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Subject: running the phoenix set? rss

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Nick Wirtz
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So, the phoenix armor isn't something I've really used much.

You can get the shield plus a few pieces for an incomplete set with insanity tech and add a lot of affinities to whatever you're building.

You can obviously get the armor set (plus the shield if room) to get a healthy strength buff to whatever you want to hit hard with.

But, I don't really see anything beyond the obvious. I was looking for an actually useful set with the phoenix armor, plus some weapon from the same hunts, and about all I've come up with is...
-the katana and sheath and a couple items taken mostly for affinities
-a pair of hollow swords (which have the frail problem, compounded by a high attack rate) but there's no room for a shield
-a spear because any weapon with reach makes a straight line movement more flexible, and a shield because there's the open slot.

Is there a good way to fit the axes in? So far, all I've seen is some expensive and/or hard to come by items.
 
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Montgomery Mullen
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In the games I've been in, we rarely went after the phoenix stuff except for a single item here or there. We were either heading for more expensive stuff (lantern armor) or it was too expensive at the time. We're currently doing a People of the Sun game and steadily accumulating phoenix resources... so I expect we'll be giving this stuff a try. I'll let you know how it goes but at the moment, I'm pretty much just seeing what you're seeing.
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Nick Wirtz
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Cool, thanks.

Yeah, I'm mostly feeling like the phoenix and lantern sets are too pricey for what you get... 9/10 times if we're looking at them, we basically decide that the beacon shield as a supplement for what we already have is a way better use of resources...

I mean, the strength buff from phoenix is solid, but at that point we tend to already have killer weapons and the set's got so limited affinities (it makes a few easily, but then has two gear pieces with no potential)

I'm mostly just going through all my armor sets, trying to make a couple survivors have an armor set with a piece of gear that fits right in, and I've been stumped by the phoenix and lantern armor--

phoenix, I'm doing one with a katana and sheath, leaning towards reach and feather shield for the second.

lantern has really got me, though- you become super tanky and then... what? I guess have the super club or some other mediocre ones, compensate for your low movement, and decide whether to take the helmet penalties or figure out another affinity to stick on top?

IDK, feels really limiting.
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Montgomery Mullen
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Sure, Lantern armor felt kinda underwhelming except for the ability to soak huge amounts of damage (Scraplantern Keep had the shield mastery... that plus beacon shield on full lantern armor was great, x2 if we put them on a green savior), but ... yeah, for the investment involved, it just didn't seem worth it. Scraplantern finished in year 20 (we jumped the Watcher and beat the crap out of it), and had just finished one full set.

Beacon shields, on the other hand? Totally worth it.

Lantern IS pretty nice if you roll in with dual clubs, but again, that's a lot of investment... and again, some creatures can still gank you really fast (hello Phoenix with the whole destroy armor thing).

I'm in general noticing that some of the expansion armor isn't all that great either, at least in terms of the investment involved. We've been eyeing some of the dragon gear, for example, and it just doesn't seem to shape up. Part of this is to be expected, because this is one of those games where you get a pile of choices that don't really end up being choices because some of them are just better than others.
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Nick Wirtz
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Yeah, my problem with it is that for something that expensive, it should be fantastic, but in order to be fantastic, part of that would need to be that things don't circumvent it so easily. There are quite a few events that'll make you lose one or more pieces of the set, then there are a number of things that get around it (the phoenix you mentioned, for instance). I don't particularly think anything to patch the armor to make it appropriately priced is in order regarding upping its power, so the logical conclusion is that it should be cheaper.

Re: other sets, unfortunately I can't really comment on a complete set- flower knight doesn't have one, dragon campaign doesn't, spider was never worth the effort to complete, just started gorm.

With that, though, I think the spider armor is very nice, definitely tougher than the other early sets, and it seems that's the same role the gorm set will be. And the dragon's stuff giving a cheap armor buff is definitely a boon.

Haven't tried to make similarly expensive gear to phoenix/lantern stuff, though, so can't comment on the equivalent range.
 
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Montgomery Mullen
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So, some first impressions after getting a full set of phoenix armor:

It feels like it adds an extra layer of protection so long as you keep insane. It's sort of like Immortal-lite. Ignore the first hit each round and take one brain damage instead, gain bonuses to evasion and movement (useful particularly with Dash), and the set pieces give you a little extra insanity to top you off before departing.

That said, they are affinity-hungry, and that means dangerous to wear around the Hand. Further, 'flammable' can be problematic in other ways. Against some monsters, I might take something else over the phoenix armor, but it might be good against Slenderman, say, unless he zeros your insanity.

The shield is ok, but we think beacon shield is superior.

The axes are (as far as I know) the only paired Savage weapons in the game, which means a potentially high amount of damage (especially if you are good at Perfect hits).

Edit: Left off a summary. Basically, the armor feels like it is meant to be attack armor, especially for hit-and-run tactics. It is probably best complemented if someone else has the screaming armor set, to help top off insanity and keep the armor special perks going.
 
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Nick Wirtz
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Hmm, the screaming combo's interesting.

Yeah, the rest of that was stuff that's pretty obvious, though hadn't thought about savage paired, that's pretty good, esp. on axes with the re-roll. Savage doesn't interact with perfect, unless there's another part of the gear that does?
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Montgomery Mullen
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Ok, glad to see my observations dovetail with yours. I feel like we're not missing anything!

Perfect hit gives you an additional attack roll. There's no clause about 'once per attack' on the card, maybe for space reasons, but that'd be your table's decision to make.

I came across something else by accident, also. If you use the Dragon hunt intro event, somebody gets a thing that makes you always insane. Might be useful for the phoenix armor.

If I go for phoenix armor in the future, it'll be with the express purpose of making a crazy hit and run fighter dedicated to doing damage and kiting monsters, although if you have the Lion Knight carnival handy, some phoenix pieces can be used for the mixnmatch armor sets, and those are pretty good.

We're debating whether to make the mixnmatch armor sets generically available.
 
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