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Subject: A Mild Rant: eBay Auctions vs Noble Knight Games rss

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Joe Walerko
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This is a mild rant, and doesn't have anything to do with Noble Knight Games as a business.

These guys keep snatching away my eBay auction prospects and it's really annoying. I've been slowly working on completing my collection of 21st Century Games miniature D&D books & box sets. The items are relatively obscure, and a pain to locate on eBay. And almost every time I've found an item, Noble Knight Games outbids me. How do I know? Because a few days later the same items come back on eBay with a 200% markup from NKG. And these items' appearance on eBay are rare enough that I doubt it's a coincidence.

I'm not saying they don't have the right to do this. They're a business, and if they want to buy an item for $70 and then charge $200 for it, that's fine. I think their prices can often be outrageous, and as a consumer I exercise my right to not buy their merchandise. I'm still going to keep hunting for reasonable sales elsewhere until I complete my collection.

I just hate losing auctions to resellers with money to burn, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Like I said, a small rant.
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Derry Salewski
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It's douchey and obnoxious. Mostly since I assume it's keeping things from being sold and into the hands of people who will enjoy them. If they actually sell all the stupidly marked up stuff and someone is willing to pay it, then whatever, it's the free market.

But it's pretty normal.



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I agree, that's pretty douchey, but what can you do about it? That's the process eBay has chosen.

I'm not sure I have "ever" bought from Noble Knight, but apparently someone does as they seem to still exist even at exorbitant prices even after all these years.
 
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Yea, I'd love to see their books to see how they manage to stay afloat. Especially for these weird/old/obscure books, it seems like they're outbidding the one person who would buy that item from them anytime in the near future, thus ensuring that their customer isn't willing to pay the price they'll eventually ask.
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Rich Keiser
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joe_games wrote:
This is a mild rant, and doesn't have anything to do with Noble Knight Games as a business.

These guys keep snatching away my eBay auction prospects and it's really annoying. I've been slowly working on completing my collection of 21st Century Games miniature D&D books & box sets. The items are relatively obscure, and a pain to locate on eBay. And almost every time I've found an item, Noble Knight Games outbids me. How do I know? Because a few days later the same items come back on eBay with a 200% markup from NKG. And these items' appearance on eBay are rare enough that I doubt it's a coincidence.

I'm not saying they don't have the right to do this. They're a business, and if they want to buy an item for $70 and then charge $200 for it, that's fine. I think their prices can often be outrageous, and as a consumer I exercise my right to not buy their merchandise. I'm still going to keep hunting for reasonable sales elsewhere until I complete my collection.

I just hate losing auctions to resellers with money to burn, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Like I said, a small rant.

Why don't you just outbid them in the first place? It seems like your highest price to pay is lower than theirs. Do you have suggestions on a better system to distribute goods and services?


As for not getting into the hands of people that enjoy them... I guess if that were true, NK would be sitting on tons of unsold things... but, it appears that people with $$$ that also enjoy them, are buying.

Maybe we should lottery everything off?



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joe_games wrote:
This is a mild rant, and doesn't have anything to do with Noble Knight Games as a business.

These guys keep snatching away my eBay auction prospects and it's really annoying. I've been slowly working on completing my collection of 21st Century Games miniature D&D books & box sets. The items are relatively obscure, and a pain to locate on eBay. And almost every time I've found an item, Noble Knight Games outbids me. How do I know? Because a few days later the same items come back on eBay with a 200% markup from NKG. And these items' appearance on eBay are rare enough that I doubt it's a coincidence.

I'm not saying they don't have the right to do this. They're a business, and if they want to buy an item for $70 and then charge $200 for it, that's fine. I think their prices can often be outrageous, and as a consumer I exercise my right to not buy their merchandise. I'm still going to keep hunting for reasonable sales elsewhere until I complete my collection.

I just hate losing auctions to resellers with money to burn, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Like I said, a small rant.

Pro-tip about NK... they will never pay, or mostly never pay more than 50% their marked up price. So, if you indicate they are selling it for $200, a bid of $101 should nab you the item. Of course that is fluid and market driven, so keep any eye out on similar items they are selling (same condition, same everything) and that will give you a benchmark neighborhood of where their bid will goto. I highly, highly doubt that some worker is sitting there for the hundreds of daily auctions in which they participate... they set there high bid and walk away. Which is the truly smart way to approach such things. Lamenting about being outbid by a $ value, when you weren't willing to go there in the first place, is, ummmm.... curious. I'm not saying they aren't active in bids on certain rare or high ticket items that they don't want to lose, but most they just set and forget.

Remember, they have a wish list function that originates from their customer base, so they already know a portion of the demand for items via that wishlist data. They most likely hunt for those items, because they are already "wanted" by their regular customer base, and therefore much closer to sold than some other item that just lands in their inventory via an active trade-in or sale.

Just curious, do you have any sense of their operational overhead just in inventory costs and storage/space? Not other expenses, just the inventory side.



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Joe Walerko
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darthhugo wrote:
Why don't you just outbid them in the first place? It seems like your highest price to pay is lower than theirs. Do you have suggestions on a better system to distribute goods and services?

I can't (or won't) outbid them for auctions, plain and simple. I want to complete the collection, but I have a preconceived range of what I consider reasonable. They're willing to easily go above what I as a collector would want to spend, since (and I'm admittedly guessing here) they a) currently have more spending money than I do, and b) intend to resell their purchases at a massive markup so it's only a short-term loss of funds leading to a greater profit in the long-term.

And, like you and others have said, as long as folks are willing to pay NKG's high prices, then there's no reason to ever lower them. From a business point of view, it makes sense.

But as a collector, it sucks. Resellers like NKG will always outbid me, and keep me from finishing a collection with a smaller budget. I've even reached out to sellers that I've lost to, congratulating them on the sale but letting them know that they just sold to a reseller. Those sellers, while sad to see items go to retailers, simply shrug because money is money. It's just the nature of the system. I'm not raging against the machine here, just lamenting the difficulty of working within it.

I could just as easily whine about getting my hands on Hero Quest expansions. My collection is peanuts compared to what those sets sell for on eBay. shake
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Joe Walerko
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darthhugo wrote:
joe_games wrote:
This is a mild rant, and doesn't have anything to do with Noble Knight Games as a business.

These guys keep snatching away my eBay auction prospects and it's really annoying. I've been slowly working on completing my collection of 21st Century Games miniature D&D books & box sets. The items are relatively obscure, and a pain to locate on eBay. And almost every time I've found an item, Noble Knight Games outbids me. How do I know? Because a few days later the same items come back on eBay with a 200% markup from NKG. And these items' appearance on eBay are rare enough that I doubt it's a coincidence.

I'm not saying they don't have the right to do this. They're a business, and if they want to buy an item for $70 and then charge $200 for it, that's fine. I think their prices can often be outrageous, and as a consumer I exercise my right to not buy their merchandise. I'm still going to keep hunting for reasonable sales elsewhere until I complete my collection.

I just hate losing auctions to resellers with money to burn, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Like I said, a small rant.

Pro-tip about NK... they will never pay, or mostly never pay more than 50% their marked up price. So, if you indicate they are selling it for $200, a bid of $101 should nab you the item. Of course that is fluid and market driven, so keep any eye out on similar items they are selling (same condition, same everything) and that will give you a benchmark neighborhood of where their bid will goto. I highly, highly doubt that some worker is sitting there for the hundreds of daily auctions in which they participate... they set there high bid and walk away. Which is the truly smart way to approach such things. Lamenting about being outbid by a $ value, when you weren't willing to go there in the first place, is, ummmm.... curious. I'm not saying they aren't active in bids on certain rare or high ticket items that they don't want to lose, but most they just set and forget.

Remember, they have a wish list function that originates from their customer base, so they already know a portion of the demand for items via that wishlist data. They most likely hunt for those items, because they are already "wanted" by their regular customer base, and therefore much closer to sold than some other item that just lands in their inventory via an active trade-in or sale.

Just curious, do you have any sense of their operational overhead just in inventory costs and storage/space? Not other expenses, just the inventory side.




I'm sure they they have their sights on lots of auctions, and I'm sure it's a very "set and forget" approach. The last auction I lost was for three items, two of which would have completed my collection. The third item I already owned, and I previously paid about $50 for. So I set my high bid at around $150 (since I thought that about $50 per item was on par historically with what I've seen over the past year or so). NK beat me out by a LARGE margin (somewhere over $200). I thought that the items were worth what I set my high bid for, and now they're being sold by NK for about $450 total across three sales.

I'm only illustrating this example because I'm not going to try and outwit NK. There's no way I would have paid over $200 for that auction, and I don't regret my choice. I'm a collector, they're a business, and I'm not going to go outside my comfort zone to "beat" them. The best I can do I find a way to locate an alternate seller, or auction, or trade opportunity. And I'm sure I will one day. Again, it's just an annoyance that auctions can be hard to win when faced against businesses with lots more money to invest.
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Jerry
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You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."
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Thanks for letting us know the real value of those items, now we will all put these on our eBay alerts :arrrh: :)
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gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.
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gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

Calling what NK thinks they can sell it for as the item's value is...off, to me. They could be way off in their estimation. And since their value in it is completely related to what they think someone else would buy.

Which is the interesting part of the arbitrage market here - is value defined by what a reseller would pay for it, or by what someone would eventually pay the reseller for it?
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Idaho11 wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

Calling what NK thinks they can sell it for as the item's value is...off, to me. They could be way off in their estimation. And since their value in it is completely related to what they think someone else would buy.

Absolutely. But NK isn't bidding what they think they can resell it for, they're bidding somewhere in the neighborhood of half of that. If nothing else, the fact they're willing to pay that much means the item is worth at least that amount, right?
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If the amount of transactions for a particular item is small, its hard to make any assumption about the value of it based on the few transaction that occurred.

It was worth that much to NK, but thats about it. Its hard to generalize.
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joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.

I don't understand your complaint. If NK were a collector instead of a retailer, would it still bother you that they're willing to spend more? Why not? You don't like someone attempting to arbitrage?

You are not willing to pay an item's fair value. You're wiling to pay what you think the fair value is, which is not the same thing. I'm not saying the fair value is what NK wants to sell it for, but it is clearly higher than your bids, or else you would win, regardless of how much cash NK brings to the table.
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gversace wrote:
joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.

I don't understand your complaint. If NK were a collector instead of a retailer, would it still bother you that they're willing to spend more? Why not? You don't like someone attempting to arbitrage?

You are not willing to pay an item's fair value. You're wiling to pay what you think the fair value is, which is not the same thing. I'm not saying the fair value is what NK wants to sell it for, but it is clearly higher than your bids, or else you would win, regardless of how much cash NK brings to the table.

If NK were a collector? It would only bother me because I lost the auction, which I can live with just fine. But NK flipping the items a few days later at huge markups does bother me.

Hypothetical example: I want an item that only shows up on eBay maybe once every 6 months or so, and I bid $50, based on my knowledge that it's something that usually goes for $40 - $60. The auction ends, and NK wins with a bid of $65. Okay, that sucks and I can't complain too much because I don't think that the item was worth $65, and it was my choice to aim for $50. Two days later, the item shows up again with a BIN of $200. Well, shit. Am I enraged? No, just annoyed because I know I want the item, and I'll have to wait months before I may see it again for a price that I'm willing to pay because there's no way I'll shell out $200. Maybe someone else will pay $200, and that's why they set that price so high. But I know that when resellers don't get involved, that item usually goes for $40 - $60. And that tells me what collectors are willing to give up to own and appreciate that item, and that's what I personally consider a "fair" value.

And that's my point. I'm simply annoyed because resellers often skew what I opine a "fair" auction should be. They come to the table with a different motivation, and are willing to spend larger amounts of money because they expect to get it back later on. It's especially annoying when the above scenario plays out over and over again over the course of a couple years.

To me, a debate over what's "fair" and what defines an item's "value" is irrelevant to my post. I'm just tired of losing auctions and seeing the items I miss out on get flipped for crazy prices. And I wanted to vent. And I did. So thanks for listening.

EDIT: I started this thread because I was mildly annoyed by a first-world inconvenience, and was curious if anyone else felt the same way. I've already moved on, but if you all want to keep debating the topic or pointing out the flaws/merits of my opinions, feel free. However, I'm done commenting here, and I appreciate the brief opportunity to cry on some shoulders.
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Daniel Shane
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If the item is overvalued, NK will eventually have too many in stock and will stop bidding.

If they do not run out of stock, I'm afraid that the real value of your item has increased.

Humans are not perfect machine that evaluate perfectly the price of a certain good. If that were the case, everyone would bid exactly the right amount and it would be a race to who bids first.

If NK resold those items on Ebay, people would see the completed items, and suddenly may feel that the new price is ok, because someone else purchased it.

Most people evaluate the price of a good based solely on what other are prepared to pay for it (and they usually want to pay less than that even then).


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joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.

I don't understand your complaint. If NK were a collector instead of a retailer, would it still bother you that they're willing to spend more? Why not? You don't like someone attempting to arbitrage?

You are not willing to pay an item's fair value. You're wiling to pay what you think the fair value is, which is not the same thing. I'm not saying the fair value is what NK wants to sell it for, but it is clearly higher than your bids, or else you would win, regardless of how much cash NK brings to the table.

If NK were a collector? It would only bother me because I lost the auction, which I can live with just fine. But NK flipping the items a few days later at huge markups does bother me.

Hypothetical example: I want an item that only shows up on eBay maybe once every 6 months or so, and I bid $50, based on my knowledge that it's something that usually goes for $40 - $60. The auction ends, and NK wins with a bid of $65. Okay, that sucks and I can't complain too much because I don't think that the item was worth $65, and it was my choice to aim for $50. Two days later, the item shows up again with a BIN of $200. Well, shit. Am I enraged? No, just annoyed because I know I want the item, and I'll have to wait months before I may see it again for a price that I'm willing to pay because there's no way I'll shell out $200. Maybe someone else will pay $200, and that's why they set that price so high. But I know that when resellers don't get involved, that item usually goes for $40 - $60. And that tells me what collectors are willing to give up to own and appreciate that item, and that's what I personally consider a "fair" value.

And that's my point. I'm simply annoyed because resellers often skew what I opine a "fair" auction should be. They come to the table with a different motivation, and are willing to spend larger amounts of money because they expect to get it back later on. It's especially annoying when the above scenario plays out over and over again over the course of a couple years.

To me, a debate over what's "fair" and what defines an item's "value" is irrelevant to my post. I'm just tired of losing auctions and seeing the items I miss out on get flipped for crazy prices. And I wanted to vent. And I did. So thanks for listening.

If you bid $50 and NK won with $65 that means there was at least one other person who was willing to pay more than $50. You would have lost the auction to them even if NK wasn't bidding.

Your complaint boils down to "I can't complete my collection for what I'm willing to pay (i.e. below market value.") NK doesn't seem to have anything to do with that. It also doesn't seem to be much to rant about. I'd like to pay $10,000 for a Maserati but people keep paying more, keeping me from having it. Too bad for me.
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It is frusterating when something you want consistantly sells for more than you can or are willing to pay for it. It happens to me a lot on several sets of things. But keep looking because sometimes, you just get lucky.

A case in point- I collect advent calendars. There was one particular one that I wanted from the 50s that the very very few times I saw it for sale, it was $150 or more. And then two showed up on Ebay in the same week for under $10. (I'm not insane, I bought them both!) One of the people I bought it from said that he just threw it up on Ebay to see if anyone might like it before he threw it in the bin.

Also? Try to remember that half the fun of collecting something is looking for items. When you finish your collection, that fun goes away.
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joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.

Resellers will always aim for items that are in demand. Sure, they can price out those with lesser cash, and frustrating, but that sure is a situation which you will never win.

And auctions are specific to the moment of sale.. so what the bidders are willing to pay at that moment. Let's just take your acquisition points throughout your history... what if there were more interested parties at those bidding moments... you may have been outbid. So, for whatever reason, you got lucky by not having as many bidders and you bid the most at that moment. Can we all lament how you may have gotten away with gouging the seller for items that should have been valued at a greater price? Nah... good for you. And good for NK for outbidding the next highest bidder (in this case, maybe you.) It is a fair game being played.

Hey, if your completionist urges are that high for this collection, you should just shell out the premium to get you over the line. If you are trying to save some money for rare items, then you will just have to wait until the stars align. Collectibles ebb and flow in value, but at the same time, they aren't making any more, so best grab it while you can.

Sometimes, inefficiency is necessary. Sell off something not as valuable to you to subsidize the purchase.

Maybe you could finance it with a PayPal CC?

So many options to slay this dragon. Good luck.



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Psauberer wrote:
joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
joe_games wrote:
gversace wrote:
You apparently aren't willing to pay even close to the item's value. That's not NK's fault. You read like you expect the seller to sell it to you at an extreme discount because you're a "collector."

An item's "value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. I've been able to purchase many items in my collection within a certain range, and the items that I lose to NK are above and beyond that range. I'm not blaming them, I just don't agree with what they set items' "value" to be. To the best of my knowledge, there is no official record of what the 21st Century Games' mini reprints are worth (which is what I'm collecting). I look at what they actually sell for on eBay (vs what people try to sell them for), and aim in that ballpark when I want to purchase something. As a collector, I don't expect discounts, but I hope to acquire an item within what I consider a reasonable range.

What resellers like NK do, on the other hand, are make an offer well outside the historical average and then resell while jacking up the price by several orders of magnitude, hoping that their artificially established value is accepted by customers.

From my perspective, I'm always willing to pay an item's fair value, and I never complain when I lose to someone who just barely beats me out; that's the nature of auctions. My annoyance is when I'm consistently steamrolled by a much larger entity that makes it even harder for me to collect the items that I enjoy (either intentionally or unintentionally).

And let me be clear. I'm not boycotting NKG or saying anyone else should or that they're unfair or what have you. I'm just saying that in many cases, collecting can royally suck when resellers are aiming for the same items you are.

I don't understand your complaint. If NK were a collector instead of a retailer, would it still bother you that they're willing to spend more? Why not? You don't like someone attempting to arbitrage?

You are not willing to pay an item's fair value. You're wiling to pay what you think the fair value is, which is not the same thing. I'm not saying the fair value is what NK wants to sell it for, but it is clearly higher than your bids, or else you would win, regardless of how much cash NK brings to the table.

If NK were a collector? It would only bother me because I lost the auction, which I can live with just fine. But NK flipping the items a few days later at huge markups does bother me.

Hypothetical example: I want an item that only shows up on eBay maybe once every 6 months or so, and I bid $50, based on my knowledge that it's something that usually goes for $40 - $60. The auction ends, and NK wins with a bid of $65. Okay, that sucks and I can't complain too much because I don't think that the item was worth $65, and it was my choice to aim for $50. Two days later, the item shows up again with a BIN of $200. Well, shit. Am I enraged? No, just annoyed because I know I want the item, and I'll have to wait months before I may see it again for a price that I'm willing to pay because there's no way I'll shell out $200. Maybe someone else will pay $200, and that's why they set that price so high. But I know that when resellers don't get involved, that item usually goes for $40 - $60. And that tells me what collectors are willing to give up to own and appreciate that item, and that's what I personally consider a "fair" value.

And that's my point. I'm simply annoyed because resellers often skew what I opine a "fair" auction should be. They come to the table with a different motivation, and are willing to spend larger amounts of money because they expect to get it back later on. It's especially annoying when the above scenario plays out over and over again over the course of a couple years.

To me, a debate over what's "fair" and what defines an item's "value" is irrelevant to my post. I'm just tired of losing auctions and seeing the items I miss out on get flipped for crazy prices. And I wanted to vent. And I did. So thanks for listening.

If you bid $50 and NK won with $65 that means there was at least one other person who was willing to pay more than $50. You would have lost the auction to them even if NK wasn't bidding.

Your complaint boils down to "I can't complete my collection for what I'm willing to pay (i.e. below market value.") NK doesn't seem to have anything to do with that. It also doesn't seem to be much to rant about. I'd like to pay $10,000 for a Maserati but people keep paying more, keeping me from having it. Too bad for me.

Love the Masserati example!


Oh, but the gas mileage and upkeep expenses are so high,that even if I purchased it for 10k, it would be too expensive to drive.
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Pauly Paul
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People seem to be missing the concept/point of a "mild rant".
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venrondua wrote:
People seem to be missing the concept/point of a "man child having a cry".

Corrected that for you
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venrondua wrote:
People seem to be missing the concept/point of a "mild rant".

We obviously disagree. That's weird on a internets site populated by niche hobbyists.



 
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