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Subject: Caffee Variant rss

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Rex Caffee
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Eagle Mountain
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Change
When ever you get a blue card free from a match of another blue card; gain an extra turn.

Reason
Blue cards in the 1st Age are really worthless. There are better choices. This rule change makes blues very important and harder to pass up on.

Disclaimer
Not everyone likes their favorite game changed. This is not for everyone. As a designer I can't help but tweak games, so please don't hate.

If you do play this variant, please tell me what you think. If you like this variant check out my other variants in other great games.
 
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Marco Schaub
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Doesn't this make blue cards way overpowered?

I must say that when people don't win with military or science, blue cards are pretty dominant in deciding the winner as they are right now.
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Russ Williams
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I don't see any reason for every card to be equally valuable; it doesn't feel like a problem to me that e.g. I'd probably rather take a brown card than a blue card in epoch 1.
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Rex Caffee
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Its been my experience that resources are the main focus, followed by yellow cards then green/red cards and lastly blue cards in Age 1. Now Blue cards in Age 3 are very good, but you don't need blue cards from age 1 to get them, if you have the resources from brown and yellow cards.

So with this new rule it makes blue cards very good and yes OP if you let the other player get most of them. The idea of the game is to make each card a viable option. As it sits blue cards in age 1 are better trashed for coins then to take.

I'm sure there are people who have won doing "this" or "that" and this rule may not seem to help. But if you have a similar experience in this game as I, this might be the answer.
 
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Rex Caffee
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russ wrote:
I don't see any reason for every card to be equally valuable; it doesn't feel like a problem to me that e.g. I'd probably rather take a brown card than a blue card in epoch 1.


And this is my point. The game should make you have a tough decision each turn. Well, in the way I like playing games.
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Richard Sampson
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rcaffee wrote:
And this is my point. The game should make you have a tough decision each turn. Well, in the way I like playing games.
I think there is a more value in forcing your opponent to have no decision and take a sub-optimal card.
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Russ Williams
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rcaffee wrote:
russ wrote:
I don't see any reason for every card to be equally valuable; it doesn't feel like a problem to me that e.g. I'd probably rather take a brown card than a blue card in epoch 1.


And this is my point. The game should make you have a tough decision each turn. Well, in the way I like playing games.

A tough decision does not imply that all moves in a situation have to be equally good or equally tempting! I think there's no good game where every decision is equally tempting; there are always some moves which are clearly better than others in a typical situation!

And since often there is no brown card to take instead of a blue card, there are various times when it seems to me perfectly rational to take a blue card in epoch 1. It's not as if the rules as written mean no rational player will ever take a blue card in epoch 1.

(It seems similar to some threads proposing to "fix" that science and military wins happen less often than point wins. I see no reason for each type of win to happen equally frequently, just as I see no reason for every possible move in every situation to be equally good or equally appealing.)

But yeah, de gustibus non est disputandum, and all that.
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Rex Caffee
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russ wrote:
But yeah, de gustibus non est disputandum, and all that.


Yes, agreed.cool
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Travis Morton
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Counterpoint:
We finished a game last night where my wife took many Blue cards as well as Red. I took Green, Yellow, and of course more resources. She did lose, but that came from taking those "Early Blue" cards.
If she got an extra turn for Chaining/Linking, that would have been at least 3 extra turns during Ages II and III. I would have lost to a Military Victory had those extra turns happened.

I appreciate the insight and ideas. However, I see this games rapid success and mass embrace as a sign of "...it ain't broke...".
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Giannis Tilias
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That's so not helpful in this game. As a designer as you say you should have known better. Actually it really breaks the whole game. 7 Wonders Duel is one of the few games that doesn't need any home rules and tweaks To be awesome.
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Kevin Duke
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Thank you.

I haven't seen any changes that didn't look like tweaking for the joy of creating something and feeling like it must be better that way.

"Don't hate me." Okay-- that's too much energy. Don't expect us to thank you or respect you for diddling.

"de gustibus non est disputandum." Yeah, right.

How do you say, "Everyone has an opinion, just like everyone has..." in Latin?
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Kurtis Swekla
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knuckles29 wrote:
Counterpoint:
We finished a game last night where my wife took many Blue cards as well as Red. I took Green, Yellow, and of course more resources. She did lose, but that came from taking those "Early Blue" cards.
If she got an extra turn for Chaining/Linking, that would have been at least 3 extra turns during Ages II and III. I would have lost to a Military Victory had those extra turns happened.

I appreciate the insight and ideas. However, I see this games rapid success and mass embrace as a sign of "...it ain't broke...".


Tonight my wife took a ton of blues (even had the extra token for 2 resources off of blue cards) I had tons of military (almost got a military win) and yellow. and she kicked my ass 72 to 57
 
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