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Subject: Best Province Improvement? rss

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Drew Hauge
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Hypothetical situation-- Let's say you've managed to win the first two games of your Seafall campaign, and in the first one you took your favorite appellation. Which province improvement would you take next? Here are the options:

1) Replace one of your fields (Plunder 1, Gold 4 / Plunder 2, Gold 4) with a new one (Plunder 4, Gold 6)
2) Improve your leader's reputation from 2 to 3
3) Improve your leader's fortune from 2 to 3
4) Improve your province's garrison from 1 to 2
5) Replace your leader's appellation with a new one (and which one?)

I'm posing this as the question rather than "what would you choose first" since I assume most people would opt to go with an appellation for their first win, as covered in an earlier thread:https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1585137/what-will-you-grab-...
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Badger Man
Scotland
Edinburgh
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I would take the garrison improvement. A nice deterrent for those jealous sea captains. Tbh though, they are all tempting and damn I cannot wait to receive my copy!!!
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Sterling Wright
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Noblesville
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I think I would up my reputation. It has three benefits.
1. I can spend it to get an adviser.
2. I can use it to use an opponents port (though that is not very useful in the early game)
3. I can save it to the end and use it to try and remove enmity.

Of course, this is expecting my play group to continue to not play that aggressively. So no need for upping a field or garrison.

The dice would have to be rolling pretty badly for me to take fortune. At this point it seems to have limited use considering how many locations on the board are dangerous.
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Becq
United States
Cerritos
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My first upgrade will probably be an appellation, of course.

As to my second upgrade ... I think the only option I can say with some certainty that I don't plan on taking would be the appellation replacement. After all, if I was planning on a different appellation, why wouldn't I take that first? (Though later in the campaign, I could see the relative value of some appellations changing).

I think it depends on how the first two games (ie, the prologue and game 1) go. I will *probably* choose fortune, because it is versatile for helping with (at least some) endeavors as well as removing enmity. Assuming the amount of province raiding is light to moderate, I think that simply not returning fire (and therefore gaining some enmity stickers for the worst offenders) is as good as a garrison improvement, and it's (sort of) free.

If I find that raiding is *heavy*, then it'll probably be between a field upgrade and a garrison upgrade. Why the field upgrade? Well, it fortifies the weakest point in my province, and boosts my income, as well. It makes it so that I can't be raided for a single enmity any more, so I'll either burn their enmity tokens faster, or I'll have more dice on my response.

Then again, if the fields aren't popular targets (after all, they are only slightly better than a taxation, with the added bonus of inflicting a negative taxation on your opponent), then the garrison seems like the better option.

Of course, I don't expect to win the first two games in a row, so I'll likely have some time to get a feel for what I'm in most need of before that second win.
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Xenothon Stelnicki
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Gainesville
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This is what is so challenging for me based on everything I've read. I want to do EVERYTHING, so it's very difficult for me to make these choices. I feel like this is going to be my worst AP game ever even though it has a shot at being my #1, too.
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Steve
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I am all for the fields improvement. Increased income for the rest of the campain? Sign me up. That extra couple of good when you start will give you the edge every game you have it and they don't.
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AJ Harris
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I, too, would likely go for the field improvement. This is assuming that I had earned the appellation which gives me more Fortune already and therefore I wouldn't need to upgrade that one.
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Keith Pishnery
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Lakewood
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Appellation will be first win for most everyone I suspect, but as for that second win...

Gold is pretty useful (treasures, advisors, goods, etc) so the fields do seem like a good choice...as long as you can continue to defend them well against raiders.

Reputation has been shown but not proven to have a slight edge over Fortune in terms of versatility, although I still like the advantages Fortune gives you in perma-Glory.

I feel like the most valuable province areas already have a decent plunder value, so not sure about spending an improvement on garrison until it's strictly necessary.

I think I'd wait until new appellations are introduced into the game before replacing my first one.
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Drew Hauge
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I think I would tend to agree with all those who have said they'd pick the field once they have an appellation.

I think 6 extra gold per game (2 per winter assuming no raids on the field) seems better than 1 extra reputation, given the advisor costs we know of so far. It also seems better than 1 extra fortune, to me at least. Plus the boost in plunder value from 1 to 4 means that opponents will think twice about raiding that field and thereby giving up half their enmity for a relatively small reward.

I agree with Keith that the garrison upgrade probably seems the least necessary of all in the early stages, given that provinces have a pretty high defense to begin with. Depending on how valuable treasures get as the game progresses and how much I pursue that strategy, I could see eventually wanting to boost my garrison, just not so early in the campaign.

Getting a second appellation so early would definitely be a questionable move. I included it as an option since technically it is, but it seems like you'd be hurting yourself more than others by foregoing one of the other upgrades to just take a second appellation off the board for others.
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Frank Wolf
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I'd go with the field upgrade. Starting with that extra gold means you could upgrade a ship with your first action. Helpful for explorers or raiders. Alternatively the extra gold can help get your merchant on a little stronger right off the bat.
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Steven Sousa
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I'm actually leaning towards improving my field with my first victory, it's that strong. Unless there's an appellation that I absolutely must have.
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Ben Martell
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Lower Hutt
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I'm not sure about building up my field so quickly. If it is that obvious an advantage, I could see it setting me up as a target for a raid a year, so that people can stop the field producing. It might depend when in the campaign I would win my second game.

I'd be looking to take the appellation that improves reputation or fortune, and then use the second upgrade to permanently upgrade the other of those two.
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Andrew Pillow
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Worcester
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I'm probably going for the reputation upgrade as my second win bonus.

Fields get you an extra 6 gold over the game where as reputation will give you an early 3-4 gold to buy an advisor which could help boost your in game engine.

Hopefully you can upgrade the fields later.
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Citizen Keen
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I'll be playing with five players. So, even getting my first win may take a few games. Getting two, I'll probably be mostly done with the campaign.
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Keith Pishnery
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Lakewood
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CitizenKeen wrote:
I'll be playing with five players. So, even getting my first win may take a few games. Getting two, I'll probably be mostly done with the campaign.


Same here. I'm 8 games into Risk Legacy and still trying to get my second win haha.
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Drew Hauge
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CitizenKeen wrote:
I'll be playing with five players. So, even getting my first win may take a few games. Getting two, I'll probably be mostly done with the campaign.
A fair point! Maybe I should instead be pondering which ship stat is best to upgrade, as all players get to do that each game. I'm thinking Sail or Hold, as both of those are likely to be relevant to any of the four guilds. Then again, Explore and Raid might be the most fun.
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Edward Haag
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CitizenKeen wrote:
I'll be playing with five players. So, even getting my first win may take a few games. Getting two, I'll probably be mostly done with the campaign.

Indeed. If a campaign is about 15 games, and you have five players, each can expect about 3 wins (and therefore upgrades) by the end.

Use those upgrades wisely, because you likely won't be getting very many of them.
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Frank Wolf
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There may be ways to get upgrades outside of just winning. I count 63 available on the upgrade sheet. That is a bit of overkill even if you stretch the plays out to 20. Maybe more will come from milestone or exploration bonuses?
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Drew Hauge
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wolffrostbrew wrote:
There may be ways to get upgrades outside of just winning. I count 63 available on the upgrade sheet. That is a bit of overkill even if you stretch the plays out to 20. Maybe more will come from milestone or exploration bonuses?


Yeah, I hadn't thought of that but I bet you're right. There are 17 fields alone!

One other interesting thing about the upgrade sheet is the breakdown of the various upgrades available. Take Fortune for instance - there are four 3's, three 4's, two 5's, and one 6. The rules instruct the player taking the upgrade to take "the next highest number available". Could lead to some interesting runs on a certain upgrade type, or people holding out so as not to allow opponents to skip up to the next tier.
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Keith Pishnery
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wolffrostbrew wrote:
There may be ways to get upgrades outside of just winning. I count 63 available on the upgrade sheet. That is a bit of overkill even if you stretch the plays out to 20. Maybe more will come from milestone or exploration bonuses?


Yeah, I've been thinking about this as well. In the Explore section, I think, there's mention of gaining rewards from exploration endeavors, like goods or gold. Definitely something I missed the first time around. The Explore stuff won't just be events and whatnot happening to the game play, but actually benefits coming the way of the explorer.
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Ian Liddle
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Sandpoint
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I went with field for the first upgrade after appellation. We haven't hit 3 winters yet (we're only a handful of games in), so it's looking more like 4 gold extra per year. Even so, starting with 10 gold provides some really nice, flexible options.

The +3 increased defense more than offsets the attractiveness as a raid target, at least for the first one. Subsequent field upgrades definitely don't pack the same punch.
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Jason Pisani
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New Albany
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If you win twice you better Garrison. You are already a big target. Better be a difficult target.
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Drew Hauge
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I completed game 1 last night and managed to win, and

Spoiler (click to reveal)
I took the field improvement. From my province board, I had already managed to gain the "Adventurous" appellation at the start of game 1. It hasn't helped me yet since researching was not an available action during game 1, but I have a feeling it may come in handy in the future.
 
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Bill Collins
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Five games in. Our front runner (won two games out of five, in the lead by one point) has improved his Rep and Fortune one each. The guy right behind him who had a really strong game changed his Appelation because he never used it. I won Game 3 and improved my Garrison. I believe the player who won Game Two also improved Fortune.
 
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Marcel Cwertetschka
Germany
Vienna
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i won a couple of games and my upgrades are the following:
rep to 4 (1 free upgrade via milestone)
luck to 3
luck appelation
2 field 6 upgrades
1 field 8 upgrade


starting with 4rep, 4 luck and 20 gold (6 extra due to some "spoiler material") is pretty strong.
 
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