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Subject: Rewarding early stars rss

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Andy Latto
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The process of getting stars felt a little flat to me, because once you are sufficiently progressed towards a star that you know you can finish it before someone ends the game, there's no hurry to earn the star.

My suggested variant is that the first player to earn each star gains one extra point. You can put their star at the top of the row of stars to track it easily. I think this race for the first star in each category will add some tension to the race for stars throughout the game, rather than only at the end when players are close to 6 stars.

Haven't tried this yet, but plan to my next game. I'll report back on how it worked.
 
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Jamey Stegmaier
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Andy: We tried that during the playtesting process (players got a $ bonus for being the first to place a star on certain category), and it really hurt the game in the eyes of many playtesters. Instead of creating interesting and diverse engines that played off one another, players were simply racing to get a star. Sometimes those mechanisms in games provide fun, rewarding moments, but that was not the case for Scythe in playtests.
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Benjamin Lindvall
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You could also let that player take 1 coin immediately, as coins are points, but also useful during the game.

edit: see Jamey's comment now. I'd still be curious to see if you agree with the playtesters after trying it.
 
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Sherman Oaks
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I think the games that do the "get there first reward" best are the ones that don't just give points but add a power that accelerates/augments your engine. Marco Polo awards you for being the first one to reach cities by giving you bonus tiles. At the beginning of each round you get to take the rewards listed on you bonus tiles. Food chain magnate rewards players for being the first to an action generally by making that action free for the rest of the game for that player.

I don't know if I'd really recommend this with Scythe since it already has so many player powers plus the factory and encounter cards serve a similar get-there-first purpose. Plus it's something you really have to balance for because it can easily lead to a "rich get richer" situation.
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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andylatto wrote:
The process of getting stars felt a little flat to me, because once you are sufficiently progressed towards a star that you know you can finish it before someone ends the game, there's no hurry to earn the star.


I respectfully disagree, since one of the prime advantages of accumulating stars is that if you do it well then you can be the one that decides when to end the game. Also, you can never know if you have time to finish it since it is easily possible for a smart player to gain two, maybe even three, stars in a single turn, leaving your stars uncompleted.
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Mick Whyte
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
andylatto wrote:
The process of getting stars felt a little flat to me, because once you are sufficiently progressed towards a star that you know you can finish it before someone ends the game, there's no hurry to earn the star.


I respectfully disagree, since one of the prime advantages of accumulating stars is that if you do it well then you can be the one that decides when to end the game. Also, you can never know if you have time to finish it since it is easily possible for a smart player to gain two, maybe even three, stars in single turn, leaving your stars uncompleted.


I once did four as house Stark (black faction: Saxony) , completed
2 objectives, won a combat and built my 4th building in one turn. Had I have gone for 2 combats I might have done 5, but I wasn't feeling that lucky. Everyone was on 4 stars and I had only 5 territories and 2 stars , then boom all 6 stars on the board 8 controlled territories with a popularity of 15. I won on $87 closest player had $60
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A J
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Mick_whyte wrote:
reverendunclebastard wrote:
andylatto wrote:
The process of getting stars felt a little flat to me, because once you are sufficiently progressed towards a star that you know you can finish it before someone ends the game, there's no hurry to earn the star.


I respectfully disagree, since one of the prime advantages of accumulating stars is that if you do it well then you can be the one that decides when to end the game. Also, you can never know if you have time to finish it since it is easily possible for a smart player to gain two, maybe even three, stars in single turn, leaving your stars uncompleted.


I once did four as house Stark (black faction: Saxony) , completed
2 objectives, won a combat and built my 4th building in one turn. Had I have gone for 2 combats I might have done 5, but I wasn't feeling that lucky. Everyone was on 4 stars and I had only 5 territories and 2 stars , then boom all 6 stars on the board 8 controlled territories with a popularity of 15. I won on $87 closest player had $60


Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm pretty sure you can only complete one objective per game.
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Bryce Leedham
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ayejae wrote:
Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm pretty sure you can only complete one objective per game.


Saxony can complete multiple objectives (and more than two combat stars) as its faction ability.
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A J
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ManicD wrote:
ayejae wrote:
Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm pretty sure you can only complete one objective per game.


Saxony can complete multiple objectives (and more than two combat stars) as its faction ability.


*Facepalm* Duh. shake
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Mick Whyte
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If you implemented a bonus for getting stars first Rusviet would be massively imbalanced with the combo of using their mech ability to get to the factory in 5 turns. Then spam a factory card that provides recruits or mechs. They would be unstoppable.

Also everyone would just go for what ever is easiest on their player mat rather than formulate long term strategy
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Andy Latto
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I'm pretty surprised that people seem to feel this would radically change strategies and massively imbalance the game. It's only a total of at most 6 points, and in my experience, the victory margins have always been considerably larger than this. And it would only be 6 points in the case that the ultimate game-end trigger got every single one of his starts before any other player, which seems wildly unlikely.
 
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Kurt Bieberbach
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andylatto wrote:
I'm pretty surprised that people seem to feel this would radically change strategies and massively imbalance the game. It's only a total of at most 6 points, and in my experience, the victory margins have always been considerably larger than this. And it would only be 6 points in the case that the ultimate game-end trigger got every single one of his starts before any other player, which seems wildly unlikely.


Well, those are all opinions with no experience, try it and see what you think. Of course, Jamey said they did try it and decided against it, so there's that. Doesn't mean you won't like it though.
 
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Chris Skelton
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Jimmydm90 wrote:
Marco Polo awards you for being the first one to reach cities by giving you bonus tiles. At the beginning of each round you get to take the rewards listed on you bonus tiles.


The bonuses you get for getting to cities(the big brown ones) first are just one time bonuses. Those cities have an action that only one player per round can use (maybe you were thinking of that?) The ongoing, beginning of the round bonuses are given to everyone who has a trading post in the small, blue towns. Man, I really want to play Marco Polo again (Scythe too!).

Either way you're right. The bonuses handed out were resources, not VPs. An analogue in Scythe would be to give some quantity of metal/wood/oil/food to players that get the first star in a category. You could even give popularity or power bumps as well (for the stars that didn't involved those things obviously). I'm curious, Jamey, was anything like that tried in playtesting? If so, how did testers react to that?
 
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