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Descent: Journeys in the Dark (Second Edition)» Forums » General

Subject: App-questions and buyer advice rss

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Willie Lothberg
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I am thinking about getting this game and use it only together with the road to legend app and play fully co-op. Two questions comes to mind:

1. From what I can gather there seems to be little to none impact to the campaigns of how much content you own for 2nd edition. Is there anything "must have" I should buy besides the start box to get a rich experience playing the two campaigns?

2. I own the first edition of this game. If I get the conversion kit will I be able to use anything from first edition when playing with the app?
 
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Erik Burigo
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willienue wrote:
I am thinking about getting this game and use it only together with the road to legend app and play fully co-op. Two questions comes to mind:

1. From what I can gather there seems to be little to none impact to the campaigns of how much content you own for 2nd edition. Is there anything "must have" I should buy besides the start box to get a rich experience playing the two campaigns?

No must have. But a big box expansion (Labyrinth of Ruin or Shadows of Nerekhall) gives you the most additional content per buck (heroes, classes, monsters, lieutenants, items, conditions and tiles).

willienue wrote:
2. I own the first edition of this game. If I get the conversion kit will I be able to use anything from first edition when playing with the app?

No, the Conversion Kit has finished its purpose of bridging the gap between 1st and 2nd edition. It's now an obsolete product that gets no more support from FFG. If you aim to only play full coop with Road to Legend stay away from it. However, if you want to play the classic heroes-vs-overlord mode then it still adds a lot of variety (even if a bit unbalanced in some cases) for a small amount of money.
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Willie Lothberg
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Great reply, thank you!
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Keldar Ironshield
United States
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Painkeeper wrote:
willienue wrote:
I am thinking about getting this game and use it only together with the road to legend app and play fully co-op. Two questions comes to mind:

1. From what I can gather there seems to be little to none impact to the campaigns of how much content you own for 2nd edition. Is there anything "must have" I should buy besides the start box to get a rich experience playing the two campaigns?

No must have. But a big box expansion (Labyrinth of Ruin or Shadows of Nerekhall) gives you the most additional content per buck (heroes, classes, monsters, lieutenants, items, conditions and tiles).

willienue wrote:
2. I own the first edition of this game. If I get the conversion kit will I be able to use anything from first edition when playing with the app?

No, the Conversion Kit has finished its purpose of bridging the gap between 1st and 2nd edition. It's now an obsolete product that gets no more support from FFG. If you aim to only play full coop with Road to Legend stay away from it. However, if you want to play the classic heroes-vs-overlord mode then it still adds a lot of variety (even if a bit unbalanced in some cases) for a small amount of money.


I think you can use the conversion kit. I do but I have all the miniatures from 1e. There are only minor changes to stats for monsters from CC and new monster packs being released.

Here is a link showing differences.

https://boardgamegeek.com/article/22660356#22660356
 
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Sean Houston
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saxon1974 wrote:
Painkeeper wrote:
willienue wrote:
I am thinking about getting this game and use it only together with the road to legend app and play fully co-op. Two questions comes to mind:

1. From what I can gather there seems to be little to none impact to the campaigns of how much content you own for 2nd edition. Is there anything "must have" I should buy besides the start box to get a rich experience playing the two campaigns?

No must have. But a big box expansion (Labyrinth of Ruin or Shadows of Nerekhall) gives you the most additional content per buck (heroes, classes, monsters, lieutenants, items, conditions and tiles).

willienue wrote:
2. I own the first edition of this game. If I get the conversion kit will I be able to use anything from first edition when playing with the app?

No, the Conversion Kit has finished its purpose of bridging the gap between 1st and 2nd edition. It's now an obsolete product that gets no more support from FFG. If you aim to only play full coop with Road to Legend stay away from it. However, if you want to play the classic heroes-vs-overlord mode then it still adds a lot of variety (even if a bit unbalanced in some cases) for a small amount of money.


I think you can use the conversion kit. I do but I have all the miniatures from 1e. There are only minor changes to stats for monsters from CC and new monster packs being released.


Many changes are actually very much not minor. Things like Undying were changed dramatically, many monsters were increased in power in various ways, etc. Also, many of the heroes were rebalanced both upwards and downwards in meaningful ways.

It's still an option, but Painkeeper is quite correct in that it could very well be unbalanced.
 
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Keldar Ironshield
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SeanLuc wrote:
saxon1974 wrote:
Painkeeper wrote:
willienue wrote:
I am thinking about getting this game and use it only together with the road to legend app and play fully co-op. Two questions comes to mind:

1. From what I can gather there seems to be little to none impact to the campaigns of how much content you own for 2nd edition. Is there anything "must have" I should buy besides the start box to get a rich experience playing the two campaigns?

No must have. But a big box expansion (Labyrinth of Ruin or Shadows of Nerekhall) gives you the most additional content per buck (heroes, classes, monsters, lieutenants, items, conditions and tiles).

willienue wrote:
2. I own the first edition of this game. If I get the conversion kit will I be able to use anything from first edition when playing with the app?

No, the Conversion Kit has finished its purpose of bridging the gap between 1st and 2nd edition. It's now an obsolete product that gets no more support from FFG. If you aim to only play full coop with Road to Legend stay away from it. However, if you want to play the classic heroes-vs-overlord mode then it still adds a lot of variety (even if a bit unbalanced in some cases) for a small amount of money.


I think you can use the conversion kit. I do but I have all the miniatures from 1e. There are only minor changes to stats for monsters from CC and new monster packs being released.


Many changes are actually very much not minor. Things like Undying were changed dramatically, many monsters were increased in power in various ways, etc. Also, many of the heroes were rebalanced both upwards and downwards in meaningful ways.

It's still an option, but Painkeeper is quite correct in that it could very well be unbalanced.


Fair enough, I have used them and they have worked pretty well but this link shows changes so a person can decide. Honestly I just don't want to spend that much money on all the monster packs.

https://boardgamegeek.com/article/22660356#22660356
 
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Andreas W.
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I am in the same boat as you, getting into Descent for the RTL app mainly. I never was fond of the overlord gameplay, especially since I played Imperial Assault with an slightly "over ambitious" Imperial player.

I read alot of things regarding all the expansions and what to get. In the end that's what I went with for starters:

Base Game: Of course ^^
Lair of the Wyrm: Bigger boxes are supposed to give better value for the money but this one has fire based monsters which seem to be well supported in the Kindred Fire campaign when I got it right. Also adds side quest to Kindred Fire (and all future) campaign like all boxed expansions.
The Trollfens: Got it relatively cheap. ^^ Adds side quest to Kindred Fire (and all future) campaign like all boxed expansions.
Merick Farrow Lieutenant Pack: As per the official announcement of Kindred Fire "you can replace the token from the Core Set with a beautifully sculpted figure, and you also unlock a new peril that can cause Merick Farrow to invade your quest, even if he wouldn’t normally appear in it!"
Valyndra Lieutenant Pack: Badass Dragon! Just wanted that! ^^

Besides that, all Heroes & Monster sets seem to be a good choice because they add alot of replayability, the more monsters the better.
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Krzysztof RabidBlackDog
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Naitakal wrote:

Merick Farrow Lieutenant Pack: As per the official announcement of Kindred Fire "you can replace the token from the Core Set with a beautifully sculpted figure, and you also unlock a new peril that can cause Merick Farrow to invade your quest, even if he wouldn’t normally appear in it!"


If only this miniature was beautifully sculpted.
I have nothing against it, painted it recently (and finally) as I suspect it will be heavily used further in Kindred Fire I play with two groups (haven't finished it yet as we play once every 1-2 weeks), but it's easy to say for me that this is the worst miniature in all Descent collection.
Putting the latest expansions' problem with inconsistent scale (all recent minis seem to be bigger and more like heroic scale), this one was too small even back then, when only the base game was out. And the pose? Ugh. All the small details are a mess. Try to paint his face.
I am aware, that the Farrows miniatures are leftovers from the first edition, but other miniatures, like Alric, haven't aged so bad. This one was just bad from the beginning.

Ok, I've said it.

Still love Descent.
 
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Rob H
United States
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After much searching I could not find the post I was looking for that talked about Lieutenant packs as they relate to RtL app. The gist was that they add very little value as they will rarely show up and if they do, then you already lost anyway.

Can someone unpack what the value of LT. packs are for RtL. I am plotting out my purchasing and having a random mini-boss or three sounds cool. Yet nobody seems to recommend getting them. I don't own 2e at all yet, and am looking at jumping in for the co-op value.
 
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Andreas W.
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The post you are looking for is probably that one: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/224756-conten...

I am not sure though if a Lieutnant is part of the RTL campaign it might actually be worth it to have the proper miniature. That's why I got Merick Farrow.
 
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Rob H
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Ah, yes that's it. It was on the FFG forum. Doh.

Still, can anyone breakdown the mechanics (to a non 2e player) of how, when, or how often a Lt. might populate a RtL game? As I said, I like the idea of them showing up, but that linked post makes them sound like a waste of money as far as co-op RtL goes.
 
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Joe Rickard
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chaplin717 wrote:
Ah, yes that's it. It was on the FFG forum. Doh.

Still, can anyone breakdown the mechanics (to a non 2e player) of how, when, or how often a Lt. might populate a RtL game? As I said, I like the idea of them showing up, but that linked post makes them sound like a waste of money as far as co-op RtL goes.


As time passes in a quest the party will have to deal with both minor and major perils. These are events that happen between turns that make it harder for the heroes to complete the quest. If you move through a quest quickly you may be able to avoid perils completely. If you move slowly you will begin to receive minor and later major perils. If you have Lts. in your collection they can spawn along with a monster group as a major peril. This is in addition to any monsters that are specific to the quest.
 
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Ulises Vela
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chaplin717 wrote:
Ah, yes that's it. It was on the FFG forum. Doh.

Still, can anyone breakdown the mechanics (to a non 2e player) of how, when, or how often a Lt. might populate a RtL game? As I said, I like the idea of them showing up, but that linked post makes them sound like a waste of money as far as co-op RtL goes.


First, I hope you like to read ninja

I said that (on the quoted post) because from what I've played it's strange to see an Agent appearing in a quest. I have played 3 fully campaigns in Hard Mode (won 2/3) and I own 12 of 20 lieutenants.

But before going further, there's is something to know. There's something you could call a "Peril-clock". As quartersmostly said, during the gameplay there's some kind of clock timing the rounds spent inside the quest. The longer the clock keeps ticking, the stronger the perils will become. There are three types of Perils: Minor and Major, and what I call Deadly. Over time you get minor perils which are almost inoffensive, but when major perils arrive you start to see things are getting harder, and well, as it's name say it, the last peril is to finish the heroes once and for all.

Now, Agents can only be spawned by a Major Peril effect. Which, as quartersmostly pointed, means that if you finsih the quest efficently, you won't face major perils at all. But, if you happen to take too much time inside the quest, then, an Agent could appear, because spawning agents is not the only major peril. Nevertheless, from my expirience, after the Agent appears, you have aproximately around 3 to 4 rounds to finish the quest, because the next peril will be a Deadly (either Last Breath [you lose in 2 rounds] or Darkness...something [heroes receive a huge amount of direct damage over time]). You can pause this clock by completling objetives, but it is hard to do so becuase if you reached that amount of time inside the quest, that means you happen to be either too wounded or bad positioned. Lastly, this clock is much more shorter when playing in hard mode, so you really want to finsih quest faster.

Been said that, I have only been invaded by:

-Lady Eliza Farrow (along with 4 Changellings) on the Interlude. I was too wounded and the objetive was far from where the heroes were, I lost after a couple rounds because moral reached zero.

-Lord Merrick Farrow (along with 2 minions and 1 master Fire Imps) on the MoB side quest. Funny thing actually, to see the Agent on his own campaign, something in the traditional game is forbidden. Three rounds after he appeared, "Last Breath" major peril pop out and I lost. I have the screenshot if you want me to post it.

-Skarn (alone) on the side quest "Arachnophobia". I was doing pretty good until it appeared. This one has been my favorite figth againts an Agent because I really had time to figth him, as the perils stop because I was completing objetives, I managed to enjoy the figth. I almost lost beacuse I was too confident on this one whistle hahahahaha.

-Belthir(along with 2 Hybrid Sentinels) on the intro mission of Kindred Fire. He didn't do much because Lord Merrick Farrow was already dead and the Elemental was weak (quest almost done). He just activated once before I finished the quest. I won this one.

Another thing is, in none of the expansion's side quests lieutenants are used. Although MoB side quest actually uses 1 lieutenant as a boss (I won't say who to avoid spoilers).

I mean, I would love to see a set of perils built around Agents, like "A group of trolls are prowling the area, you must be careful each hero test [Awareness], if more heroes fail than pass, place 1 troll", incrising this until you finally have (with a deadly peril ofc) Bol' Goreth and he's 2 Trolls bodyguards. Or "Spiders keep coming from nowhere heroes test Knowledge" if fails place 1 cave spider. Then, Bane Spides, then Arachuyras, and finally Queen Ariad.

Or why can't Agents be the "Unique" monsters?

Spoiler (click to reveal)
Why can't the Dragon you are hunting be Valyndra? Or why isn't the tormentent soul in MoR Skarn or Tristayne Olliven? Why is the spleeping troll in the cave an Ettin (or Giant)? Why isn't arachnophobia a quest made for Ariand or Queen Ariad?
I know Agents can be strong but why then Unique Monsters have their HP boosted?


In conclusion, I feel lieutenants/agents aren't used in RtL, just 4 appearences on 3 campaigns, it's like an Agent per campaign.

Perhaps buying Merrick may be worth the cost. He is the main boss of the Campaign so he, for sure, appears in many quests. Also, you can go for Eliza, Alric and Splig (Rise of All Goblins) which appear too on the campaign(s).

That's why I said lieutenant packs aren't for RtL, they are better for the traditional game, IMO. I have them because I use them on my campaings with my friends, but when it comes to me playing (solo) kindred fire, I do not bother to take them out of the box.
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Fox Reinard
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In answer to your questions about why specific Agents can't appear in side quests:

Not everyone owns even a single Lieutenant Pack. The side quests are designed for those either with a specific expansion (using a Lieutenant at most) or with the core game (seldom with specific lieutenants, none that I have seen in one of the core side quests so far).

Having the opposition be Agents if you own Agents would be probably unfair to those who do own said agents, even if they would see more use.
 
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Rob H
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Wow Velaur, that was a great response. I think I understand why they won't appear often, and once they do it's probably about to be over. I hope they adjust the mechanics on that as I would really like to see the LTs. be random special monsters that could appear as mini-bosses rather than harbingers of instant loss conditions.

And also, if I am understanding you, you were the one that wrote the advice on FFG forum. Thank you, I am using that to gauge my choices and only holding off ordering to see what news comes out of Gencon.

Questions:

1) Is the peril clock actual time (minutes) or simply turn count?
2) What monsters in Heroes and Monster sets are "fire" and thus better for Kindred campaign?
3) Besides talking about just sets or retail packages, what individual monsters, heroes, or classes stand out as generally fun, favorites, bringing cool rules to the table, etc (with an eye toward Road to Legend)? Which are the opposite? If there is a better post for this question, does anyone have a link?

Thanks again all.
 
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Ulises Vela
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foxreinard wrote:
In answer to your questions about why specific Agents can't appear in side quests:

Not everyone owns even a single Lieutenant Pack. The side quests are designed for those either with a specific expansion (using a Lieutenant at most) or with the core game (seldom with specific lieutenants, none that I have seen in one of the core side quests so far).

Having the opposition be Agents if you own Agents would be probably unfair to those who do own said agents, even if they would see more use.


Ah yeah, you are rigth...hehe The correct question should be: Why aren lieutenants not use on their on expansion? And not "why aren't they used as Unique Monsters?" hehehe Yes, as you said, Unique Monsters/Agents would be more difficult to implement. But still, I would love to figth a different Lieutenant aside from the Farrows.

chaplin717 wrote:
...if I am understanding you, you were the one that wrote the advice on FFG forum...


Yes, I'm Volkren on FFG forums.

chaplin717 wrote:
1) Is the peril clock actual time (minutes) or simply turn count?


1) It's set by round countdown. I don't know the precise rounds per quest or perils, but I have noticed they are linked to what you do on the quest (killing a group of monsters, finishing objetives, openning doors). This in order to avoid heroes recovering and looting.

chaplin717 wrote:
2) What monsters in Heroes and Monster sets are "fire" and thus better for Kindred campaign?


2) Well, about "Fire" and Burning, any monster with the Fire Trait will do burning: Demon Lord (Treaty of Champions), Elemental (Core Set), Fire Imps (Lair of the Wyrm), Hellhound (Bonds of the Wild) and Lava Beetle (Crown of Destiny); interestingly, Blood Apes (Stewards of the Secret) and Ynfernal Hulks (Shadow of Nerekhall) will not.

One other thing is, RtL quests are designed equal to the traditional paper quest. There are predifined monster groups and there are open groups. Open groups in RtL are selected by their traits (equal to a traditional game) from a pool of monsters, so fire monsters could appear just in the quest where Merrick appears or whenever a Fire monster is required. Therefore, fire monsters are not the only ones used, there is actually a diversification of monsters used.

I mean, you could go for fire monsters and don't see them too often. For example, the two starting monsters (open groups) in the introduction quest are "Cave" and "Civilization". Which bring us to the thrid question.

chaplin717 wrote:
3) Besides talking about just sets or retail packages, what individual monsters, heroes, or classes stand out as generally fun, favorites, bringing cool rules to the table, etc (with an eye toward Road to Legend)? Which are the opposite? If there is a better post for this question, does anyone have a link?


3) Mmm...this is a tricky because it depends on your personal taste, how will you be playing RtL and who will you playing with. I have a post about my personal Top 3 Heroes and Classes for RtL: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/223433-classe....
This rank is thought considering heroes and classes alone, no composition is required.

I think you will have to discover the fun aspect by yourself because everyone plays differently. For example, I play alone on Hard Mode with 4 heroes, so I tend to look for efficiency, and not the fantasy-narrative aspect.

You could find fun or interesting going with a:
-full healer party: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/225418-all-he...
-full familiar party: Beastmaster + necromancer + geomancer + conjurer.
-hardcore #YOLO mode: Serena + Raythen + Orkwell + Ravaella Ligthfoot.
-dwarf party: Augur Grisom + Raythen + Grisban + Corbin.
-orc party: Tarha + One Fist + Durik + Elder Mok.
-LotR party: Lindel + Grisban + Leoric + Tomble.

About monsters, there's no much to say because in RtL they most of the time just "Move + Attack". The challenge really comes from their activation effect...and perils. For example, I hate figthing Lava Beetles because besides having blats they could burn (well, not hate, like you know "pfff..not this guys cry"). Therefore, here's a file that contains all of the data of monsters, lieutenants, perils and events (done by impish1234) that shows how everything in RtL works (if you don't mind spoiling yourself ofc): https://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/132227/rtl-excel-overview...
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