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Subject: Rally in openground rss

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Miroslav Dráb
Czech Republic
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Good evening,

*Can broken unit make rally in openground?
*Can broken unit make rally in openground and LOS and Normal range of known enemy unit?

Thanks in advance
 
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Mark Evans
United States
Berlin
New Hampshire
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Yes and Yes.
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Ken Monson
United States
Eagan
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Yes 10.6 does not have any terrain restrictions for Rally attempt nor does it matter if anyone is watching whistle

10.61 gives bonus to rally for being in woods or building

Also remember DM 10.62 as any broken unit which ends a route phase in open ground most likely opted to keep DM to continue rout or survived some sort of interdiction if it is in LOS/Normal range of enemy unit (although there is a slight chance that DM doesn't apply.)
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Robin Reeve
Switzerland
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plem45 wrote:
Yes 10.6 does not have any terrain restrictions for Rally attempt nor does it matter if anyone is watching whistle

10.61 gives bonus to rally for being in woods or building

Also remember DM 10.62 as any broken unit which ends a route phase in open ground most likely opted to keep DM to continue rout or survived some sort of interdiction if it is in LOS/Normal range of enemy unit (although there is a slight chance that DM doesn't apply.)
A broken unit in open ground in LOS of an armed enemy unit has no option to remain DM. He must become DM.
Only units in non open ground terrain have that option.
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Klas Malmstrom
Sweden
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Robin wrote:
A broken unit in open ground in LOS of an armed enemy unit has no option to remain DM. He must become DM.
Only units in non open ground terrain have that option.

Such a unit could lose DM at the end of Rally Phase, but if the situation is the same at the beginning of the Rout Phase, they become DM automatically again.


A10.62:
"...A broken unit is also automatically under DM whenever a Known armed enemy unit is ADJACENT to it (even if it does not end the phase ADJACENT to it) or when it starts a RtPh in Open Ground in the LOS and Normal Range (10.532) of a Known enemy unit..."

"...Place a DM marker on any unit under DM and remove it at the end of every RPh [EXC: A unit may opt to retain its DM status provided it is not in a woods/building/pillbox/trench so as to guarantee its ability to rout again in the next RtPh. If overstacked in a woods/building, it may also opt to retain its DM status.]..."
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Zartan Madinski
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Since we are talking about broken units gaining and losing DM I had a question come up in a game last night.

Is a broken unit in a building that previously lost DM put back under DM when a flame in it's hex becomes a blaze?
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Klas Malmstrom
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Zarmao wrote:
Is a broken unit in a building that previously lost DM put back under DM when a flame in it's hex becomes a blaze?

I think so yes, since only DM units can rout, IIRC.


ASOP, Step 6.11B
"...Place DM counter on each non-DM unit/stack that must rout (A10.62)."
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Zartan Madinski
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klasmalmstrom wrote:
Zarmao wrote:
Is a broken unit in a building that previously lost DM put back under DM when a flame in it's hex becomes a blaze?

I think so yes, since only DM units can rout, IIRC.


ASOP, Step 6.11B
"...Place DM counter on each non-DM unit/stack that must rout (A10.62)."

We went with the section in B25.4 that says that units which are unable to voluntarily break (which would include already broken units)may move during their rout phase into an accessible location just as if withdrawing from melee.

Although it seemed odd to have a broken unit move at all without going back under DM. The ASOP you quoted certainly overrides when combined with A10.4 which says that broken units cannot move in any way except to rout or to withdraw from CC.

So the broken unit must "leave" the blaze location but he can only leave by routing per A10.4 and the ASOP says that units that must rout go back under DM. Problem solved Though a bit convoluted.
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Klas Malmstrom
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Agree, it would have been clearer if e.g., rule A10.62 spelled out that a broken unit that finds itself in a Terrain Blaze automatically becomes DM.
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Ken Monson
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klasmalmstrom wrote:
Robin wrote:
A broken unit in open ground in LOS of an armed enemy unit has no option to remain DM. He must become DM.
Only units in non open ground terrain have that option.

Such a unit could lose DM at the end of Rally Phase, but if the situation is the same at the beginning of the Rout Phase, they become DM automatically again.


A10.62:
"...A broken unit is also automatically under DM whenever a Known armed enemy unit is ADJACENT to it (even if it does not end the phase ADJACENT to it) or when it starts a RtPh in Open Ground in the LOS and Normal Range (10.532) of a Known enemy unit..."

"...Place a DM marker on any unit under DM and remove it at the end of every RPh [EXC: A unit may opt to retain its DM status provided it is not in a woods/building/pillbox/trench so as to guarantee its ability to rout again in the next RtPh. If overstacked in a woods/building, it may also opt to retain its DM status.]..."


Okay, I learned a valueable lesson piping up in this forum. surprise I am still learning the rules myself, but I learned if I am going to cite a rule, I should verify I read (in entirety)modest and fully understand all the nuances myself before trying to provide others guidance. Sorry if I caused any confusioncry
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Robin Reeve
Switzerland
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plem45 wrote:
Okay, I learned a valueable lesson piping up in this forum. surprise I am still learning the rules myself, but I learned if I am going to cite a rule, I should verify I read (in entirety)modest and fully understand all the nuances myself before trying to provide others guidance. Sorry if I caused any confusioncry

You have absolutely no reason to be sorry.
We all are learning the rules and the interaction here helps all of us get a better grasp of them.

Well, perhaps with the exception of Klas.
Klas is the killer robot whose laser view makes him hit the mark most of the time.
Not always, however, so that leaves meek aprentices like you and me still hope we will someday catch him off balance.

So go on debating about the rules, exposing what you think they say.
This is a forum, not an exam class.

Welcome to humanity.
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