roger cox
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I bought Tactics--every ship--Acts I, II and III. I spent all my time trying to decipher how to make a game with a Star Trek theme could have ships with abilities more suited to Superman and Wonder Woman. Then, I bought Attack Wing. Not EVERY ship, but too many. Shoulda learned my lesson I know, but it's STAR TREK!!! cool I figured they had to get better. They did, but only marginally. So, before I jump on Frontiers---IS this a real Star TRek, Klingons and Fed shoot-em-up with Kirk, and Spock and phasers and tractor beams--and NO invisibility or super strength or liquefy? I also have the Fleet Captains game with all 3 expansions and it's passable--just too fiddly. But when you're gonna play with miniatures that have a rotating disc on the bottom that changes the shields,attack, and whatever other factors there are, fiddly is part of the game. So, is it a worthwhile Trek game, or more Mage Knight with Star TRek pasted on the box? Also, is there ANY way to use the ships from Tactics for anything besides Christmas tree ornaments? Can they be altered (by that I mean with no major arts and crafts ability) and used in Attack Wing?
 
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Erv Walter
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Star Trek Frontiers is 93% the same as Mage Knight. Don't expect a new game. That said, with a couple exceptions, the theme works quite well with the Mage Knight mechanics.

For more details on the differences, see this post:

http://www.boxofdelights.net/star-trek-frontiers/
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Barry Miller
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I have Fleet Captions and love it. I just bought Frontiers and love that, too. But I like Fleet Captains better, as it does a better job of delivering "that feel" you so eloquently identified.

I do not have, nor have I ever played Mage Knight. I've never had an interest in the theme, so I would never have considered playing it, past, present, and future.

But along came Frontiers and knowing about the rave reviews MK has received, (despite my lack of interest in it), it was a no-brainer decision to purchase Frontiers. So where am I going with this?

If you like Star Trek, and don't mind "fiddly" (as you attributed to ST:FC), I'd say IT IS A WORTHWHILE STAR TREK game! But, as others have said, and as I understand, it is still simply Mage Knight with the Start Trek theme pasted on (but oh, so very well).

Also consider that most reviewers claim that the Star Trek theme fits the Mage Knight system better than Mage Knight does! Regardless, you won't find any sort of super-natural powers or anything like that. (It sounds like that's a predominate concern of yours). But YOU WILL find some rather anti-thematic elements to the game. Such as...

As Picard, you can blow-up a Class M planet just for feeling like it. So if you can be OK with that, then I would NOT pass on this game. (But I still like Fleet Captains better).

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I never played Mage Knight but Star Trek Frontiers went over well with my game groups while Star Trek Fleet Captains fell flat. So in my case, at least, Star Trek Frontiers has been a good game.
 
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Jon Del Arroz
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bgm1961 wrote:

As Picard, you can blow-up a Class M planet just for feeling like it. So if you can be OK with that, then I would NOT pass on this game. (But I still like Fleet Captains better).



Picard always could with the power of the Enterprise at his disposal. The question is WOULD he. And if you don't make that decision the way Picard would, that's on you, not the game.
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otomo jon wrote:
bgm1961 wrote:

As Picard, you can blow-up a Class M planet just for feeling like it. So if you can be OK with that, then I would NOT pass on this game. (But I still like Fleet Captains better).



Picard always could with the power of the Enterprise at his disposal. The question is WOULD he. And if you don't make that decision the way Picard would, that's on you, not the game.


This.

If you do not even have the option, how is always choosing the "right" thing to do any kind of achievement?
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W. Cracker
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This Picard would.
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Cracky McCracken
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Hey OP... have you ever played Star Fleet Battles: Captain's Edition Basic Set by ADB? The best Star Trek sim imo. A classic.
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Neil Edmonds
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I've already provided 9 canon examples of how a planet could be blown up and still follow series canon without having to use the "alternate universe" trope:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/23147624#23147624

I hope it helps you enjoy the full range of options available in the game guilt-free.
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W. Cracker
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Autoduelist wrote:
I've already provided 9 canon examples of how a planet could be blown up and still follow series canon without having to use the "alternate universe" trope:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/23147624#23147624

I hope it helps you enjoy the full range of options available in the game guilt-free.


No arguments with your scenarios. Or, borrowing from Dr. Strangelove. The Enterprise is called to attempt negotiations between two planets that have been locked in war for decades. During negotiations Picard et al discover that one of the warring planets has created redundant doomsday devices which can consume both planets by creating a massive black hole. Negotiations break down and fearing defeat, the ruler of the planet in possession of the doomsday devices triggers them. Picard has already discerned that this will not only destroy the warring planets, but also another neutral planet of peaceful inhabitants. The only way to stop the devices from forming the black hole is by the destruction of the entire planet.
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Drew Gormley
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bgm1961 wrote:

I have Fleet Captions and love it. I just bought Frontiers and love that, too. But I like Fleet Captains better, as it does a better job of delivering "that feel" you so eloquently identified.

I do not have, nor have I ever played Mage Knight. I've never had an interest in the theme, so I would never have considered playing it, past, present, and future.

But along came Frontiers and knowing about the rave reviews MK has received, (despite my lack of interest in it), it was a no-brainer decision to purchase Frontiers. So where am I going with this?

If you like Star Trek, and don't mind "fiddly" (as you attributed to ST:FC), I'd say IT IS A WORTHWHILE STAR TREK game! But, as others have said, and as I understand, it is still simply Mage Knight with the Start Trek theme pasted on (but oh, so very well).

Also consider that most reviewers claim that the Star Trek theme fits the Mage Knight system better than Mage Knight does! Regardless, you won't find any sort of super-natural powers or anything like that. (It sounds like that's a predominate concern of yours). But YOU WILL find some rather anti-thematic elements to the game. Such as...

As Picard, you can blow-up a Class M planet just for feeling like it. So if you can be OK with that, then I would NOT pass on this game. (But I still like Fleet Captains better).



I agree with Barry here. Based on everything you said OP, I'm surprised you don't love fleet captains, as I think it's absolutely the game you're looking for. I've never played Mage Knight, and don't know much about the universe, but when I sat down to play Frontiers, I easily could've thought that it was just a Star Trek game from the outset. Granted, there's much in Star Trek that you can't do in this game (aka buy Fleet Captains, now), but there isn't much in this game that you can't do in Star Trek, if that makes sense. It's slightly less thematic when it comes to crew, as you can have non Federation crew on your Federation star ship, etc., but if you're willing to do a little thinking, you can come up with a solid reason

However,if you find Fleet Captains to be fiddly (which I very much so do not), I'd suggest you stay away from anything Vlaada has designed, (especially) including Frontiers.
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Peter Knapp
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rogeracox wrote:
Also, is there ANY way to use the ships from Tactics for anything besides Christmas tree ornaments? Can they be altered (by that I mean with no major arts and crafts ability) and used in Attack Wing?


Just to pick up on your last comment here, it is possible, but will require some arts and crafts ability - up to you if its too much (practice with 1 model for eg):



This involved cutting the existing Tactics ship off of its base. Then in this case, using an Attack Wing peg, cut it and glue into the base of the model.

The issue is if you want to recreate all of the ship base plates and dials. That requires more craft skills, or simply using your existing manoeuvre card and writing your planned move...
 
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