Andrew Wilson
United Kingdom
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If you use the veto power it says in the rules:

"Each use of the veto power represents an inactive government and
advances the election tracker by one."

It also states:

"Reset the Election Tracker after a policy is enacted by the
populace or a government is successfully elected."

Since before you veto, you successfully elect a government, does the election tracker get reset and then advance to the first space?

I had a situation where the election tracker was 1 spot away from the end and then we used the veto power. There was some confusion as to whether we reset the election tracker first and then advanced it by one to the first space, or if the election tracker simply advanced from the space it was in before the government got elected, forcing us to top deck the next policy.
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Mariusz Kosecki
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Elbląg
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Good catch!

We've played it the way that a successful veto counts as a downvoted government (so the tracker is reset only after enacting a policy, not just after choosing the government).

I think this is the way it was intended to work: the veto power allows you (as a liberal) to dump 2 or 3 fascist policy cards upping the chances of a liberal policy draw for the next government. Resetting the track would seem as too big advantage IMO.

However, this should be clarified by the designers.
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Jarek
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Indeed, rules aren't clear in that case.

Assume for a moment, that 5 Fascists policies are enacted in a 10 player game. If 3 upcoming Presidents are Fascist, then you're screwed. But even if only 2 of them are Fascists, the 1 remaining Liberal President can only defend against one set of 3F policies and then it's down to random policy being enacted.
So either election tracker _should_ reset in case of Veto power, or long streaks of Fascist presidents might be an almost auto-win for Fascists. If that's the case, then Resistance is better in that aspect of the game. If all rebels trust each other, they're guaranteed to win M5. In Secret Hitler all Liberals trusting each other can still lose due to bad policy draw or long streak of Fascist Presidents.
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James Clifford
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Reading the rules you would move one on the tracker. If you are already at two, then successfully elect a government, the tracker moved back to the start. IF that government vetoes the policies, the tracker moves one on the board.
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K
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SpleenballPro wrote:
Reading the rules you would move one on the tracker. If you are already at two, then successfully elect a government, the tracker moved back to the start. IF that government vetoes the policies, the tracker moves one on the board.


Yeah, this is right reading of the rules. The only reason it doesn't sit right is because "enact a policy" portion seems completely unnecessary if the intention is for it to reset immediately after electing a government, so some assurance that this isn't a mixup because of an older outdated rule or something would be nice

EDIT: Actually, nevermind, the reason it provides both of those conditions for election tracker resetting is so it properly resets both after a top-deck and when a government is voted in. So the rules are actually quite clear.

But either way, yeah, the result is that it is actually impossible to lose due to bad luck if you only elect 100% liberal governments at the end.
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James Clifford
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SirHandsome wrote:
SpleenballPro wrote:
Reading the rules you would move one on the tracker. If you are already at two, then successfully elect a government, the tracker moved back to the start. IF that government vetoes the policies, the tracker moves one on the board.


Yeah, this is right reading of the rules. The only reason it doesn't sit right is because "enact a policy" portion seems completely unnecessary if the intention is for it to reset immediately after electing a government, so some assurance that this isn't a mixup because of an older outdated rule or something would be nice


It isn't enacting a policy, it is inactive government. If you look at the process as a whole and not just the voting, that is where the rule makes sense. It works because when you vote in the government they MUST enact a policy until the veto is unlocked. It moves back because it is an expectation that a policy will come from the election. The rules even state to move the tracker back to the start once a policy is enacted or a government is elected.
 
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David Tran
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SpleenballPro wrote:
Reading the rules you would move one on the tracker. If you are already at two, then successfully elect a government, the tracker moved back to the start. IF that government vetoes the policies, the tracker moves one on the board.


This does seem like the correct interpretation if we were just reading from the rule book. That being considered, the designers have played as if electing a new government in the last policy does not reset the tracker. This leads me to believe that this is not how it is intended.

Below is the Twitch VOD where they get to the last policy and they make it quite clear that the tracker does not reset for the final policy.

http://www.twitch.tv/maxistentialist/v/30168163
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Andrew Wilson
United Kingdom
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I watched a little of that stream but I only see him saying "the election counter moves forward". It normally resets after a government is elected into power though. It still seems to me like it resets first and then the tracker moves forward to the first space once the veto power is used.

I think the confusion stems from the ambiguous term "inactive government". This is the only time it is used in the rules and it can be easily misinterpreted to mean that you handle it the same as if a government was not voted in at all. I think they just used this term to give some thematic reason as to why the election tracker would advance and it doesn't really have any special meaning. I hope the developers will be able to amend the rules and make this a little clearer though because it is quite easy to misinterpret.
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Nick Clinite
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What's confusing about that is, if they wanted it to only reset upon policy enactment, they should've just left out the part about it resetting upon government election. But the reverse of that is, if they wanted it to reset only upon government election, then why even mention it resetting on policy enactment? Policy enactment always requires a successfully elected government.

Ahh, nevermind, I get where my disconnect is now. It only resets upon a successfully elected government or the populace enacts the policy, not the government.

So, yes, by the rules, the tracker would reset to 0 upon the government getting elected, and then go up to 1 when they veto.
 
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Andrew Wilson
United Kingdom
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It turns out the rules are badly worded and the consensus in this thread is wrong.

Here is a stream where one of the devs says that you would top deck if you veto when on the last spot on the election tracker:

https://www.twitch.tv/cardsagainsthumanity/v/58079758?t=1h44...

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