Bastiaan Reinink
Netherlands
Utrecht
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
For those of you who don't know it, Capoeira is a Brazilian martial arts form which looks like a dance and which incorporates acrobatics. The idea is to -not- hit each other (but to come as close to hitting as possible) and there are no formal winners. Instead there is a sort of unspoken "brownie point" system for how beautiful, fast and awesome you and your opponent's "fight" is.

I thought to put this into game form:

-2 players match of against each other and get 1 minute (use an hourglass. Or better, a minuteglass) to play cards from their hands. The idea is to play "combos": Player 1 attacks, player 2 defends and counter-attacks, which player 1 defends against (end of combo of 4 cards).
-At the end of a combo players get to re-draw some cards (but not as many as they played), indicating that they are getting tired.
-At the end of the 1 minute (or if players don't want to continue), the round ends and the players get a score for the cards played. Larger combos give more points. And both players get the same amount of points (as they are creating the combos together)
-Players draw back up (but fewer cards than their first hand, to indicate they're still tired)
-If at any time a player cannot or does not defend against an attack, there is a "hit" and the round immediately ends, without points being scored.
-A new round is played in which one of the players who just played stays and a new player joins in
-The game ends after a given number of rounds or when nobody wants to play anymore.

The game would require good reflexes, to be able to play the right card fast enough, which is very similar to the sport itself.

What do you guys think? Happy to receive any and all feedback!
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
'Bernard Wingrave'
United States
Wyoming
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Playing cards quickly onto the table seems like it could result in questions of who played a card first or who played one fast enough. This could result in bent cards. Are you planning to sleeve the cards? Or is there some other plan for dealing with cards that are made unusable (wrinkled, bent, etc) as a result of fast play?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robin Armstrong
United States
Utah
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I see nothing cooperative, semi- or otherwise, about this idea. Which is fine, but it's not as it's advertised.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim McCollum
United States
San Francisco
California
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmb
Defcon64 wrote:
I see nothing cooperative, semi- or otherwise, about this idea. Which is fine, but it's not as it's advertised.


It seems like the purpose is not to hit your partner, so both players are working together to play the right cards at the right time. Maybe I didn't get it, but that seems cooperative to me.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robin Armstrong
United States
Utah
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
jimmymacattack wrote:
It seems like the purpose is not to hit your partner, so both players are working together to play the right cards at the right time. Maybe I didn't get it, but that seems cooperative to me.

I admit that my judgement of the game was too quick, and there is something of a co-op in here. But this seems to be more reactionary rather than actually working together; the only difference being that players score points together rather than individually, so it's in both players' best interest to keep things going. So, yea, it's cooperative, but not really, so semi-cooperative is probably more accurate than I first thought.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bastiaan Reinink
Netherlands
Utrecht
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Defcon64 wrote:
jimmymacattack wrote:
It seems like the purpose is not to hit your partner, so both players are working together to play the right cards at the right time. Maybe I didn't get it, but that seems cooperative to me.

I admit that my judgement of the game was too quick, and there is something of a co-op in here. But this seems to be more reactionary rather than actually working together; the only difference being that players score points together rather than individually, so it's in both players' best interest to keep things going. So, yea, it's cooperative, but not really, so semi-cooperative is probably more accurate than I first thought.


Just to confirm: The idea is that players score points together, but they're still in competition. So semi-coop seemed like the best description for me.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bastiaan Reinink
Netherlands
Utrecht
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
bwingrave wrote:
Playing cards quickly onto the table seems like it could result in questions of who played a card first or who played one fast enough. This could result in bent cards. Are you planning to sleeve the cards? Or is there some other plan for dealing with cards that are made unusable (wrinkled, bent, etc) as a result of fast play?


As a humble game designer I'm not the one to tell people to sleeve their cards or not, but it's certainly possible.

Who played a card first might be a problem, though this might be turned into an advantage, as it means that all the other players need to pay attention to what is happening, to make sure that a "hit" is recorded properly, as it reduces the points for the people playing.

I also don't really see a need for secrecy of cards here. In capoeira there is usually a "tell", a move before the real move that lets the opponent know what move is being made (so they can anticipate). I might even incorporate that in the cards by putting a "tell" on the backside. The result would be that having cards "marked" is not an issue.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steven Tu
South Africa
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have always wanted to make a Capoeira game, at first digitally as a video game, where you're supposed to join in a roda and rhythmically combo with your friends This card game version sounds pretty good, except for the real time part, Real time tends to turn games into a bit of a panic mode, makes it hard to exercise any real strategy, and the possibility of ending up with illegal plays and needing to backtrack isn't great.

Real time games need a pause somewhere to let people check gamestate and punish for mess-ups. (galaxy trucker, xcom) Capoeira doesn't lend itself to that kind of interaction, I feel.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Benjamin Ng
msg tools
Avatar
mb
You know the card game Speed? I think this game could be cool if it had the same feel as that, but was cooperative. So, a game where you're collectively trying to play as many cards as possible in a certain time frame, but there are restrictions on what you can play when.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bastiaan Reinink
Netherlands
Utrecht
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Tuism wrote:
I have always wanted to make a Capoeira game, at first digitally as a video game, where you're supposed to join in a roda and rhythmically combo with your friends This card game version sounds pretty good, except for the real time part, Real time tends to turn games into a bit of a panic mode, makes it hard to exercise any real strategy, and the possibility of ending up with illegal plays and needing to backtrack isn't great.

Real time games need a pause somewhere to let people check gamestate and punish for mess-ups. (galaxy trucker, xcom) Capoeira doesn't lend itself to that kind of interaction, I feel.


One though I had would be to have an accompanying app (a-la X-Com), which wouldn't do much more than play music for 1 minute (you could also just download some capoeira music of course). The -suggestion- then would be to play your cards to the beat of the music.

And an "illegal" play would immediately end the game. There would be an incentive for the other players to look out for it (to limit points) and for the players to prevent this (to get as many points as possible).

Also, with the very limited playtime (1 minute) there is a natural "pause" moment I think.

Good points though, I'll give them some more thought!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Koen Hendrix
United Kingdom
Liverpool
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
Avatar
mb
If you're trying to score as long a combo as possible within one minute, your game will be a speed-fest of frantic drawing and playing.

Maybe you could include a metronome of some sort? So there is a 'beat', giving each player 5 seconds (or so) to play the next card. It would create some time pressure without rewarding super-fast play.

"The game ends ... when nobody wants to play anymore"
This is true for all games I know rodas can last forever as long as there's energy flowing, but I think you need to create a boardgame that captures the spirit of capoeira, not one that imitates each individual aspect.

To capture that cooperative feeling of capoeira, you might consider having a pair of winners. So 2 players are trying to create a beautiful game, and their score will reflect how good their game was. Then other combinations of players (perhaps you play once with each neighbour?) play their games, and the pair of players whose game scored highest wins.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bastiaan Reinink
Netherlands
Utrecht
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
khendrix wrote:
If you're trying to score as long a combo as possible within one minute, your game will be a speed-fest of frantic drawing and playing.

Yep, that's the idea. Though I would limit the amount of cards you're able to draw: Playing cards "tires you out" and when you catch your breath you get to redraw cards.

khendrix wrote:
Maybe you could include a metronome of some sort?

Having some (real) capoeira music (from an app, or just Youtube) would work for that

khendrix wrote:
"The game ends ... when nobody wants to play anymore"
This is true for all games I know rodas can last forever as long as there's energy flowing, but I think you need to create a boardgame that captures the spirit of capoeira, not one that imitates each individual aspect.

My idea for this was that at the end of a round you only re-draw part of your hand. So throughout the game you get fewer and fewer cards (as you get more and more tired). At some point you have too few cards to realistically play a game. Maybe add in something like having to have a minimum number of cards to be allowed to play, or giving a penalty if you play but don't do anything interesting at all. Something for a bit more thought...

khendrix wrote:
To capture that cooperative feeling of capoeira, you might consider having a pair of winners. So 2 players are trying to create a beautiful game, and their score will reflect how good their game was. Then other combinations of players (perhaps you play once with each neighbour?) play their games, and the pair of players whose game scored highest wins.


Interesting suggestion, thanks! I'll definitely give that some consideration.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.