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Sentinels of the Multiverse» Forums » Strategy

Subject: iOS Matriarch weekly one shot rss

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Bryan Hedrick
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Yeah, so I initially typed a long rant, decided it sounded too whiny, and settled on this:

Could anyone who plays the mobile version of this game and is trying to complete the current weekly one-shot (w/ the Matriarch) please explain to me how it is beatable? It seems impossible.

Also, I am very familiar with the base game, but somewhat unfamiliar w/the expansions. Are most of the locations/villains in the expansions this much more difficult than the base game? Just curious, because I am certainly not going to buy any of the physical expansions if that is the case. I'm all for a challenge, but this seems a bit much for my taste.
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Rob Rob
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The core game was judged a bit on the easy side so the designers turned it up a bit (perhaps too much) for the next few expansions. It does level out.

Not for nothing but the Matriarch is a pretty tough customer. OTOH, you've got Tachyon and Visonary to help out.
 
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Bryan Hedrick
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Robrob wrote:
The core game was judged a bit on the easy side so the designers turned it up a bit (perhaps too much) for the next few expansions. It does level out.

Not for nothing but the Matriarch is a pretty tough customer. OTOH, you've got Tachyon and Visonary to help out.


That response tends to confirm that I will be done with this game after the base set, because one man's "turn it up a bit" is another man's "we made it swingy and puzzle-y and punishing." I get that others like it, but I don't think its for me. I gave some other posts a quick scan, and I was finding a few too many "oh to beat this, you really need to be playing with this hero, and hope you draw this card and hope this card doesn't come out." Could be I skimmed a bad sampling, but so far I'm skeptical.

Assume I'm an idiot just not getting it, could you ELI5 how Tachyon and Visionary "help out." All of their tricks (Brain Burn to get rid of birds in discard, etc.) help you for a turn or two, but then Matriarch will soon have everything right back out and may even heal to full for good measure.
 
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I would honestly prefer a long and winy rant. It would give us more insight into how you've been approaching her and maybe advise you on what to do differently.

I'm assuming the IOS and the Steam weekly challenges are the same.

Step 1 of fighting Matriarch is limiting her extra plays from her mask. When you remove the Fowls and not counting the Mask Matriarch's deck is composed of 9 cards. 2 Horrible Cacophony (sp whatever), 2 Carion fields (I'm good at strategy here, not spelling and name memorization), 3 Darken the skies and her 2 Cohorts. Hence she needs at least 9 "plays" before she flips so ensuring she gets as few as possible is step 1 to beating her. DO NOT LET THE MASK SIT OUT ANY LONGER THAN YOU ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO WHENEVER SHE GETS IT INTO PLAY. Getting rid of the mask always is priority #1.

Step 2 Is tanking her damage. As scary as she seems Matriarch almost always broadcasts her attacks in advanced giving you time to prepare. Hit her with damage reduction. Increase the defense of your highest HP hero. Anything to prepare for the fallout.

Step 3 Is managing her Cohorts. She is at her deadliest when she has both her cohorts in play at the same time so if she ever gets both in play at the same time do whatever it takes to defeat them on the same turn. The damage resistance one has to go. Once he's gone the other usually easy to take out. I don't care how you do it. Use a light speed barrage, a charged ion cannon. I don't care if you waste 10 damage doing it You must get them both into her discard pile on the same turn asap.

and that's really it. Matriarch seems like she can do a lot but in reality she gives you notice way way in advance on what she is going to do.

Both Tachyon and Visionary are super effective against her. Assuming she does not have damage resistance Hypersonic Assault becomes "Destroy every Fowl in play at absolutely no benefit to Matriarch "

Visionary can use Suggestion to place semi harmless cards on the very top of her deck like Carrion Fields (assuming you dealt with her flock), Darken the skies (assuming she doesn't have too many fowls in her discard). While simultaniously removing very danagerous cards from her discard pile like her mask (no more darken the skies Mask Recovery) or her Cohorts (no double cohort trouble.)

Visionary can also do things like slap twist the ethers on her so her damage is reduced or enter her telekinetic cocoon so that when you kill the flock matriarcs attack gets wasted on her.

Fantaic offers her usual support whereas Expatriot just offers damage.
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carolina_bryan wrote:

That response tends to confirm that I will be done with this game after the base set, because one man's "turn it up a bit" is another man's "we made it swingy and puzzle-y and punishing." I get that others like it, but I don't think its for me. I gave some other posts a quick scan, and I was finding a few too many "oh to beat this, you really need to be playing with this hero, and hope you draw this card and hope this card doesn't come out." Could be I skimmed a bad sampling, but so far I'm skeptical.

Assume I'm an idiot just not getting it, could you ELI5 how Tachyon and Visionary "help out." All of their tricks (Brain Burn to get rid of birds in discard, etc.) help you for a turn or two, but then Matriarch will soon have everything right back out and may even heal to full for good measure.


I will say that the Rook city difficulty really took a weird swing. You have $ extremely difficult villains where winning relies heavily on knowing what to expect and how to counter their tricks. 1 of those villains is so bad that he is generally regarded as being the worst and most un-fun villain in the game. Trying to wing it and get a victory against any of them can be difficult.

On the other hand you have 2 heroes widely regarded as being the weakest heroes in the game.

Now I do like rook city but I can see why people less familiar with the game might be put off on the content in it.
 
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carolina_bryan wrote:
Yeah, so I initially typed a long rant, decided it sounded too whiny, and settled on this:

Could anyone who plays the mobile version of this game and is trying to complete the current weekly one-shot (w/ the Matriarch) please explain to me how it is beatable? It seems impossible.

Also, I am very familiar with the base game, but somewhat unfamiliar w/the expansions. Are most of the locations/villains in the expansions this much more difficult than the base game? Just curious, because I am certainly not going to buy any of the physical expansions if that is the case. I'm all for a challenge, but this seems a bit much for my taste.


Rook City is just the backlash of feedback that the base game was somewhat easy. It is heavy handed in how punishing it can be. The following expansions are substantially better designed with decks that approach the game in interesting ways. Skip Rrok City if you must but pick up Relics and Wrath and I think it is unlikely you will be disappointed. Plague Rat and the ChemicL Plant environment are pretty fun to play.
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P.D. Magnus
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carolina_bryan wrote:
That response tends to confirm that I will be done with this game after the base set, because one man's "turn it up a bit" is another man's "we made it swingy and puzzle-y and punishing." I get that others like it, but I don't think its for me.

To reiterate what everyone else's said, this is really only a problem with Rook City. The other expansions are better.
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Bryan Hedrick
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allstar64 wrote:
I would honestly prefer a long and winy rant. It would give us more insight into how you've been approaching her and maybe advise you on what to do differently.

I'm assuming the IOS and the Steam weekly challenges are the same.

Step 1 of fighting Matriarch is limiting her extra plays from her mask. When you remove the Fowls and not counting the Mask Matriarch's deck is composed of 9 cards. 2 Horrible Cacophony (sp whatever), 2 Carion fields (I'm good at strategy here, not spelling and name memorization), 3 Darken the skies and her 2 Cohorts. Hence she needs at least 9 "plays" before she flips so ensuring she gets as few as possible is step 1 to beating her. DO NOT LET THE MASK SIT OUT ANY LONGER THAN YOU ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO WHENEVER SHE GETS IT INTO PLAY. Getting rid of the mask always is priority #1.

Step 2 Is tanking her damage. As scary as she seems Matriarch almost always broadcasts her attacks in advanced giving you time to prepare. Hit her with damage reduction. Increase the defense of your highest HP hero. Anything to prepare for the fallout.

Step 3 Is managing her Cohorts. She is at her deadliest when she has both her cohorts in play at the same time so if she ever gets both in play at the same time do whatever it takes to defeat them on the same turn. The damage resistance one has to go. Once he's gone the other usually easy to take out. I don't care how you do it. Use a light speed barrage, a charged ion cannon. I don't care if you waste 10 damage doing it You must get them both into her discard pile on the same turn asap.

and that's really it. Matriarch seems like she can do a lot but in reality she gives you notice way way in advance on what she is going to do.

Both Tachyon and Visionary are super effective against her. Assuming she does not have damage resistance Hypersonic Assault becomes "Destroy every Fowl in play at absolutely no benefit to Matriarch "

Visionary can use Suggestion to place semi harmless cards on the very top of her deck like Carrion Fields (assuming you dealt with her flock), Darken the skies (assuming she doesn't have too many fowls in her discard). While simultaniously removing very danagerous cards from her discard pile like her mask (no more darken the skies Mask Recovery) or her Cohorts (no double cohort trouble.)

Visionary can also do things like slap twist the ethers on her so her damage is reduced or enter her telekinetic cocoon so that when you kill the flock matriarcs attack gets wasted on her.

Fantaic offers her usual support whereas Expatriot just offers damage.


I appreciate this detailed response.

My rant would have basically said I was pretty much attempting to do exactly what you described and either a) didn't draw the the right cards at the right time I needed to stay on top of the many moving pieces in this one shot; or b) cards from the villain/location deck immediately thwarted my plans. Basically, even the times I cleared her board and even whittled her down at all, she just cycled through deck and healed to full before I could ever finish her off.


The fact that I did understand the general basics of the strategy for this one and wasn't just missing an obvious strategy kinda frustrates me even more. This one just feels like a luck-fest. You say "that's really it", but each of those steps require you to have the right cards at the exact right time AND that you not be required to discard or destroy any of your cards. Notice in advance does you no good if you are looking at a pile of cards that can do nothing to stop the current board state.

Which honestly, is how I'm kinda starting to feel about all the post-core set expansions. Most of the random set-ups feel like on the iOS: either you drew the heroes that have the cards that neuter the villain and or you have no chance whatsoever.

Finally, who in this one-shot set up has a "charged ion cannon?"
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Aaron Bredon
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I won this with a simple strategy -
1: Visionary uses only her basic power to give Tachyon more card draws and burst discards (in my case it took a long time to get the hypersonic assaults and light speed barrages)
2. One shot card play from all 3 heroes to take care of the Carrion Fields, mask and cohorts whenever they came back. I had to use one of my light speed barrages to take care of the damage reducing cohort. I used Wrest the Mind to take out a Carrion Fields. I also had to use End of Days to clear the board once.
3. only use hypersonic assault when lots of fowls (8 or more) are on the board to kill them with no damage taken.
4. only hit the Matriarch with spare collateral damage until Tachyon has powered up by discarding all her bursts.
5. After Tachyon has powered up, use all your light speed barrages and hit the matriarch as hard as possible. In my case this was after she flipped (and the mask and cohorts were buried in her deck).

Also, don't worry about the Fowls unless there are a lot out - just take the damage and continue your strategy.
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MGS
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I love Sentinels of the Multiverse and I play the app a lot.

I don't think the weekly challenge is for everybody. I have stopped playing them as I found some of them not to be enjoyable. Some are just a challenge but a few of them have a stacked deck clearly creating a puzzle for the players to find the solution of how to win that given game. This is not how I enjoy to play SotM but I understand there is an audience for this modality out there.

I think the current challenge just hit the perfect storm for you. A very punishing Villain in a very puzzle-y challenge. It sounds like I would hate playing his challenge as well.

OTOH, every time I read a post here, I go and play a game in the app. I just had an awesome time beating La Capitan (an expansion villain) at the Chemical Plant (an expansion environment).

I think your assessment about expansions is inaccurate and maybe a result of you frustrated with the current challenge. They expand the game in very interesting ways. While I avoid some of the punishing Villains, I am glad they exist if some day my group wants an uphill battle or we just want the pain. I would do myself a disservice if I played this game without the Realm of Discord, Silver Gulch, Chemical Plant, Rook City, The Block, the shattered reality/time one, The Block, Chemical Plant and even Rook City. The Dreamer is awesome and well designed, Plague Rat, Kismet, Apostate are great fun. The Ennead is fun and unique. I avoid Chairman, Iron Legacy and Matriarch and I only play Miss Information and Spite to teach them a lesson.

The expansions are well designed and add positive features to the game that cannot be found or experienced with the base set alone.
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carolina_bryan wrote:


The fact that I did understand the general basics of the strategy for this one and wasn't just missing an obvious strategy kinda frustrates me even more. This one just feels like a luck-fest. You say "that's really it", but each of those steps require you to have the right cards at the exact right time AND that you not be required to discard or destroy any of your cards. Notice in advance does you no good if you are looking at a pile of cards that can do nothing to stop the current board state.

[shrug] Even though thinking and planning still go a long way, in the end, it's still a card game. Luck is ever present in such environments.
 
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Joke Meister
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Ronaldo wrote:
I don't think the weekly challenge is for everybody. I have stopped playing them as I found some of them not to be enjoyable. Some are just a challenge but a few of them have a stacked deck clearly creating a puzzle for the players to find the solution of how to win that given game. This is not how I enjoy to play SotM but I understand there is an audience for this modality out there.


I'm in the audience that loves the weekly challenges precisely because they are a bit like a puzzle and as such, feels different from the normal game. I can understand why people wouldn't like them though.

I actually played Matriarch for the first time last night and really loved the encounter. It just felt so thematically right with swarms of enemies and lots of small damage coming in.

At first, I thought the challenge was going to be a cakewalk as Tachyon wiped the board on the first round and stopped any damage coming in using Hypersonic Assault. Meanwhile, Expatriette used Hairtrigger Reflexes and wiped out all the incoming birds before they could do anything. At that point, I was pretty much yawning.

Then Matriarch managed to get setup and I started to take damage. Death by a thousand cuts builds up really fast!

Ultimately, it was a very close game. At the point where my heroes were all close to death, I used Wrathful Retribution by Fanatic and hit Matriarch for 27 damage. This then allowed Visionary to finish her off. Probably just in time too as I'm not sure I would have survived another round.

Got a Near Mint cover (Yay me!!) as I used the rewind when I misunderstood one of the abilities which ended up doing something unexpected.
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Rob Rob
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carolina_bryan wrote:
That response tends to confirm that I will be done with this game after the base set, because one man's "turn it up a bit" is another man's "we made it swingy and puzzle-y and punishing."


Well to be fair, the weekly challenges are puzzles. That's why they have specific heroes, etc...

As already said, Tachyon and Visionary have great potential in this fight. Personally I like using one or two of Visionary's Twist the Aether on the villian. It renders her almost powerless.

It's not the 100% ideal hero team to have against her but that's why it's a challenge I guess.
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carolina_bryan wrote:

Finally, who in this one-shot set up has a "charged ion cannon?"


Sorry, since you said you were very familiar with the base game I thought you would know the cards of all the base heroes. Ion cannon is a card in Bunker's deck which can be charges up to deal loads and loads of damage similar to how Tachyon charges up her light speed barrage. I only included it to illustrate the importance of getting rid of her cohorts even if it meant using "super attacks" normally reserved for the main villain (I once used a highly charged ion cannon to deal with her cohort which was why it came to mind).

I see now that you mistook it as advice for this particular one shot which it wasn't intended to be and I apologize for that misunderstanding.

I can't really comment much more on this. I actually started off with 2 suggestions and 2 hypersonics so I was able to lock her down pretty badly from the start. Maybe I'll do the oneshot again and see if things go differently with a different draw.
 
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Vincent Lalyman
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The Matriarch is one the few difficulty 4 villains - she is a hard fight. Don't let her demoralize you : there are few of these high difficulty villains in the game, and they are meant for experienced players looking for a challenge.

I had luck in the one-shot. After a hard beginning, Visionary brain burned one of the cohorts and the mask from the trash to the bottom of Matriarch's deck, gaining me some time.
I took a lot of bird damage, and didn't try to get rid of them because of two carrion fields.
Then everything went suddenly well : Visionary was in her cocoon with the highest HP ( nullifying Lilian's retaliation damage), Fanatic was able to make both carrion fields unable to do damage ( and keep the card in play thanks to her sword damage), and Expatriette killed new birds as soon as they appeared. With this set up I concentrated all fire on the Matriarch, and she fell quite fast, dying just after she had cleaned all my ongoings.

If you can avoid her retaliation damage, she is far less of a problem. The deal with her is that you have to carefully evaluate if it is best to let her keep her birds, or to get rid of them (knowing they'll come back soon). Then there are the Cohorts - always keep something to get rid of them fast (in my game, I kept Tachyon's big damage cards just for them).

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Bryan Hedrick
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I appreciate all the responses I really do. But, some of these responses are just not jibing with my experience.

People keep saying things like "oh just get Visionary in her cocoon oh just get twist the ether out" But this one-shot also has hard removal. None of your pieces are going to stay out for long.

Expatriette killing things as they come out is straight up counter productive if your damage negation cards have been removed (or never drawn).

I don't mind luck in a card game, and I know skillful decisions mitigate luck. But, all these responses boil down to saying you really, really need a handful of very specific cards to beat this one shot, and then you have to pray the hard removal doesn't come out soon thereafter.

I tried several more times last night. I would say I implemented this advice, but honestly, I was already doing virtually all of these "you just need to" tips. I uninstalled and have moved on.

I know many of you really like this game, but after this experience its just not for me.
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I hate the Matriach in both tabletop and the App, as you can very easily just have a table/screen full of birds, and having so many cards there just screws up my thought processes.

I kept attempting the first few challenges that came up until I beat them (actually the first few were relatively easy IIRC, I think I beat most of the first time anyway), not I've decided not to sweat them so much, some seem fairly easy and highlight interesting interactions between heroes/villains/environments or force you to use a hero you'd normally avoid for a particular villain, some just seem set up to be "challenging".
 
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I'll start by saying the weekly one shot doesn't represent every instance of the game and removing the game because of this seems a bit much.

In regards to strategy. Some team ups do require a bit of luck on card draw but to me the killer in this is the environment. Normally Realm of Discord can be hero friendly but based on her mechanics it becomes a problem as Negative Energy Field ends up mostly hitting the heroes, Positive Energy Field will unlikely heal heroes, and Time Flies is like giving her another Mask. My main tips on this game would be to try to take the Mask out as soon as you can and when given the ability stack the environment deck.

Some villains as inherently tougher than others and I think no matter what Handelabra is giving good match ups whether others agree or not. When it is fully randomized like this week's game there isn't a set path to a win and it just means you have to work with what you have to gain a victory.
 
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Vincent Lalyman
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I can understand your frustration. But keep in mind that, it's worth repeating, The Matriarch is one of the hardest villains in the game. It doesn't mean she is unbeatable, but that you need a lot of experience to have a correct chance against her.

We can't give you more advice, because she is a complex villain, and as you pointed, any plan you use against her can be foiled by some of her cards. Adaptation and improvisation are key with all the hardest villains - and most of this only comes with experience. we could only give more advice if we were watching you play.

The application should warn players about how difficult a fight can be. The Matriarch and a few other are "end game" content, and very frustrating for more casual players.

My advice would be to fight other villains and come back to her another day, with more experience under your belt.
But if you don't think the game can be fun restricting yourself to easier villains, I won't judge you.

Maybe it will help if I tell you that I kept losing against her for a very long time before finally knowing the game enough to consider her as "beatable". Now I know I can beat her more often than lose. She is not the only one that took a long time to be defeated, and some are still my personal nemesis.

If you ever want to try the game again, there is an App called "Sentinels Randomizer", that can give you an evaluation of how difficult a given fight is - or rather, an evaluation of how often experienced players would win or lose in this set-up. This weekly one-shot has a 77% win probability - for experienced players. It may help you evaluate what challenges you can beat at your level of experience.
 
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I have played this one shot twice and won both times with all heroes alive and with approximately 10 hp left. You can call it luck if you want, but I can assure you that it has more to do with the ~200 plays of this game I have under my belt. There is a big, big difference between having a successful strategy and implementing it well. They are two different skills - especially in this game.
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I'll echo what Markus said. I get the feeling that the OP is looking for that ONE strategy which will let him win. The thing is - I don't think there is one.

Like all good games, there are several different strategies and which one you use depends on the cards you have and the situation in play at the time. For example, he says:

carolina_bryan wrote:
People keep saying things like "oh just get Visionary in her cocoon oh just get twist the ether out" But this one-shot also has hard removal. None of your pieces are going to stay out for long.


and

carolina_bryan wrote:
But, all these responses boil down to saying you really, really need a handful of very specific cards to beat this one shot, and then you have to pray the hard removal doesn't come out soon thereafter.


In my win, I didn't use either of those cards. It's hard for me to accept the claim that the game is luck based as you need a handful of very specific cards when people have already posted several different ways that they beat the villain all of which used different cards.

I fully accept that there is an element of luck to the game and that sometimes the card draw is so bad that you have no chance of winning. But that is far different from saying that the only way to win is by luck.
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Aaron Bredon
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Jokemeister wrote:

carolina_bryan wrote:
But, all these responses boil down to saying you really, really need a handful of very specific cards to beat this one shot, and then you have to pray the hard removal doesn't come out soon thereafter.


In my win, I didn't use either of those cards. It's hard for me to accept the claim that the game is luck based as you need a handful of very specific cards when people have already posted several different ways that they beat the villain all of which used different cards.

I fully accept that there is an element of luck to the game and that sometimes the card draw is so bad that you have no chance of winning. But that is far different from saying that the only way to win is by luck.


And my method dealt with the need to draw specific cards by drawing Tachyon's entire deck to guarantee getting all the cards I needed (pretty much the simplest Tachyon strategy).
And I wasn't dependent on my cards staying out - the only cards I depended on were one-shots and base powers, so hard removal didn't affect me much.

The only luck in my strategy was surviving for the 8-9 turns it took to draw all Tachyon's cards (at a rate of 1-3 cards on each of Tachyon's turns, and 2 more on Visionary's turn).
 
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allstar64 wrote:
Fantaic offers her usual support whereas Expatriot just offers damage.
To expand on this a little, Fanatic's Zealous Offense can shut down both copies of Carrion Fields in a single play. Which is great because Carrion Fields are awful. I have lost several games when 2 carrion fields are out and the environment decides to wipe out 15+ fowl cards. Anyone caught out in the open when that happens is dead.

Overall, Fanatic's deck can nullify damage from as many as 6 non-character targets. Failing all else? End Of Days. If Unity is present (generally not a good idea against the Matriarch, where long setup heroes don't usually do as well) you can use the Bee Bot + End Of Days combo to wipe out all villain and environment cards while you get to keep all yours in play (minus Bee Bot)

Try bringing The Scholar. Flesh to Iron makes him impervious to The Matriarch's psychic retaliations unless she has damage buffs out.
 
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