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Subject: ChitChat About Werewolf rss

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Day (she/her)
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madelineb wrote:
Smugs wrote:
I tend to expect heavier posting D1 and am more relaxed about later days as long as something is still coming, similar to what Royal says above, I guess.

Depending on how mentally well I am, my participation as a player can definitely suffer. If I'm leaning chaotically, I can totally just phase and miss a full day (normally Fridays because I'll go drinking, and, yes, I realise the connotations of this). Normally I've managed to post a little on (my) Thursday night, and then have the weekend.

But I'd be bummed if I got booted without notice, because I like to think that you guys know I'm not likely to be a complete flake?

So reputation comes into it too, for me.
I think in practice reputation does play in, but in theory, it shouldn't. :/

Edit: I guess you meant something slightly different, you're referring to "not replacing people out because you expect them to participate more later"? Whereas the problem I more often have is "not replacing people out because they're always non-contributory."

Yeah, I was thinking the former, as in I would hope my rep means I wouldn't be replaced.

I do think if someone is usually a low poster, I will accept lower posting off them. I should probably make sure I consider there posts contributory enough, and I probably don't do that enough.
 
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shawnad2006 wrote:
Lol murph. Good talk.



Usually, when I don't know I just won't say anything. But in this case I was actively putting forth my not knowing since it seemed to have sort of a point as such.

I liked your question. I liked your dedication. I liked your effort. But I'm skeptical of knowing in any standard way. To me it's all general goals - be kind, be understanding, be fair, but be the best caretaker you can be for the best experience for the most players in the game as possible.
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I got to looking for old participation discussions and it was FUN!

mods-players-please-read-and-comment
Pre-rebirth Farren! An ArchAngel appearance! The early days of POG/twoplustwo thingies.

non-voting-and-proposal-take-2
Early Ludes idea generation! More Farren. BSN and Shug! And what's better than the early passions of Javal crunching a bunch of numbers and kuchick sticking up for individuals.

the lack of participation rendered my threat pretty null
Oh, nevermind. This shouldn't be on this list.
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Madeline B
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The more things change, yada yada. To some extent we still have had "if people are overscheduled that should be a signup issue"/"are you saying I should stop plugging my games, no one likes me everyone hates me guess I'll go eat worms" problems a decade later.

One of the reasons I liked the Fanatic role so much (see wolfy thread) was the "use it or lose it" vote mechanic.
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Tokah
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In a game balanced at about the point we tend to currently, I think you need a fairly high participation thread for them to feel good to the good team.

I wouldn't be opposed to running a lower participation game with more mislynch potentials baked in, though.

I think it has a little less to do with individuals. If a few people who are very on schedule for the game keep up a narrative to jump in, you can have a low poster who posts a few solid content posts and a vote per day and that can work. If no one is doing that, there isn't any thread engine.

You can only police individuals, though. I measure that by a mixture of per day and overall, adjusted for player count. Someone who's put up stuff on the board and will be a little scant for a day and a half in a 19er is okay, in a 9er will potentially ruin the game. Someone with a record to read I'll be willing to wait a little longer for than someone whose ISO is devoid of past game content.
 
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shawnad2006 wrote:
Soooo....participation.
How much is not enough? How do mods handle it? How do players handle it?
I think it's about content, not post count. So how do you define it?
Do you consider the game as a whole? Reassess each day?
What about players that are gone for just a day? Is that fine? Is just two days fine?

Defining content is extremely subjective and probably impossible to rule on fairly.
What happens when a perceived total lack of content from one player is worth a lock good read for another player?
What about someone who posts like 30 times on D1 but doesn't say anything remotely game related?
What about someone who is a neutral or a pacifist or an outed confirmed unaware aux who has literally nothing useful to do anymore?

These are all pretty common gray areas that are impossible to have solutions for that will make everyone happy.
My strat is to ignore all of that and just drop the replacement hammer on anyone who doesn't post for 24 hours.
There might be better solutions but I don't think better solutions involve mod opinions on what it means to "play the game". I don't typically run games that involve neutrals, auxes, or pacifists, so it's likely there needs to be some kind of addendum for those roles that have nothing to do but don't need to be replaced.
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Patrick Hill
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I don't know where I fall anymore in the spectrum, but I agree it's subjective. I think I'm a fairly average poster as far as count (though lower than a year ago), but the caveat is that I don't post live or during the day which means I miss dusk and dawn. But I always strive no matter what to give content to my posts at least once a game day. Even if I'm lost or terrible on my own reads, hopefully I give the village enough to read me. I'll stay up even if it's painful to TW/ISO. Others may not have that option or ability, but I feel committed if I sign up for a game.
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I learned an acronym playing on another site that I kind of love.
I need to join a game here so I can try to make it happen.

OMGUS

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Oh_My_God_You_Suc...

"OMGUS stands for "Oh My God, You Suck (for voting for me)!". it is sometimes used as a shorthand to indicate that you are voting for someone primarily because they voted for you. It is a behavior often associated with inexperienced players."

The description makes it sound like it's just for retaliation voting, but in practice people use it for just reads as well.

Examples:

"Shawna feels stuck in OMGUS."

"Lemon under pressure was good. She wasn't panicking or OMGUSing."

"I'm suspicious of Tok voting me ! [Vote Tok] #OMGUSsssssssss"
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Kevin
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You hadn’t heard that before???
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Tokah
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Truly, I would never dare to vote the righteous Shawna!
 
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RoyalApe wrote:
You hadn’t heard that before???

I never play anywhere but here!!
And I haven't seen it used here. Is it sometimes!?
 
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Kevin
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shawnad2006 wrote:
RoyalApe wrote:
You hadn’t heard that before???

I never play anywhere but here!!
And I haven't seen it used here. Is it sometimes!?

Yes. I know I’ve used it at least

Not regularly though
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RoyalApe wrote:
shawnad2006 wrote:
RoyalApe wrote:
You hadn’t heard that before???

I never play anywhere but here!!
And I haven't seen it used here. Is it sometimes!?

Yes. I know I’ve used it at least

Not regularly though

That makes me wonder if I have seen it then and just figured it was some other way of saying OMG. =P
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Tokah
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shawnad2006 wrote:
RoyalApe wrote:
shawnad2006 wrote:
RoyalApe wrote:
You hadn’t heard that before???

I never play anywhere but here!!
And I haven't seen it used here. Is it sometimes!?

Yes. I know I’ve used it at least

Not regularly though

That makes me wonder if I have seen it then and just figured it was some other way of saying OMG. =P

I did!
 
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Day (she/her)
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I have used OMGUS as a spoken word in deception games
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I just spent 5 seconds of my life trying to work out how you would pronounce that!?!?!?!
 
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Day (she/her)
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doppio wrote:
I just spent 5 seconds of my life trying to work out how you would pronounce that!?!?!?!

As written, for me. om (like the meditation chant)-gus (like the male name)
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Madeline B
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So I sometimes have the experience of a vivid dream within a dream. In the "outer" dream my conscious mind is like "that's actually a good idea for a story or whatever, let me write it down/think more deliberately about it so I dont forget." But I'm still dreaming. Then when I wake up for real it's a mix of random "inspiration" and semi-methodical thought.

Anyway, that just happened with hidden rolesets. Apparently my subconscious likes VIP games where evil has an n0 mechanics distribution phase.
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Day (she/her)
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I regularly have panicky moments on waking in the middle of the night about werewolf. I sent the following to a friend the other day:

Quote:
I've just had a really familiar process of falling asleep happen: dream I'm doing something with someone (this time board games with Liam, my brother), hear noises in my dream, ask the other person to investigate, they refuse, I wake up and they're not here, realise I need to investigate, realise that I was dreaming and that I don't need to investigate, sudden worry that the missing person was the Seer, realise that they can't have been the Seer because it was a dream, realise that I'm worried about someone being the Seer in real life, realise werewolf isn't real life, go back to sleep.
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madelineb wrote:
So I sometimes have the experience of a vivid dream within a dream. In the "outer" dream my conscious mind is like "that's actually a good idea for a story or whatever, let me write it down/think more deliberately about it so I dont forget." But I'm still dreaming. Then when I wake up for real it's a mix of random "inspiration" and semi-methodical thought.

Anyway, that just happened with hidden rolesets. Apparently my subconscious likes VIP games where evil has an n0 mechanics distribution phase.

I always seem to be subconsciously aware, on some level, that I'm dreaming. Once I was in the middle of an action sequence in a dream, when I thought to myself, "Wait! I have to pee! I better wake up!" So I woke up and walked to the bathroom.

Except that I wasn't actually awake. The waking up and walking to the bathroom was part of the dream. blush
 
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I have also dreamed that I am lying awake in bed at night, unable to sleep.
 
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Madeline B
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Let's talk about auxen.

A lot of the discussions I've seen comparing BGG to other werewolf/mafia sites point out that aux roles are kind of part of our house style. They allow intricate claim wars and slightly diminish the use of seer views. But there are some downsides associated with them, though. One is LHLV--in situations where there are X evils and X goods alive, most non-aux rolesets would just be like "okay, evil wins," because all those evils would be maxes. Another issue is that outed auxes often have little to do, but won't be lynched; Vanderscamp has touched on this in his replacement stuff, and also had some good points in his mod chats.

Vanderscamp May 14, 05:01 PM: it's one of the only roles where you can play as well as you possibly can but still lose the game

So, to those of you who like auxen/rolesets with them, why? What advantages do they bring that I maybe don't see, or take for granted?
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madelineb wrote:
Let's talk about auxen.

A lot of the discussions I've seen comparing BGG to other werewolf/mafia sites point out that aux roles are kind of part of our house style. They allow intricate claim wars and slightly diminish the use of seer views. But there are some downsides associated with them, though. One is LHLV--in situations where there are X evils and X goods alive, most non-aux rolesets would just be like "okay, evil wins," because all those evils would be maxes. Another issue is that outed auxes often have little to do, but won't be lynched; Vanderscamp has touched on this in his replacement stuff, and also had some good points in his mod chats.

Vanderscamp May 14, 05:01 PM: it's one of the only roles where you can play as well as you possibly can but still lose the game

So, to those of you who like auxen/rolesets with them, why? What advantages do they bring that I maybe don't see, or take for granted?

My standpoint will be completely different really to what probably will come as explanations and isn't really an explanation of why I think auxes should or shouldn't be in our games over maxes. I just really find playing aux more fun than max and if wolf was the only way of being evil, I think I'd have less fun playing Werewolf than I do.

They let me be evil, do all the fun evil things like CC things, whilst not having to be stressed out by longevity.

Van isn't wrong though, you can sometimes play as well as you can as aux and it just be a footnote of a game where your wolves don't manage to turn up. But I'm in defence of auxes solely because I find them fun =)
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madelineb wrote:
Let's talk about auxen.

A lot of the discussions I've seen comparing BGG to other werewolf/mafia sites point out that aux roles are kind of part of our house style. They allow intricate claim wars and slightly diminish the use of seer views. But there are some downsides associated with them, though. One is LHLV--in situations where there are X evils and X goods alive, most non-aux rolesets would just be like "okay, evil wins," because all those evils would be maxes. Another issue is that outed auxes often have little to do, but won't be lynched; Vanderscamp has touched on this in his replacement stuff, and also had some good points in his mod chats.

Vanderscamp May 14, 05:01 PM: it's one of the only roles where you can play as well as you possibly can but still lose the game

So, to those of you who like auxen/rolesets with them, why? What advantages do they bring that I maybe don't see, or take for granted?

I like:
Decreased strength of seer role.

Playing unknowledgeable evil. Still needing to solve the game - but direct the game towards evil instead of good.

Less pressure to stay alive as evil.

Allows more creativity with role sets. Aux evils are sort of half steps in balancing.

Aux-boxing as Max Evil.

----

Things that I don't like:
Feeling as wolf when you kill your own aux. (largely swings games to good)

That's about it.

I do think the way auxes are incorporated into certain sets could be improved. But I still love the concept of auxes in general. Not ever set needs to have auxes either though.
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Royal: logic and reasoning and list of points.

Me: IT FUN

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