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Subject: The Minstrel rss

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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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Following the Bishop discussion, now seems a good time to point out that the Minstrel also seems a bit unclear. My unofficial translation from the German reads that you 'Move 1-3 of your cubes from one space to another (not to Notre Dame).' I kept my translation as vague as the German seemed to be, since it was not clear whether 'space' in this sentence meant just buildings of your own district or whether it included Notre Dame. With the Juggler the German is specific by saying that you move a cube from 'your district or Notre Dame'.
(Incidentally, this was the only thing in the rules which seemed unclear to me).
 
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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No, I didn't miss the 'your own' but that only refers where you move the cubes to, not where you move them from. The juggler uses similar wording of moving to 'any other' space (not Notre Dame) but you can move from either your own district or Notre Dame. Re-reading my post I realise I didn't make it clear that I was only unsure about the 'space' you move the cubes from. I don't see that the German makes this clear.
 
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Jay Tummelson
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The English rules in the RGG are very clear on this point - they cubes may not be moved to ND. They are moved from a place in his borough to another space in his borough. The action is not executed.

Jay
 
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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Thanks, Jay for clarifying this. Mik: perhaps now you see how I found it not to be clear - you say it doesn't matter where the space is which you move from, but Jay states that you can only move from your own spaces.
 
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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Apparently the radiating 'glow' is to indicate that the action of the space is carried out (see forum about the Bishop). I hadn't even noticed it until reading that forum.
 
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Jay Tummelson
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The "beams" indicate the space is empty, which was written in the German (and English) rules for the Bishop, but not for the fool - I apologize for the oversight, but I think it is too late for a change.

Jay
 
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Mik Svellov
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riogames wrote:
The "beams" indicate the space is empty, which was written in the German (and English) rules for the Bishop, but not for the fool - I apologize for the oversight, but I think it is too late for a change.


Thanks to Steve for pointing me to the Bishop thread.

This is not correct, Jay. If it was would the German rules also be wrong.

The beams indicate that the action may be carried out in the new space.

See Steve?
I am sorry Jay, but this is why I am not convinced that your answer to the Minstrel is correct.
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Jay Tummelson
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Mik is right, the rays do not indicate empty. Thus, my rules are correct.
I apologize for the confusion. And, I have just learned that the English
games will be printed next week, so I hope to release them in the US in
very late April - early May at the very latest.

Jay
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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Wow, this has got confusing! Firstly, I now see that Mik was confused about whether the space the cubes are moved to needed to be empty or not. It is ONLY the bishop which needs the cube to go into an empty space.
'Your spaces' are the 7 building spaces of your district and always remain yours whether or not you have any cubes in them.
What I'm still not 100% clear about is the answer to my original question! (i.e. can you move cubes FROM Notre Dame with the Minstrel, in the same way you can with the Juggler? - Jay says you can't but I'm not sure if he got confused as well, what with the 'radiating glow' confusion!)
 
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Jay Tummelson
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Here is what the rules say (English - approved by Alea):

By hiring the minstrel, the player moves 1-3 of his influence markers (also including his trusted friend) from any one sector in his borough to any other sector in his borough (not Notre Dame). The player does not execute the action associated with the new sector.

Jay
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Mik Svellov
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Approved by Stefan Feld as well.
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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Thanks Jay and Mik for getting that clear. The RGG rule is as a rule should be - unambiguous (it's a shame the German rule was somewhat vague on this).
 
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Steve+Jackie McKeogh
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The BSW rules are slightly different again: for both the minstrel and the juggler the rule says you move a cube/s from 'one of your own spaces'.
Stefan Brück has confirmed that in theory using the minstrel or juggler, you can move your own cube/s out of Notre Dame but that in practice you would never actually want to do so. Certainly with the minstrel, where you don't get to carry out the action of the new building, you would never want to move out of Notre Dame, 'which [says Stefan] is why we don't list it explicitly'.
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