveal Wildling Card. You don't just get to skip this step of the wildling attack because another attack just happened. Additionally, the Preemptive Raid card should have been on the bottom of the deck during step 4 as well, in the Bury Wildling Card step, so it's not even in play.
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Brendan
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scottishduck wrote:
Using your premise, I see no reason why the Highest Bidder in the A king Beyond the Wall - Night's Watch Victory can't take a dominance token from the winner of Preemptive Raid. In this scenario the player engaging in the reward is the one that bid the highest. It's a reward for him, not a punishment for the Dominance Token holder.

In the case of a Second Wildling Victory, as others have pointed out, the Preemptive Raid winner doesn't get punished in the "Everyone Else" clause based on the Preemptive Raid card telling him he doesn't.

==========

1. Player A wins Preemptive Raid. Does not get involved in A King Beyond the Wall.

2a. Players B-F beat the Wildlings against A King Beyond the Wall, player B bid the most. Player B is free to take player A's dominance token. Player B is getting a reward. Player A is not getting punished or rewarded by A King Beyond the Wall, thus satisfying the Preemptive Raid card. Player B is "punishing" Player A, not the card; but really is only taking the reward they earned.

2b. Players B-F lose to the Wildlings against A King Beyond the Wall, player B bid 0, everyone else bid 1. Player B is the low bidder because Preemptive Raid says that A cannot be chosen and everyone else outbid him. Player B moves his influence tokens, then players C-F in Iron Throne order.


For whatever it's worth, I agree with this interpretation. I like the strange dynamic that Preemptive Raid provides, where it can actually be beneficial to win as a group, but to not be the winner.
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Björn Grafström
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andy.rice@att.net wrote:
It's helpful if you include the text from the cards, so we don't all have to go get our games out in order to answer your questions.


Yeah, sorry about that. Was at work with limited ability to do so. None actually.
 
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Philip Lodge
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We always draw a new card.

I suppose this

Quote:
I like the strange dynamic that Preemptive Raid provides, where it can actually be beneficial to win as a group, but to not be the winner.


Depends on how important your power tokens are. The second attack in our games nearly always loses, due to the first. Especially in 4 player games.
 
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Tyler B
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Biarien wrote:
I like the strange dynamic that Preemptive Raid provides, where it can actually be beneficial to win as a group, but to not be the winner.


Assuming you have power tokens left... whistle

edit: that said, i think it's funny when preemptive raid is pulled after a victory against a 0-2 wildling force, like, they attack again but this time stronger!
 
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Bill Buchanan
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zeta044 wrote:

I think for the second attack in Preemptive raid, you don't draw a new wilding card. They just attack again and use the victory conditions on preemptive raid card.


You have to draw a new card or else it would just loop down to 1 player remaining or until the remaining players decide to just lose to the wildlings ...
 
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