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Subject: Dameo problem 5 (solution 4) rss

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christian freeling
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Dameo rules: wiki - mindsports - ig game center

Signs used are '?' for a bad move, '!' for a good one, '??' for a catastrophe, '!!' for a great find, '+' for a win and '=' for a draw or an even position.
_______________________________________________________________________

Procedure
I will upload a new Dameo problem every week with the solution of the previous one. That way there will be two problems to consider at any given time.
For all problems it's "White to move and win".
Solutions are given in successive diagrams and for each diagram it's "Black to move" (unless otherwise indicated).
________________________________________________________________________

Problem #5.


Author: Leo Springer (easy to see, he's better than me)
Warning: Beautiful but extremely difficult!
White a2 b2 c1 d1 e2 e4 f1 f3 g1 g5 h1 - Black a4 b4 c4 c5 c6 d7 e6 e7 g3 h3 h6

Poll
Dameo problem 5: White to move and win. What is the key move?
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
a23
0.0% 0
a2b3
0.0% 0
b2a3
0.0% 0
b23
0.0% 0
b2c3
0.0% 0
c1a3
0.0% 0
c12
0.0% 0
c1d2
0.0% 0
d1c2
0.0% 0
d12
0.0% 0
d1g4
0.0% 0
e2d3
0.0% 0
e23
0.0% 0
e2g4
0.0% 0
e4d5
0.0% 0
e45
25.0% 1
e4f5
0.0% 0
f1d3
0.0% 0
f12
0.0% 0
f1g2
0.0% 0
f3d5
0.0% 0
f34
0.0% 0
f3g4
50.0% 2
g1f2
0.0% 0
g12
0.0% 0
g1h2
0.0% 0
g5f6
25.0% 1
g56
0.0% 0
h1g2
0.0% 0
h12
0.0% 0
Voters 4
This poll is now closed.   4 answers
Poll created by christianF
Closes: Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:00 am

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's problem #4 and its solution.


White b2 b3 c2 c3 d3 d4 f3 g1 g2 - Black a2 a3 b6 c6 c8 d6 e6 f6 g5

Solution problem 4:
Spoiler (click to reveal)

Of four participants, three had it right:


1.b2e5 The key-move


1...e6xc4
2.c3x7


2...axg3
3.g2xa6


3...c8x6
4.a6b7 + (If Black promotes, White moves to c8, if Black moves c6d5 White moves to a8 and then ad8. In either case White can convert to a 2x1 kings endgame.)

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Rex Moore
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Regarding the solution to problem #4: Wow.

How tough is it, honestly, to "see" that... to keep the board state in your mind as you play through each capture?
 
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Harmonica
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You learn by practicing, as you begin to see certain patterns. Besides you are assured there is a solution. So to see a solution during a real game is way more difficult.
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Russ Williams
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Yeah, as a total newbie, I don't feel bad for not find the solutions to these tricky problems.

But it is indeed interesting to see them, even if actually solving them is beyond my level.
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christian freeling
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russ wrote:
Yeah, as a total newbie, I don't feel bad for not find the solutions to these tricky problems.

But it is indeed interesting to see them, even if actually solving them is beyond my level.

I can't help to notice the huge difference between the International Draughts community and the rest of the gaming world. Difficult problems are meant for seasoned Draughts players - and in that context problem #5 is far too difficult indeed - but the solutions show the depth of Draughts tactics. In 'combinations' such as these one player is forced to follow a an all but choiceless path. That's a feature of Draughts that can be found in other games, but hardly to the same degree. It is the stucture and interaction of the rules that allows these miracles. My impression is that outside the Draughts community the rules are widely misinterpreted, especially by players who are only familiar with Checkers.

Simple problems like the next one (I promise) give more insight to beginners.
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Rex Moore
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While we're all here... let me toss out a question I'd rather not start a new thread over: How is Dameo pronounced?

I figure the "a" could be like the "a" in ah, or dam, or lame.

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christian freeling
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orangeblood wrote:
While we're all here... let me toss out a question I'd rather not start a new thread over: How is Dameo pronounced?

I figure the "a" could be like the "a" in ah, or dam, or lame.


I'm no expert, but I use the "ah" 'a' and emphasis on the 'e'.
 
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Rex Moore
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christianF wrote:
orangeblood wrote:
While we're all here... let me toss out a question I'd rather not start a new thread over: How is Dameo pronounced?

I figure the "a" could be like the "a" in ah, or dam, or lame.


I'm no expert, but I use the "ah" 'a' and emphasis on the 'e'.


So rather than DAHM-mee-oh... dah-MAY-oh?

 
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christian freeling
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orangeblood wrote:
christianF wrote:
orangeblood wrote:
While we're all here... let me toss out a question I'd rather not start a new thread over: How is Dameo pronounced?

I figure the "a" could be like the "a" in ah, or dam, or lame.


I'm no expert, but I use the "ah" 'a' and emphasis on the 'e'.


So rather than DAHM-mee-oh... dah-MAY-oh?


Yep. Funny I didn't realise that it might be a question for english speaking posters.
 
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Harmonica
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russ wrote:
Yeah, as a total newbie, I don't feel bad for not find the solutions to these tricky problems.

But it is indeed interesting to see them, even if actually solving them is beyond my level.

Ahum ... Majority Capture ... *cough* *cough* ... Stick Move ...
 
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christian freeling
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anemaat wrote:
russ wrote:
Yeah, as a total newbie, I don't feel bad for not find the solutions to these tricky problems.

But it is indeed interesting to see them, even if actually solving them is beyond my level.

Ahum ... Majority Capture ... *cough* *cough* ... Stick Move ...

I'm not sure about the font size and the coughs, but majority capture means that a player who must capture and is facing different possible captures, must choose the capture (or a capture) that renders the maximum number of pieces. This leads implicitly to the emergence of 'stickers': pieces that are under immediate threat of capture but that cannot be taken because of a majority capture elsewhere. Draughts variants without the obligation of majority capture implicitly do not feature this tactical tool. In games that do have it, it always plays a very significant role in tactics.

I see that you're not unfamiliar with the implications, so your post remains somewhat mysterious I must confess.

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Russ Williams
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Sadly, knowing the concepts in theory does not imply being good at applying them in practice.
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christian freeling
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russ wrote:
Sadly, knowing the concepts in theory does not imply being good at applying them in practice.

No indeed, but does it ever? Here I can as yet trick many players, but I also meet considerable opposition by some (who are probably Draughts players). But the truth is I'm not not that much of a player. If I see real Draughts players analysing games, I'm more baffled than anything else by the speed of it. They see things in seconds that would take me the best part of an hour. When I made Dameo problems with Leo Springer I was humbled by his arsenal of ideas and the speed with which he wove them together to really beautiful problems.

On the bright side, if I had possessed a 'player's mind' I might have become a mediocre player and, if at all, a bad inventor. That's worse that I actually did.
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