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Subject: Official Blood Rage Organizer/Insert rss

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Greg Spence
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Our official-licensed Blood Rage Organizer is currently in development and I thought I'd try something new by asking the community what you'd like to see from our organizer.

Besides the obvious of fitting everything into the box and cutting down setup times, what else would you like to see? The advantage of us working with CMON is the ability to use game art and logos in our design.

What would make this organizer extra cool for you?

How would you like to see the minis stored?

Would you like to see the cards organized into a tray that sits right on top of the "Ages" card?

How do you want to see the cards separated? Do you want to store them by age only, or do you want to separate them by the number of players as well? This would add a lot more dividers and require a separate card holder from the tray that sits on the ages card.

Any other cool additions you'd like to see similar to what we've done in the past with custom start player tokens, custom helicopter for Zombicide, etc?

Thanks in advance for the feedback. We'd love to work with you directly to make this the best insert possible!

- Greg
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Don Sombrero
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Two main concerns:

1. Accommodate sleeved cards.

2. The spears are extremely easy to bend. At least those couple figures need some soft storage.
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Matt Watkins
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Will this be in the same wooden style as your other products? Or will this be a molded type to fit the figures securely? And foam inserts? As for the cards I wouldn't mind them all being separated by just the ages, doing it by player count seems a bit excessive. Looking forward to seeing it!
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Greg Spence
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Don Sombrero wrote:
Two main concerns:

1. Accommodate sleeved cards.

2. The spears are extremely easy to bend. At least those couple figures need some soft storage.


1. Most definitely. This is a given with all of our organizers.

2. Yep, several of mine are bent from shaking around in the box. I don't think soft will be possible with our solution but we will certainly make room for their size.
 
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Greg Spence
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Goemon12677 wrote:
Will this be in the same wooden style as your other products? Or will this be a molded type to fit the figures securely? And foam inserts? As for the cards I wouldn't mind them all being separated by just the ages, doing it by player count seems a bit excessive. Looking forward to seeing it!


It will be a wooden organizer like our others. This means that it'll be more ideal for non-painted figures due to the space-constraints of the box. There's just no way to give every figure their own little compartment. Even with vac-formed trays, there wouldn't be enough space in the box for all the minis and that also wouldn't allow for the addition of any new components in the future.
 
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aron craig
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Minis - However they are stored I would very much like to see it where a removable tray holds the each clan so you can grab the thing out and drop it in front of the player.

Cards - I don't think it's worth a bunch of extra dividers and such for separating player count, but maybe if there's room a little extra cards space to keep the extras above whatever your playgroup's standard number is, i.e. if I almost always play with just two there's a spot somewhere to stow the extras. That might be a good way to balance complexity with quick setup.

Pie-in-the-sky - Some kind of dashboard type thingy. Cards and markers sliding around is a problem here. I know this is a long-shot since it would probably involve in a clear acrylic which is A) expensive and B) not something you do often.

Question/Concern - Unfortunately the KS extras put the insert in a bit of a weird place for this one. Backers have a whole extra clan worth of minis to account for. That's a lot of space to take up that no retail customers need. Are you planning on trying to fit all 6 in the box, or are you only looking at trying to make room for 5? This is also a concern there for the other extra plastic bits the KS backers got but those are much less impactful.

Thanks for your efforts and outreach!
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Greg Spence
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aroncraig wrote:
Minis - However they are stored I would very much like to see it where a removable tray holds the each clan so you can grab the thing out and drop it in front of the player.

Cards - I don't think it's worth a bunch of extra dividers and such for separating player count, but maybe if there's room a little extra cards space to keep the extras above whatever your playgroup's standard number is, i.e. if I almost always play with just two there's a spot somewhere to stow the extras. That might be a good way to balance complexity with quick setup.

Pie-in-the-sky - Some kind of dashboard type thingy. Cards and markers sliding around is a problem here. I know this is a long-shot since it would probably involve in a clear acrylic which is A) expensive and B) not something you do often.

Question/Concern - Unfortunately the KS extras put the insert in a bit of a weird place for this one. Backers have a whole extra clan worth of minis to account for. That's a lot of space to take up that no retail customers need. Are you planning on trying to fit all 6 in the box, or are you only looking at trying to make room for 5? This is also a concern there for the other extra plastic bits the KS backers got but those are much less impactful.

Thanks for your efforts and outreach!


Thanks for the suggestions! Agreed on the separate containers for minis and colored bases. It'll be much easier to hand the player everything they need.

Also agreed on the card storage. I prefer a simple tray that doubles as a card holder.

I also considered the acrylic tray accessory, but this would be sold separate rather than part of the organizer, kind of like our Eclipse resource trays, but something that organizes the entire player sheet.

As for the KS extras, I really think the organizer wouldn't be complete if there weren't room for them. We would also alienate all the KS backers and that's the last thing we'd want to do. So for non-KS customers, they'd have some extra compartments to either spread things out more, or just save for potential future expansions.
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Hermes Padilla
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So when can we expect this awesome product?? Any tentative date for next year?
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Paulo Renato
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gspence wrote:
aroncraig wrote:
Minis - However they are stored I would very much like to see it where a removable tray holds the each clan so you can grab the thing out and drop it in front of the player.

Cards - I don't think it's worth a bunch of extra dividers and such for separating player count, but maybe if there's room a little extra cards space to keep the extras above whatever your playgroup's standard number is, i.e. if I almost always play with just two there's a spot somewhere to stow the extras. That might be a good way to balance complexity with quick setup.

Pie-in-the-sky - Some kind of dashboard type thingy. Cards and markers sliding around is a problem here. I know this is a long-shot since it would probably involve in a clear acrylic which is A) expensive and B) not something you do often.

Question/Concern - Unfortunately the KS extras put the insert in a bit of a weird place for this one. Backers have a whole extra clan worth of minis to account for. That's a lot of space to take up that no retail customers need. Are you planning on trying to fit all 6 in the box, or are you only looking at trying to make room for 5? This is also a concern there for the other extra plastic bits the KS backers got but those are much less impactful.

Thanks for your efforts and outreach!


Thanks for the suggestions! Agreed on the separate containers for minis and colored bases. It'll be much easier to hand the player everything they need.

Also agreed on the card storage. I prefer a simple tray that doubles as a card holder.

I also considered the acrylic tray accessory, but this would be sold separate rather than part of the organizer, kind of like our Eclipse resource trays, but something that organizes the entire player sheet.

As for the KS extras, I really think the organizer wouldn't be complete if there weren't room for them. We would also alienate all the KS backers and that's the last thing we'd want to do. So for non-KS customers, they'd have some extra compartments to either spread things out more, or just save for potential future expansions.


The highlighted part would be great and even more if you take that into consideration and make room for it in the insert!

I would also like to know what is the ETA on this, there's already another insert out there so, time is important

I have your insert for Mage Knight and I just love it!!
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Greg Spence
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Violin86 wrote:
So when can we expect this awesome product?? Any tentative date for next year?


Realistically it would be around the end of January or very early February at the latest. We're also moving the entire company to a new building in January so that'll delay a few things.
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Brett Smith
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Would like to see seperate trays for player counts in game like a 2 player game and there monsters and cards, another tray for the 3-4 player game extras and cards and a final tray for the 5th player extras that would help keep it all organized and very easy to pull out what you need for player count you are playing. Thanks for letting us put in input and look forward to see what you come up with!
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Kevin Burkhardsmeier
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I think it would be great to have separate player bins that includes space for clans and tokens that easily could be pulled out and given to each player.
Perhaps a seperate removable tray for the monsters.

Just a thought given Kickstarter, expansions and space.
Perhaps make an insert comparable with the Hobby Lobby Box and do some licensed engraving on the top.

That would really present this game in all its glory, but may require internal lids so things don't move too much.
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Dan Licata
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I'm not sure how feasible it is but if you had thin strips of slotted wood that could be glued to the bottom (guidelines on where to glue them would be nice) so you could slide the bases of the minis in between two strips that would hold the mini's to the bottom of the insert so that the bases would be 'secured' to the bottom and the figures would just need to be slid in/out. That would be better for protecting the spears as well as giving those that paint their mini's more of a comfort level. Also would decrease on the need for walls if the mini's were more secured and would save space and make room for more stuff.
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Roger Rigby
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aroncraig wrote:
Pie-in-the-sky - Some kind of dashboard type thingy. Cards and markers sliding around is a problem here. I know this is a long-shot since it would probably involve in a clear acrylic which is A) expensive and B) not something you do often.


I have designed a clan overlay as you describe. Details of the process can be found here. Tabletop Tesla beginning on October 24, 2015 I would love to see the organizer have the needed space to hold 5 of these 3mm acrylic overlays.
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Greg Spence
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danlicata wrote:
I'm not sure how feasible it is but if you had thin strips of slotted wood that could be glued to the bottom (guidelines on where to glue them would be nice) so you could slide the bases of the minis in between two strips that would hold the mini's to the bottom of the insert so that the bases would be 'secured' to the bottom and the figures would just need to be slid in/out. That would be better for protecting the spears as well as giving those that paint their mini's more of a comfort level. Also would decrease on the need for walls if the mini's were more secured and would save space and make room for more stuff.


I like the idea of the slotted base to hold them upright. The biggest problem I see with storing them that way is for some of the factions, their leaders have a really tall spear or banner and that requires the entire container to be as tall as the tallest mini. So IOW, lots of empty wasted space in the container and probably not enough room in the box to store all the minis straight up and still have room for the monsters and cards. However, I'll certainly give that option some more thought.
 
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Dan Licata
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gspence wrote:


I like the idea of the slotted base to hold them upright. The biggest problem I see with storing them that way is for some of the factions, their leaders have a really tall spear or banner and that requires the entire container to be as tall as the tallest mini. So IOW, lots of empty wasted space in the container and probably not enough room in the box to store all the minis straight up and still have room for the monsters and cards. However, I'll certainly give that option some more thought.


I don't see why the entire container would need to be as tall. Part of it sure, the part where those minis are located but it doesn't have to be even level around the whole container. The empty space in the areas that aren't as tall can be used for levelled component/card storage to bring it up even to the height where the taller minis are.

Edit:

Also might be possible if you lay them on their side rather then standing up, possibly with some simple cuts in the bottom the bases could slide into. this would allow you to use some of the negative space in between minis for the spears to poke up into. This thread talks about something similar that a guy did with foam core, I don't think the spikes would work with wood though.

Of course this wouldn't work for folks that base their minis but I guess you have to draw the line somewhere.
 
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Greg Spence
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danlicata wrote:
gspence wrote:


I like the idea of the slotted base to hold them upright. The biggest problem I see with storing them that way is for some of the factions, their leaders have a really tall spear or banner and that requires the entire container to be as tall as the tallest mini. So IOW, lots of empty wasted space in the container and probably not enough room in the box to store all the minis straight up and still have room for the monsters and cards. However, I'll certainly give that option some more thought.


I don't see why the entire container would need to be as tall. Part of it sure, the part where those minis are located but it doesn't have to be even level around the whole container. The empty space in the areas that aren't as tall can be used for levelled component/card storage to bring it up even to the height where the taller minis are.

Edit:

Also might be possible if you lay them on their side rather then standing up, possibly with some simple cuts in the bottom the bases could slide into. this would allow you to use some of the negative space in between minis for the spears to poke up into. This thread talks about something similar that a guy did with foam core, I don't think the spikes would work with wood though.

Of course this wouldn't work for folks that base their minis but I guess you have to draw the line somewhere.


It's often hard to communicate about organizer design in just words. So perhaps it didn't make sense when I said the "entire container" would have to be as tall. I was speaking about just the container for holding that single clan, not the entire box. You can't really have a spear stick up out of the clan container or the tray that sits on top would have to have some strange cutout for it, which means you have to put everything back in a very specific order. We also have to juggle over-complexity because it greatly increases the cost of the organizer.

I checked out the images you send of the foamcore solution but the biggest issue I see is that those nice rows of minis are going to move as soon as you tilt the box and vertical storage is a definite no-go with that layout.

Like you said, we have to draw the line somewhere, and typically with miniature games it ends up being at painted vs non-painted minis. Assuming non-painted, we can be more flexible with how to store the minis and keep them safe during transport.

Thank you for all the feedback!

 
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Paulo Renato
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Going completely off topic here Greg, but since you guys are the official parteners of CMoN will you be doing an insert for Dogs of War (including of course the KS exclusives)?

Thanks
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Greg Spence
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Muse23PT wrote:
Going completely off topic here Greg, but since you guys are the official parteners of CMoN will you be doing an insert for Dogs of War (including of course the KS exclusives)?

Thanks


Our agreement does span multiple games but its probably too early to speak about some of them at the moment. Our Zombicide line releases in the next two weeks with Blood Rage to come shortly after.
 
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Dan Thorpe
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The insert needs to maintain order at side storage as well as being level when on the shelf.
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Eric Smith
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Totally an aesthetic wish, but if you did do removable trays for the clans, I would LOVE to see their emblems' design burned into the wood. That would add some serious extra cool points for me.


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aron craig
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theitalianviking wrote:
Totally an aesthetic wish, but if you did do removable trays for the clans, I would LOVE to see their emblems' design burned into the wood. That would add some serious extra cool points for me.


Aye... assuming it doesn't change the costs much having clan logos mark their trays would be cool. Same thing would be nice across the board - icons for where the different age cards go, slots for the monsters (either icons for each if separate or a more general icon / text if dropped in a common bin), etc. Something sort of like this insert has really helps with the quick tear-down.
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Todd Adams
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The one thing that I think is most important, is making sure that the miniatures have ample room. For those of us who paint, I don't want to throw all the minis in a small section loosely. They don't necessarily need to be secured (thought it would be great), but they need to have room so the paint isn't rubbing off.

A card organizer that you can take out and place on top of the "Ages" card would be real nice, as long as it fits sleeved cards. I think a three section card organizer for to place on the age card, and then a small section for cards that you are not currently using would be useful.
 
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Greg Spence
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theitalianviking wrote:
Totally an aesthetic wish, but if you did do removable trays for the clans, I would LOVE to see their emblems' design burned into the wood. That would add some serious extra cool points for me.




Agreed and that part is already done and looking good. Here's a sample of the Bear clan logo, but please excuse the grunginess on the edges. We often do a quick sand when prototyping. The final copies will be cleaner and crisper.



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Greg Spence
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tcadams18 wrote:
The one thing that I think is most important, is making sure that the miniatures have ample room. For those of us who paint, I don't want to throw all the minis in a small section loosely. They don't necessarily need to be secured (thought it would be great), but they need to have room so the paint isn't rubbing off.

A card organizer that you can take out and place on top of the "Ages" card would be real nice, as long as it fits sleeved cards. I think a three section card organizer for to place on the age card, and then a small section for cards that you are not currently using would be useful.


We've definitely got a 3-section card holder created and I agree with a smaller section for the unused cards too.

As far as storing painted minis, it creates a bit of a problem with space in the box. There are just so many minis in this game and we have to account for the Kickstarter extras as well. We are looking at having separation for the gods and monsters, but the individual clans would require a lot more space if they each had their own compartment and I don't think the box would support it. We will do our best.
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