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Warhammer Quest: The Adventure Card Game» Forums » General

Subject: What if I didn't like Death Angel? rss

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Scott
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I see a lot of of people saying that they like WH Quest despite not liking PACG - which I didn't care for either. And there are a lot of comparisons to Death Angel, which I also didn't like. But I absolutely love the LOTR LCG.

Any thoughts on this weird place I'm in and what it might mean for me liking or not liking the game?
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Samuel Hinz
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depends on what it is you like about LOTR really.
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PC ichigo
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Bangbuathong
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Never play Death Angel before, but really like LOTR LCG too.

I already sold my LOTR because I can't keep up with LCG system and all expansion. Also, my gaming group don't have anyone who want to spend time and create player deck (I love to create my own deck, but to do it for everyone seem a little bit too much).

When they announce this game, I'm very happy like instant buy. laugh
And I really love this game, the only complain my gaming group have is that they are only 4 characters and my group want more like 8 at least. Anyway, when the expansion come out, I believe this gonna fix their complain, ah at this rate I may sold my Pathfinder: The adventure card game soon as well...


So, in my opinion if you love LOTR LCG and...
1. You are ok with no player deck creation.
2. You are ok with Warhammer theme.
3. You are ok with dice rolling.
4. You are ok with no resource/mana management to cast something.

Then, I guess you should try it out.
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Andy Dunks
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I liked Death Angel OK, but this seems much less abstract, and the common mechanics of location cards, traveling, supporting other characters are much more refined. There is also a greater variety in opponents, locations, gear cards, etc. A much richer experience.

It feels less arbitrarily ruthless as well. In WQACG you'd have to have both several turns of incredibly bad tactics and of incredibly bad luck to see a given character wiped out in this game, where in DA you could lose one or both of your characters in one turn purely due to luck despite skillful play. So I'd take the plunge, especially given the fairly low price.
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Scott
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Hmm - well I like:
- that there are tough decisions to make all the time
- the ability to combo different cards off each other
- the push your luck element in questing
- the artwork
- the depth; I've played it dozens of times and have just scratched the surface of the game

Plenty of other stuff too, but that's what came to mind.

For additional context, I disliked Death Angel because I found it boring and too random. Not much depth either. PACG was also very boring and lacked tough decision making for me - it felt like I was just rolling a die and adding modifiers over and over again for everything.
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Davide C
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Mechanically, WHQ feels like an evolution of SHDA, but is also very different.
1. There is much more variety in enemies and locations.
2. There is a little bit of character customization through advancement and loot.
3. The game feels less random, there is a luck element but what happens feels like a consequence of your choices.
4. It feels to me less abstract and more thematic.
I like SH as a quick time killer, but I like WHQ much more.

Concerning LoTR, I have played it just once, and didn't really like it. I would say that WHQ is a totally different game, it has almost nothing to do with it mechanically. To address your specific points:
- that there are tough decisions to make all the time - This is quite true for this game, in my opinion. Decision mainly concerns how to split actions between fighting and exploring, when to explore to avoid being overwhelmed and to prevent the peril track to move too fast, who should engage what enemies, how to manage your action refresh mechanic, and so on.
- the ability to combo different cards off each other - This is not a card game, so it is not based on having powerful combos in your deck. Think of it more as a miniature dungeon crawler, with cards instead of miniatures. You can still find some possible action combos that are quite effective in some situations, though (like empowering a bright wizard with the warrior priest, giving support tokens to the bright wizard attack, and then cast a super-powerful fireball).
- the push your luck element in questing - I would say there is no "push your luck" element. When you explore a location, you will spawn new enemies, if you don't explore it, the peril track will keep moving and bad stuff will happen. It is more about deciding when it is the right moment to move, in order to finish the quest quickly without being overrun by enemies.
- the artwork - I personally like the artwork. I think the artwork on some action cards has been recycled from invasion (not sure), but for most card it is original. The style is quite consistent across all cards.
- the depth; I've played it dozens of times and have just scratched the surface of the game - Can't really express myself about this because I haven't played a lot of games. Surely if they produce expansions with new heroes and monster there will be new content and challenges making for a very varied and fresh experience each time, but also the content of the base box can presumably offer a lot of fun.
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Simon Andrews
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Atvar wrote:
In WQACG you'd have to have both several turns of incredibly bad tactics and of incredibly bad luck to see a given character wiped out in this game


What are you saying about my 'incredibly bad tactics'?
...cry
 
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Davide C
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SalieriUK wrote:
Atvar wrote:
In WQACG you'd have to have both several turns of incredibly bad tactics and of incredibly bad luck to see a given character wiped out in this game


What are you saying about my 'incredibly bad tactics'?
...cry


I know that feeling. cry
 
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A Manatee
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I really didn't like Death Angel either. It felt very arbitrary and didn't lead to cool moments. Your awesome marine could die before he did anything useful and the narrow options available meant that I felt like I was making limited decisions and then suffering at the mercy of the die.

This is a very different game. It's lighter than the LOTR game, but it's deeper than DA. It also feels better than both to my view. It adds complexity to the DA framework but strips out a lot of the upkeep and card effect tracking that I disliked about LOTR (I felt like I was spending more time running the game than I was making actual decisions).

This is also a departure from the Co-op as brutal puzzle model that LOTR and DA exemplify. This is much more about progression and accomplishment. I'd even dare say it actually isn't that difficult of a game. You're certainly never going to lose because you drew the wrong card or a single die went against you. The fun is less about perfecting your approach and more about tearing through a dungeon and grabbing loot as you go. It feels heroic in a way that neither of its predecessors really did to me.
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Scott Cantor
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Ohthehugemanatee wrote:

This is also a departure from the Co-op as brutal puzzle model that LOTR and DA exemplify. This is much more about progression and accomplishment. I'd even dare say it actually isn't that difficult of a game. You're certainly never going to lose because you drew the wrong card or a single die went against you. The fun is less about perfecting your approach and more about tearing through a dungeon and grabbing loot as you go. It feels heroic in a way that neither of its predecessors really did to me.


So far this game is much, much harder than LOTR is for me. LOTR' puzzle is really strictly deck building. The right deck will smash most quests (and a really right deck can smash all of them across the board). I haven't managed to figure this game out at all, my poor dice rolling certainly not helping me in that regard. Seems much harder, at least in 2P form.
 
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Eddie
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I own death angel. played a few times, solo and with a buddy here and there. a decent game. i wouldn't say I'm a "fan" but the game is good.

I own lotr lcg. I'm a fan. over 200 plays. almost all solo (two-hand). deck building, each quest, I love it all.

tried pacg. owned it for a while. tried solo... something didnt click. felt it needed to be played with a buddy. played with a buddy. was fun... but yes, we realized it was too much of flip-roll-thats-it

got warhammer acg. played a bit solo, and with a buddy. AT THE PRICE IT IS, its a great game. like death angel but it will feel less random "roll a 1 thats it game over" that death angel is notorious for (I feel that die rolls there are a HUGE part of if you win or not. like hostage negotiator). lotr lcg your deck decisions are a large part of whether you'll win or not (still very random - did you draw what you need, did you draw the terrible treachery card or not).

there is a chance you like warhammer acg without liking death angel. if you loved LOTR LCG but needed it to be less intense (in terms of $$ or time committment etc) you will like warhammer ag. just realize that right now, imho, its limited in replay... thats okay, see my point re: price. hope they expand it, but well worth it and the gameplay IS fun.
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Scott
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Thanks everyone - this was immensely helpful. Think I will give it a go!
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Jorge B
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I depends a bit on what you didn't like in DA.
If you know both LOTR and DA, I think a fair description is that it is a LOTR-like system with an action selection mechanism in the vein of DA instead of a deck and hand of cards. Another similarity with DA is the use of dice to decide the outcome of the actions.
Nevertheless, even though the similarities are there, it put its own spin on things. A major difference wrt DA is that the dice outcomes seem more stable and less swingy than DA. The game feels more "predictible" and controlled than DA, albeit not much less brutal imho. Action refresh is also handled differently.




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