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Subject: Rant-o-the-Day #3: Dog Travelers rss

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Randy Cox
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Almost two weeks ago, we headed out in the car on our way to Fort Lauderdale to catch a boat. That’s a long drive (725 to 800 miles, depending upon which route you take). What with having little kids in the back seat, we planned a few stops—Riverbanks Zoo in Columbia, meals, and plenty of time in rest areas to run around and stretch the legs. We’ve done this on all of our long trips and I see the same annoying thing from pinheads no matter which route I take or which direction I’m driving. I see crazy-ass dog lovers.

[rant]

I’m not talking about people who just want to rub their dogs on the head and let them bring in the morning paper. Noooo, I’m talking about those crazy bastards who think that their dog is another member of the family. [No offense to my buddy Bruce Linsey, who loves his dogs, and I have no idea into which category of dog-lover he falls.]

I think there are a few layers to the dog loving population. First, there are the “I like dogs” group. I think they enjoy their dogs, but they don’t bring them in the house unless it’s a special occasion (if ever). These people are OK, so long as they leave their dogs in their yard. I have a neighbor who has an outside dog and a fence, but doesn’t keep the dog properly restrained even though we have a county-wide leash law, hence the dog runs around and shits, often in our yard. I hate that. I do wish such dog owners would just give away their dogs, as they aren’t keeping up with their pet.

I have another neighbor who likes their dog, or at least tolerates it. But it stays in the pen all the time unless it’s on a leash being moved to another fenced play area. That’s a good pet owner, albeit one who owns a rottweiler, a dog that shouldn’t be allowed to mingle with humans.

There’s another group who let their dogs hang out in the house (yuck). Again, if they are good about keeping the dogs in the confines of their living quarters and yard, that’s great. However, a lot of these people like to tell me, “Dogs are people, too.” Yikes. I hate hearing that. Dogs are canines, not people. They can’t talk; they can’t bathe themselves; they can’t clean up after themselves or brush their teeth or use a spoon. They can’t even change the TV channel. In short, they are far, far less of a person than your average toddler. And, by the way, we don’t let toddlers wander the neighborhood alone.

But the group I’m concerned with today is the “My dog is my child and I don’t give a damn about you higher-form animals” dog owner. Every time I stop in a rest area along the Interstate Highway System, I see people who have their dogs in the car with them. They actually bring the mutt along on the drive to see the ocean, or the mountain, or Disney World, or dear Aunt Sally. OK. I can imagine at the farthest reaches of my mind that some people may desire that companionship for the trip—if they’re alone. But, hell, I see entire families the size of The Brady Bunch lugging poor ol’ Tiger along with them. What a mess!

Anyway, what really pisses me off about this group of dog lover is their total disdain for following posted regulations. Or maybe they’re all illiterate. Just about every rest area that has any sort of play space also has a pet walk area. And I saw so many people last week standing in front of the sign that read “Picnic Area – No Pets, please use the Pet Walk Area” blissfully letting Fido or Fifo or Rover run free. They just didn’t give a damn and were going to let their precious little ankle-biter shit where the people are supposed to go. And over in the immaculate pet walk area? No one. Not a soul. Just like back home. They pet turf pristine and foul the place where regular people (ie, non-dog-owners) go.

[/rant]
 
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Dave Lartigue
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Marc P
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Sorry Randy, I'm just not feeling this one. It's tough to leave a dog at home because of the amount of care they require. I do agree that people should be considerate about keeping the animal on their property and in control when in public places. But I hope the rant made you feel better!
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John O'Haver
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Quote:
They just didn’t give a damn and were going to let their precious little ankle-biter shit where the people are supposed to go.



In the RESTROOMS!???


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pronoblem baalberith
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Pet ownership is absurd to begin with. Rant = moot.
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John O'Haver
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I feel for ya. One of my neighbors got two young dogs awhile back and just got another one. She always waves when she's out walking them and I always go over and kneel down and let the little mutts sniff and lick my hands...sigh... mostly because my neighbor has perfect perky breasts.
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Dave Lartigue
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Randy Cox wrote:
Just about every rest area that has any sort of play space also has a pet walk area. And I saw so many people last week standing in front of the sign that read “Picnic Area – No Pets, please use the Pet Walk Area” blissfully letting Fido or Fifo or Rover run free.


I've removed everything except the part you have a point about. Except for this little bit here, what the hell business is it of yours if people travel with pets?

"Sorry honey, I know we're on vacation and supposed to be relaxing, but I keep thinking about those people travelling with pets and it just makes me so mad!!"
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Philip Johnson
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Why don't you just delete your original post and replace it with the following:

I HATE DOGS
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John O'Haver
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I don't think he hates dogs. I suspect he thinks like me. Too many people treat their dogs like children and need to go wherever the family goes. Rules rules pertaining to mere DOGS do not pertain to their own Dog/Child.

The opposite side of the coin is, far too many people should not own dogs at all.

I like most dogs as long as they belong to other people (regardless of the owner's perfect perkies) and are reasonably well behaved, properly taken care of and treated as the ANIMALS they are.
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Dave Lartigue
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scribidinus wrote:
I don't think he hates dogs. I suspect he thinks like me. Too many people treat their dogs like children and need to go wherever the family goes. Rules rules pertaining to mere DOGS do not pertain to their own Dog/Child.

The opposite side of the coin is, far too many people should not own dogs at all.

I like most dogs as long as they belong to other people (regardless of the owner's perfect perkies) and are reasonably well behaved, properly taken care of and treated as the ANIMALS they are.


I feel pretty much the same way about children.
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Randy Cox
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slowcorner wrote:
Sorry Randy, I'm just not feeling this one. It's tough to leave a dog at home because of the amount of care they require. I do agree that people should be considerate about keeping the animal on their property and in control when in public places. But I hope the rant made you feel better!


What's so hard about putting the dog in their doghouse in their fenced-in yard and having little Tommy Tucker come over twice a day to give it Gravy Train and water? If it's cold, open up the crawlspace door under the house.
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Legomancer wrote:
scribidinus wrote:
I don't think he hates dogs. I suspect he thinks like me. Too many people treat their dogs like children and need to go wherever the family goes. Rules rules pertaining to mere DOGS do not pertain to their own Dog/Child.

The opposite side of the coin is, far too many people should not own dogs at all.

I like most dogs as long as they belong to other people (regardless of the owner's perfect perkies) and are reasonably well behaved, properly taken care of and treated as the ANIMALS they are.


I feel pretty much the same way about children.


BGG sums up my thoughts on this:

You gave this a thumbs up.
 
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William Scharnhorst
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Wow. I live in rural England good old Dorset. Yup where T.E. Laurence lived after the war. I just say that to make sure you know how rural this place is.
I worked in a pub here and nearly every one of our regulars brought there dog. You wont find a pub in this area where there isn't at least one dog in the pub. Its normal here. Now comes the great part kids are generally NOT allowed in pubs. They are tolerated at lunchtime. Even our chain pubs like Wetherspoons ( like hooters just without the hooting) have designated children spaces witch are usually hidden in some corner out of view from the rest of the pub. I think the sentiment here in england is that we like our dogs more than our children.

-Will
 
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Chaddyboy
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That’s a good pet owner, albeit one who owns a rottweiler, a dog that shouldn’t be allowed to mingle with humans.


You're kidding, right? I hear the same crap about our pitbull all the time. We take him to the dog park at least once a week, and there are a ton of other rottweilers and pitbulls that are regulars at the dog park which are some of the nicest dogs around. I'm guessing you don't know a heck of a lot about the breed.

Quote:
I have another neighbor who likes their dog, or at least tolerates it. But it stays in the pen all the time unless it’s on a leash being moved to another fenced play area. That’s a good pet owner...


Why even have a dog if you just want to keep it in the backyard and not interact with it? You might as well get a few garden gnomes in that case.
 
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Ray
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http://www.animalscam.com/

or even funnier:

http://www.petakillsanimals.com/article_detail.cfm?article=1...
 
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Randy Cox
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chaddyboy_2000 wrote:
Quote:
That’s a good pet owner, albeit one who owns a rottweiler, a dog that shouldn’t be allowed to mingle with humans.


You're kidding, right? I hear the same crap about our pitbull all the time. We take him to the dog park at least once a week, and there are a ton of other rottweilers and pitbulls that are regulars at the dog park which are some of the nicest dogs around. I'm guessing you don't know a heck of a lot about the breed.


No, I'm not kidding. I hear that "but this dog is nice and never bites" crap from lots of dog owners. Like the Rottweiler owner over in Greenville a few years back. His dog got loose and a nine-year-old in the neighborhood (big neighborhood) walked the dog from door to door asking if they knew who it belonged to. It was such a tame dog. So sweet. He went to dozens and dozens of doors until there was some little yappy dog in one back yard (inside a fence). The Rottweiler did what they do. He snapped, ripped the kid's throat out, and killed him.

And the story about the two year old who walked over to that nice pitbull in this county last year...

I could go on. Point is that dogs bred specifically for aggressiveness are never completely safe. Never. I had a kid (he's 26 now) pinned in a back yard by that other nice Rottweiler where I used to live. Nope, you'll never convince me that they're tame. In perfect or semi-perfect circumstances with the perfect mix of people and dogs, maybe. But random chance is too great to tolerate those breeds of dogs.

Quote:
Why even have a dog if you just want to keep it in the backyard and not interact with it? You might as well get a few garden gnomes in that case.

I didn't say the neighbor doesn't interact with the dog. He feeds it and plays around with it every day. And he takes the dog over to his neighbor's yard (his mother-in-law) to let him run around a bit and be frisky. You know. Dog stuff.
 
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Boo
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For a variety of reasons I have issues with people who have large and or naturally aggressive dogs who do not properly train them or keep them leashed in public.

This is the most recent reason:
2 week before Christmas (just over a month ago) my husband was out doing his usual 7 am Saturday morning run. We live in a highly populated suburb with lots of kids around. A large boxer came after my husband and bit him several times on the arms, hands, and legs. There was no owner in sight so my husband attempted to get away from the dog and run home since it was only two blocks away. My parents and I spotted him from the kitchen window and came out to help. The dog ran off. I call by-law services and they sent someone out right away to look for the dog, unfortunately he could not locate the dog and all the houses around where the incident started denied having a dog with that description.

By law - since we were unable to locate the dog my husband had to have rabies shots. 9 needles the first night and then more needles on successive days. We spent over 20 hours in emergency in all and then also had to replace all his winter running gear at a cost of $300.00 because we could not get the blood out or fix all the tears.

We figure that someone thought that it was too cold to walk their dog and let it out on its own. All of our neighbours are very upset over this because they all have small children and if the dog was willing to go after my husband who is 5'9" then what could it do to a child.

If we ever find out who the dog belongs to then I will be taking them to civil court to pay for my husband's lost work hours and his running clothes.

Now don't get me wrong here, I do love animals. I have had as pets dogs, cats, budgies, rats, hamsters, and hermit crabs. My current pet, a cat, is completly an indoor cat (I do not see any reason why she needs to go outside) she has a collar with a tag giving her name and address anyway as well as a microchip just in case she loses her collar, she also has a license tag from the city. I just believe that when you have a pet that can do that kind of damage to someone that it should be trained with at minimum 2 levels of obedience classes and should never be out loose without the owner. If you cannot afford it then you should NOT have a pet like that.
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Chaddyboy
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I could go on. Point is that dogs bred specifically for aggressiveness are never completely safe. Never.


BS. Any dog can snap, regardless of breed. I've seen more fights at the dog park between labs and retrievers than pitbulls and rotties.

Our veterinarian has even told us that pitbulls are great family dogs.

edit - crap, I can't spell today.
 
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chaddyboy_2000 wrote:
BS. Any dog can snap, regardless of breed. I've seen more fights at the dog park between labs and retrievers than pitbulls and rotties.


The problem is, a loose pit bull or rottie might chase a child that runs away from it and then the dogs takes the child down and kills it. It has happened, I really don't care what "good owner" owns a certain dog or the fact that certain breeds have as many or more good examples as bad, most pet owners are irresponsible and if eliminating the risk of certain breeds getting into the wrong hands means banning those breeds then fine - no one person NEEDS a certain breed of dog, for that matter no one NEEDS to own any dog. Why don't they allow people to have lions or bears as pets? Besides, the pet industry is a waste of resources and if you are concerned with the health and welfare of animals in general please consider that the industry kills many animals at the breeder and mistreats them at the retail / pet shop end (once you own a pet you still support this industry)... not to mention the wastes involved in killing an animal and putting it in a can to feed another animal (one that ultimately serves no real purpose on this planet)... that's my biggest complaint with pet ownership. Most dogs in the US eat better than half of the world population. Pet ownership is a relic of some sort of primitive human nature, it's the 21st century time to grow out of it... and soon, technology will replace guide animals.
 
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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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I just want to add that my Miniature Schnauzers love going to the boarding kennel. Sure, its an extra cost. But that $20 a day both save us aggravation, and gives both us and the dogs a break from each other.

 
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chaddyboy_2000 wrote:
Quote:
I could go on. Point is that dogs bred specifically for aggressiveness are never completely safe. Never.


BS. Any dog can snap, regardless of breed. I've seen more fights at the dog park between labs and retrievers than pitbulls and rotties.

Our veterinarian has even told us that pitbulls are great family dogs.

edit - crap, I can't spell today.


All I was going to say was that those other breeds don't usually kill a kid (or adult) when they snap. But Pronoblem said it better.
 
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Isaac Citrom
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Chad;

What you say just doesn't wash. I pay attention to this particular subject when it comes up in the news. I would say it is about a bi-weekly to monthly event that a child (normally, or another dog) is mauled to death by a rottweiler or a pitbull. We are not talking about a random bite which happens often enough across all breeds.

If you believe that rottweilers and pitbulls are not killers then in my opinion you are not being intellectually honest.

Moreover, an important point is that although often dogs of this breed will go for years being the happy-go-lucky family pet, when they do snap they kill!

I have also noticed that it is a certain type of dog owner that goes for a rottweiler or pitbull knowing their reputation. There are so many breeds out there one can almost cherry-pick the traits one wants. I find owners specifically seek out these breeds exactly because of their reputation for agressiveness. It is the specific reason for getting a rottweiler or a pitbull. Whatever after-the-fact excuses are given in terms of likable traits those very same traits exist in many breeds that are not killers. For example, a german sheppard makes an eminently better guard dog.

Google it and you will plainly see just how many children are regularly ripped to death.

In my opinion there is no reason to have these two breeds alive at all. A few specimens ought to be kept alive in zoos for posterity's sake and the rest put down. It ought to be illegal to own one. And, if there were any justice, owners who's dogs kill ought to be charged with some very serious offence such as criminally negligent homicide.


With respect to earlier posts where an attempt is made to make a moral equivalence between children and dogs, I think those posters readily demonstrate the implicit point that was missed. Children, even if bratty, are human beings and ought to be accorded a certain level of respect inline with their humanity. A dog, in a good part of the world, is a food animal. Although I too grind my teeth with the temper tantrumming mall bratt, there is no moral equivalence between something like that and those friendly neighbours of mine who release their cats to screetch in heat all night long.

I once had a friendly conversation with an unmarried female co-worker. I smiled politely as she went on at length about how much she exactly feels like a parent in taking care of her dog.

Left alone in a room with a dog I too will be on the floor rolling around with Rover. I don't hate dogs, rather I can't stand most dog owners. By what twisted logic on God's green Earth do dog owners conclude that their dog's urine and feces is welcome on my lawn when it is clearly too disgusting for their own--even if they pick up. When calling out a dog owner I have heard every sales pitch there is regarding their dog's bodily functions. The final response can always be along the lines of, "yes, I agree. But, why doesn't that apply to your property?!" I sometimes think we all live in the insanity of some higher being when I look out my window and see the daily ritual as dog owners--each and every one--bundle up, walk their dogs to someone else's property, have it crap on it, and then hurry back home. Of course, they're just exercising their dogs, aren't they.

I was dropping off my son at school one morning and we arrived a bit too early, so I waited with him. Lo and behold, Mr. the-sole-exception-among-dog-owners, is allowing his dog to defecate in a school yard where children run around. I called him out on it and boy was he upset that someone had the temerity to even bring up the subject. Similarly, I do not understand what business at all dogs have in the park where children run and play.



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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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A few simple facts from http://www.dogbitelaw.com/PAGES/statistics.html

- Rottweilers and Pitbulls are the top two "killer" breeds.
- Fatal dog attacks are very rare. On average, 17 a year in the US (data from 79-96). 70% of these were children.
- If we removed all Rottweilers and Pitbulls from pet ownership, the impact on dog bite statistics would be negligible.


Conclusion: if it bleeds it leads. "Dangerous" breeds are a vastly overstated problem and pretty much any dog can bite, and a lot of them do.

..


But if I read Issac correctly and he is objecting to concientious pet owners who scoop from his lawn...er...thats really over the top, man.


 
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Apotheos;

Why can they not scoop from their own lawn. Why do they come to my lawn?! Is it because in the end it is too disgusting. No matter what is said, why bring their dogs elsewhere?

Also, your argument about dog bites only demonstrates that there are too many and that if anything all dogs ought to be muzzled. That is not my argument. Rather, I am pointing out that your argument says that the minimal number of deaths by mauling is justified by the huge number of non-fatal dog attacks. Respectfully, that is non-sensical.

Approximately 50,000 Americans die every year in automobile related incidents. Americans accept this annual Vietnam War sized figure because of the obvious usefulness of cars. Apotheos, exactly what is the benefit that warrants 17 people a year being ripped to death? So, some people can beat their chests in that they own a pitbull?

I notice that I never ever hear an argument as to why exactly it is so necessary to own a pitbull or a rottweiler when there are literally hundreds of other breeds to choose from. Every time someone speaks up about rottweilers and pitbulls it is almost always an argument related to the acceptable nature of the relatively small number of deaths.

So, if mine and others' hobby is to drag young children behind our cars, so long as deaths are kept under an average of 18 per year, it's OK then, right? Yes, there are many other hobbies from which to choose, but I like this one. Besides, most car owners don't drag any kids at all.

Time and again what I find is that everything eventually boils down to that a certain number of excruciating deaths are acceptable to the dog owning community at large in order to satisfy the penchant for owning these two breeds.

My neighbour has a rottweiler that continually growls at the children gathered at the school bus stop. And, no they are not teasing the dog. They are actually scared. (As if teasing justified anything). Even though the neighbour installed an electrified collar system why is it that the neighbourhood's parents need to live with this extra bit of fear. Why exactly was such an expensive safety system even required?!

And then, if this dog snaps and one of the children become part of this minimal statistic, out come the specious arguments.

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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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isaacc wrote:

Why can they not scoop from their own lawn. Why do they come to my lawn?! Is it because in the end it is too disgusting. No matter what is said, why bring their dogs elsewhere?


My dogs just go wherever the feel the need to on walks. It is a natural process that causes no harm as I remove the solid waste. There is no impact, so there is no problem. Indeed, the natural of order of things is such that you lawn benefits from the nutrients left in the urine.

As long as you don't run right out and roll in it there isn't a problem.

Quote:

Also, your argument about dog bites only demonstrates that there are too many and that if anything all dogs ought to be muzzled. That is not my argument. Rather, I am pointing out that your argument says that the minimal number of deaths by mauling is justified by the huge number of non-fatal dog attacks. Respectfully, that is non-sensical.


My argument demonstrates nothing. I just illustrated the extremely low incidence of canine induced fatality. Why don't we do anything about it? The same reason we don't outlaw smoking which kills a hell of a lot more people: for the government to interfere in personal choice there must be a dramatic and substantial effect on preserving the public good. And no, 17 lives saved doesn't count. Thats not to be cruel, thats just how statistics work.
 
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