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Subject: Going tribal with no elders rss

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Michael Cohn
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The "matriarch" daughter card says: "If this card is married to an alpha, convert to tribal."

What if a player does this while he has no elders?

It seems like, at the very least, you have to have the firestarter when you go tribal, or you're screwed. With the firestarter, you get the "cost-free elder-promotion," which presumably means you can add more elders that way. But you've got no more neolexia actions to mature elders with. Or is the idea that you just have to rely on hunting to free up vocabulary from then on?
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Chris Clarke
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I'm pretty sure you nailed it.

Ostensibly, hunting will be easier once you have access to Tribalism's benefits. But you're right, if you don't have the firestarter when you're tribal it will be your first priority.

(emphasis mine)

Living Rules

B3

• Immature Elders and Husbands. A disk dedicated to establish an elder or husband is placed under his cube to indicate he is not yet mature. This disk may be freed by neolexia (I2), hunting (G3), or domestic animals (H1).

• Immature Daughters, D Cards, and I Cards. Disks dedicated to bid on a daughter, to domesticate an animal, or create an invention are placed on the card to indicate it is not yet mature and its abilities are inactive. These disks may be freed by neolexia (I2), hunting (G3), or domestic animals (H1). The card is mature once all the disks are removed.

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Rich James
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Yes, you have to rely on hunting successes in that situation. It isn't the end of the world, but it is not automatically a good thing to go tribal, in my experience. As you say, having a mature fire starter while tribal is a good thing as you can freely promote other elders. Still, events can kill off any of your elders, so you will still have to look to hunting success if you lose that fire starter.
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Brett Burleigh II
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Something to consider, unless your Matriarch marries another Tribe's alpha, you'll need to have at least one matured Elder to empower your Alpha and trigger the special ability...

Keep in mind, if another Tribe courts the matriarch with an Alpha, you both instantly flip to Tribal!
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Chris Clarke
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Don't have the card in front of me...

Does it say explicitly that both parties go tribal?
 
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Kyrill Melai
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It doesn't have to. The daughter ability is shared by owner of the daughter and husband equally. Therefore if she marries an Alpha both players will flip to tribal.

As a side question, how is the original question related to the matriarch? The concern of going tribal with no elders applies equally when you go tribal by meeting the required number of portals.
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Chris Clarke
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NoDDs wrote:
It doesn't have to. The daughter ability is shared by owner of the daughter and husband equally. Therefore if she marries an Alpha both players will flip to tribal.


I guess I'll have to read the card text word for word. From how I imagine the card reads, I don't think I'd ever have interpreted it in the way you detailed. I always find it interesting to see what my eyes/brain gloss over in a ruleset.

[/q]
As a side question, how is the original question related to the matriarch? The concern of going tribal with no elders applies equally when you go tribal by meeting the required number of portals. [/q]


Good point. I don't think it is.
 
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Claudio Coppini
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If you go tribal with no elders, couldn't you also mature elders with neolexia using other vocal tribes portals if you are married to one of their daughters?
 
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Claudio Coppini
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Ah sorry, forgot that you cannot do portal and neolexia actions once you go tribal..
 
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