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Subject: What happens to unspent fight tokens when a player/monster passes? rss

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Marco Hoehener
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From reading the rule I understand that a player can pass anytime during the fight, event if he/she has tokens left. what happens to those tokens? The rule book says the shield tokens stay active and can still be used to block, but what happens to the skulls of a monster (when a player is the monster in a fight)?

In a game we just finished I had an ability that used the skulls of the enemy to do damage to theme as well as the '-'. If the monster passes when still having unspent skulls can i still trigger my ability or is it too late for that? (the monster didn't spend the skulls because of my mind melt ability)

Also what happens to casted '-'. if the are just removed from the fight then the "turn '-' into unblockable physical dmg"-card has to be spent at the beginning and only if I am the start player because the very next turn the '-' is gone. Or do the '-' token stay until the end of the round? or is withdrawing a '-' a fight action?

Too many fight questions that came up in the final fight against margath. really ruined a bit the climatic experience of the final fight after 2 hours of fun...

hope to find some answers here to not ruin another play session of this otherwise excellent game...

Cheers Marco
 
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David desJardins
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I'm not sure why you have so many questions because it seems from your comments you know the rules. If you pass than you pass. It doesn't change the tokens that are out, at all. Everything your opponent could do before you passed they can still do.
 
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Marco Hoehener
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DaviddesJ wrote:
I'm not sure why you have so many questions because it seems from your comments you know the rules. If you pass than you pass. It doesn't change the tokens that are out, at all. Everything your opponent could do before you passed they can still do.

Question is not if the tokens change but if they remain on the "battle field" after the player passes or if they are discarded for this round and not available anymore.

Also it can be a defensive strategy in a fight to, as an action, discard/spend a '-' so that i can't use it with my ability. But i don't know if that is possible. In other fights as i didn't have that skill card until late in the game we just removed the '-' at the beginning of the fighting round if there were no "wings" left.
 
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David desJardins
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mhoehener wrote:
Question is not if the tokens change but if they remain on the "battle field" after the player passes or if they are discarded for this round and not available anymore.


Well, discarding them would be a change. Is there anything in the rules to suggest that passing changes the tokens?
 
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David desJardins
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mhoehener wrote:
Also it can be a defensive strategy in a fight to, as an action, discard/spend a '-' so that i can't use it with my ability. But i don't if that is possible. In other fights as i didn't have that skill card until late in the game we just removed the '-' at the beginning of the fighting round.


It's not possible. And those tokens might be relevant in other ways, e.g., they could be flipped. It is wrong to just remove them.
 
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Marco Hoehener
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DaviddesJ wrote:
mhoehener wrote:
Also it can be a defensive strategy in a fight to, as an action, discard/spend a '-' so that i can't use it with my ability. But i don't if that is possible. In other fights as i didn't have that skill card until late in the game we just removed the '-' at the beginning of the fighting round.


It's not possible. And those tokens might be relevant in other ways, e.g., they could be flipped. It is wrong to just remove them.


We removed them once there were no "wings" left of course. not before, because as you said they could be flipped.

So to recap:
- '-' tokens if not flipped stay in combat until the end of the round or until a card effect or something specifically says to remove them. -- check

One question remains:
- Can I, as a combat action, choose to discard tokens and willingly renounce to play them or do I have to use them to full extent possible when i choose them in a combat action?
E.g.:
1) Player goes first and activates mind melt. I(the monster) do not wanna play my skull-dmg tokens because mind melt would hit me(the monster) to hard but my foe can do something with skull-tokens (due to a card) so after he/she activated mind melt on his/her turn I play all my skulls but without using them.
G
I think i stumbled over one combination ability+card that really messes up my mind

 
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David desJardins
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All of the things that you can do in combat as a combat action are listed under the "Combat Actions" section of the rulebook, and fully described in the associated sections.

For example, under "Physical Damage": "As a combat action, a hero can spend X hammers in his or her combat pool to deal X damage to his or her foe."

If it's not listed in the rules as a combat action (e.g., "take all of your hammers and discard those tokens without using them" is one of the things that's not listed) then you can't do it.
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Marco Hoehener
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DaviddesJ wrote:
All of the things that you can do in combat as a combat action are listed under the "Combat Actions" section of the rulebook, and fully described in the associated sections.

For example, under "Physical Damage": "As a combat action, a hero can spend X hammers in his or her combat pool to deal X damage to his or her foe."

If it's not listed in the rules as a combat action (e.g., "take all of your hammers and discard those tokens without using them" is one of the things that's not listed) then you can't do it.


I am sorry but just because it's not in the rules it doesn't mean it is not possible. Would be the first game that this is the case... See million of faqs and erratas....
 
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Julia
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mhoehener wrote:
I am sorry but just because it's not in the rules it doesn't mean it is not possible


Right, but this is quite a dangerous line of thought. For the same reasons, I'm pretty sure that shouting "die, son of a wyvern" while fighting Margath means by no reason instant win, even though this is not in the rules either
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Dustin Crenshaw
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You guys are making this harder than it is.

All tokens stay in play even when you pass. They are only removed from play when used for an action. You must do the action to use them.
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David desJardins
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mhoehener wrote:
I am sorry but just because it's not in the rules it doesn't mean it is not possible. Would be the first game that this is the case... See million of faqs and erratas....


OK, if you are asking us, "Are the rules wrong and you can actually do things that aren't in the rules?" then no one here can answer this question. All we can do is read the rules.
 
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Marco Hoehener
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Scarlet Witch wrote:
mhoehener wrote:
I am sorry but just because it's not in the rules it doesn't mean it is not possible


Right, but this is quite a dangerous line of thought. For the same reasons, I'm pretty sure that shouting "die, son of a wyvern" while fighting Margath means by no reason instant win, even though this is not in the rules either


True. I guess the 'can' in the rules (German btw) messed with my brain.
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Marco Hoehener
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SeerMagic wrote:
You guys are making this harder than it is.

All tokens stay in play even when you pass. They are only removed from play when used for an action. You must do the action to use them.


Thx
 
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Marco Hoehener
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DaviddesJ wrote:
mhoehener wrote:
I am sorry but just because it's not in the rules it doesn't mean it is not possible. Would be the first game that this is the case... See million of faqs and erratas....


OK, if you are asking us, "Are the rules wrong and you can actually do things that aren't in the rules?" then no one here can answer this question. All we can do is read the rules.


Thx.
 
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Marco Hoehener
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/closed
 
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Chuck Gray
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I'm not sure this was adequately answered.

If you do not wish to perform a combat action, you may pass.
If you pass, you cannot perform any more combat actions
during this round of combat, but you can still spend shield symbols.
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Marco Hoehener
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Chuckfreakingg wrote:
I'm not sure this was adequately answered.

If you do not wish to perform a combat action, you may pass.
If you pass, you cannot perform any more combat actions
during this round of combat, but you can still spend shield symbols.


It was. It was not about passing it was about discarding tokens without using them and without passing.
 
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