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Evolution: The Beginning» Forums » Rules

Subject: Long-necked carnivores--is that a thing? rss

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Ken B.
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Part of me is thinking that you'd skip the part where they'd get the free food (because they're carnivores.) But then another part of me is like, "You idiot, you're applying rules where they aren't there."

Carnivores simply can't eat from the Watering Hole. That's the only restriction. ....right?
 
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Mark Jackson
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We have been playing that this is possible. We justified it by saying they were eating a bunch of monkeys out of the treetops Im guessing that if this wasn't possible they would day so on the card or in the rules.
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Dominic Crapuchettes
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Bethesda
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franklincobb wrote:
Part of me is thinking that you'd skip the part where they'd get the free food (because they're carnivores.) But then another part of me is like, "You idiot, you're applying rules where they aren't there."

Carnivores simply can't eat from the Watering Hole. That's the only restriction. ....right?


Correct! I usually say they're eating eggs from nests but I prefer the monkey story from the post above. That'll be my new "official" explanation.

Game Design
I decided to remove the complication of Plant Food versus Meat Food in order to simplify the rules explanation and because new players will inevitably put cards together which were not intended to work together. Like my Mom - she put a Long Neck on a Carnivore twice during the same game even though, at the time, they didn't provide any benefit. After having to tell her twice within the span of 7 minutes I decided I should start thinking deeply about how to remove as many fiddly restrictions as possible.

Strategy
While you are allowed to put a Long Neck on a Carnivore, it does not happen very often because:

1) You want to take a bite out of other players' species whenever possible and a Long Neck fills up 3 Population.
2) It uses up a slot that could be used for a defensive trait or an aggressive trait.

So the ecosystem has an inherent tendency to keep long neck carnivores from evolving, though it does happen on occasion.
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'Arctica' Gary
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Just to muddy the waters here, the rules do actually explicitly state that a Carnivore may "Only eat by attacking other species"

So, based on my interpretation of the Rule Book itself, a Long Neck Carnivore is not possible.


However, that is far less fun than the Long Neck Carnivore scenario. Additionally, many people aren't going to get to page 10 in the rule book before they start playing, and the actual text on the Carnivore card is not as specific - as it only mentions that the Carnivore can't eat from the Watering hole, without the more-specific rules text of "Can only eat by attacking"

So, we ended up playing by allowing Long Neck Carnivore - because its more fun.


Just pointing it out because if there is ever an Evolution: The Beginning tournament, it could be a point of contention due to the text in the rule book.
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Bruce Voge III
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3wgames wrote:
Just to muddy the waters here, the rules do actually explicitly state that a Carnivore may "Only eat by attacking other species"

So, based on my interpretation of the Rule Book itself, a Long Neck Carnivore is not possible.


However, that is far less fun than the Long Neck Carnivore scenario. Additionally, many people aren't going to get to page 10 in the rule book before they start playing, and the actual text on the Carnivore card is not as specific - as it only mentions that the Carnivore can't eat from the Watering hole, without the more-specific rules text of "Can only eat by attacking"

So, we ended up playing by allowing Long Neck Carnivore - because its more fun.


Just pointing it out because if there is ever an Evolution: The Beginning tournament, it could be a point of contention due to the text in the rule book.


Just to chime in, the long neck card gives you food before the feeding part of the turn. During the feeding part of the turn carnivores can only eat other species. So even the rules as written allow long necked carnivores.
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Read the rulebook, plan for all contingencies and… Read the rulebook again.
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A long-necked carnivore? What do you suppose Pleisiosaurs were???
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'Arctica' Gary
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Iirc the long neck card says t happens before you eat from the watering hole, not before you "eat" in general, so I still say the rules arent clear and could be cotentious in a tournament setting
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Bruce Voge III
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3wgames wrote:
Iirc the long neck card says t happens before you eat from the watering hole, not before you "eat" in general, so I still say the rules arent clear and could be cotentious in a tournament setting


The text from the long neck card is "Before feeding this species, it eats 3 food from the Excess Food pile."

Does not mention watering hole, just the word feeding, which is the "eat" part of the turn mentioned in part 3 of the turn overview.

This should clear it up and should prevent any issues should a tourney scene form.
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'Arctica' Gary
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Yea, in a legalese sense, if you equate the term 'feeding' to the "Eat" phase of the game in general, then I can see it making sense.


I guess the problem really is that since it only refers to 'feeding' and 'eat' which are generic terms we use every day as living creatures, its hard for the mind to separate the act of eating from the "Eat Phase" of the game which makes it more confusing than it would otherwise be if the Long Neck text was just noted as "Before Phase 3 begins, this species eats 3 food from the Excess Food pile" and the text for carnivore being "During Phase 3, the carnivore may only eat by attacking other species"
 
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Bruce Voge III
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I think the thought was using phrases on a card in this game like "Phase 3" might scare a new gamer, even if it might be clearer to rules lawyers.
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'Arctica' Gary
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Agreed on that point. The biggest confusing thing that i've found with new gamers is the idea of species & population - more specifically, I think they are looking for a picture of a different animal on each new species opposed to the card back with the same animal on all of them
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Elijah
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Long-necked carnivores are allowed at our table based on the rules as we interpreted them. Needless to say, they don't last long!
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