$20.00
$60.00
Recommend
3 
 Thumb up
 Hide
16 Posts

Scythe» Forums » General

Subject: Runaway Winner in 5-Player Games? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Mike Stevens
United States
Nebraska
flag msg tools
I protect the sheep in our society from the wolves.
mbmbmbmbmb
I don't own a copy of Scythe yet, but I am lucky enough to have a few friends that have the KS Collectors Edition and I have to say, it is an absolutely beautiful game. Thanks to my friends I have had a chance to play two 5-player games of Scythe with 2 different groups. In both games we had a runaway winner who won by close to 40 points over the 2nd place player. Has anyone else experienced this in 5-player games?

In the first game all 5 of us were playing Scythe for the first time. We had Bryce the owner of the game who played (Black), Warren (White), Me (Blue), Terri (Red), and Jeff (Yellow). We all started out by moving, expanding, and getting resources. Then we discovered that the Encounter cards had some pretty good benefits and started trying to snatch those up, especially Warren who had the ability to use up to 2 of the choices on the Encounter cards. Terri was the first to get her Leader to the Factory and snatched the first Factory card. Bryce seemed to stay in his own area early and build and stock pile resources. Jeff and Terri seemed to have a lot of Combat as did Warren and me. Bryce was smart enough to stay out of the fray until mid to late game. I got 5 stars out before anyone else, but because I had attacked a hex with 4 Villagers in it and 6 resources, my Popularity went down by 4 after wining that battle and I was never able to recover my Popularity and stayed in the lower third for the rest of the game. Warren got up to 18 Popularity and I thought for sure he would win as he also had 5 stars on the board. Before I knew what happened, Bryce placed his 6th Star ending the game and we calculated the final scoring. Bryce ended up with 95 points and an easy win as Jeff was a distant 2nd with 59, Terri was 3rd with 51, I had 43 and Warren (Mr. Popularity) was last with 39. I'm not quite sure what he did to score so many more points than the rest of us but Bryce is a very good gamer.

Last night, Joe brought his copy to our Game Night and we had another 5-player game. Terri and I had to teach the game as Joe had not played before, nor even open this beautiful box of Scythe. So we opened, punched, and set up the big map and all the beautiful components. Yes we did have to pull 2 tables together for all of this great gaming goodness that comes in KS Collectors box. Joe plays (Black), Jeremy (White), Me (Blue), Terri (Red), and Serge (Yellow). This game starts about the same as the first time we played with some players moving on their first turn and other players taking the first 2 resources. I get the first Encounter card and the first Factory card, and then have Combat as both Jeremy and Terri move toward the Factory. I win one Combat and lose the other so my Leader and Mech head back to their Home Base dejected. I was able to get up to 17 Popularity at one point in the game but Jeremy (White) got to the top of the Popularity track and placed his 6th Star ending the game. This game took about 2 1/2 hours which is roughly the same as our first play. Time for Final Scoring, Jeremy blows us out of the water as he ends up with 97 points for the win. I was in 2nd with only 45 points, Joe was 3rd with 41, and Terri was 4th with 39. Serge did not want to figure out his final points but was pretty low. I tried to pay closer attention to how Jeremy got all his points and of course he had the highest multiplier with 18 Popularity and 6 Stars. I think he had 8 Hexes and got several points from the random scoring card which was having your buildings adjacent to Encounter hexes. He had all 4 buildings out and they were all adjacent to at least one Encounter hex.

Do you guys think that these sets of scores are abnormal for a 5-player game or were Bryce and Jeremy just much more efficient at the game than the rest of us? All of us are fairly experienced gamers with Terri being the least experienced and she has been playing with our group for about a year. The odd thing is that while we were late into both games, I had no idea that Bryce and Jeremy would have such high scores. Maybe the rest of us just sucked at the gameshake

I certainly want to play Scythe again, maybe with less players and I encourage all of you to give it a shot.



1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Derr
United States
New Jersey
flag msg tools
Get off my Avatar NERD!
mbmbmbmbmb
I've played two 5 player games. Both games we're fairly close between first and second with a difference of less than 5 points. Third, Fourth, and Fifth we're perhaps 20 points back.

However, 97 points is an awesome score, I'd expect that a score that high would usually lead to a blow out. My winning scores are usually 75-85. I've rarely seen scores under 50 points. I've you're scoring less than 50 points, then you're probably going to be consistently blown out.

You're probably not playing as efficiently as you could be.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Klaus Kristiansen
Denmark
Kongens Lyngby
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I played my second game yesterday. For the other four, it was their first game. Red won with a little over a hundred points, second place had sixtysome, I was third with fifty.

When describing Scythe to them, before we decided what to play, I started by saying: "This is a game that Martin will love." Martin is great at resource managementy games, to the point that it would have been a major surprise to us all if he had not won. He ended with twelve territories, five stars, and a lot of cash. He would have got his sixth star by reaching 18 popularity had Saxony not grabbed a combat star to close the game. I, as blue, got five workers on the board as soon as posible, and then concentrated on upgrading until I could deploy for one metal. I got only one recruit, upgrade, and two stars, 16 power and the Hedge your bets objective. Had I got another turn, I would have had the four mechs star. I had three buildings on point giving hexes, tundra and farms. All others ignored the build bonus. Bjørn and Mox stood unmolested on the factory for the last half or more of the game, after Günter had aquired a factory card and walked away voluntarily.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt L.
United States
Seahurst
Washington
flag msg tools
I have text here
badge
So important!
mbmbmbmbmb
I wouldn't worry about the scores much until you settle into the effective strategies for the factions. I played Polania for the first time recently and just failed to take advantage of my faction abilities. I started out in an early leading position on the board but ended up with a miserable score.

Also, if you're worried about the balance in a 5 player game ensure that you're playing with 5 players who are of similar experience/mindset/strategy focus. A single player who is non-strategic or just wants to attack someone specific at the table without regard for the game can offset the balance and give an advantage to someone else.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Neilan Naicker
United States
Santa Monica
flag msg tools
mbmb
In my first game of Scythe, we were five players, and four of us had never played before (though I had familiarity with the rules) but the owner had.

Point spread at the top 3 was 1 point apart (55, 56, 57).

One anecdote only, sure, but I think yours might be an unfortunate edge case.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
A J
United States
Riverside
CA
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I think it takes a few games to understand the full scoring mechanisms. My first game I had 106, second place got like 80. I attribute this to my relative familiarity with the game over everyone else, having KS'd and researched it like crazy ahead of time. Everyone else caught up the following games as they got the hang of the game.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Greg
United States
Lowell
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I've only played one 5 player game and the scores were 61 (me) 60, 47, 32 and 17. I had only played 3 solo games prior, but was familiar with the rules. The 2nd and 3rd place finishers had each played twice before, while the other 2 players had never played.

I taught 3 new players in a 4 player game and the scores were 81 (me), 58, 48 and 39.

A bit of a big win there, but 1st time players don't often have the big picture of how scoring comes together, or that the game can end quicker than they expect.

The other 5 games I've played were 3 player and had various score differentials.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Stevens
United States
Nebraska
flag msg tools
I protect the sheep in our society from the wolves.
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm very glad to hear that other gamers are having much closer scores at the end of the game. I know a mistake that I made in both games I played was that I did not pay very close attention to what the other players were doing on their turns, instead trying to focus on what I would do on my next turn. You should certainly try to keep some attention on what your opponents are doing on their turns.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Watts
United States
Mount Juliet
Tennessee
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Omahavice wrote:
In both games we had a runaway winner who won by close to 40 points over the 2nd place player. Has anyone else experienced this in 5-player games?



Our games have all tended to large score gaps between 1st and everyone else. Usually 20 points between 1st and 2nd, whereas 2nd through 4th are often clumped within 10 points of each other. And there's often a laggard in 5th place.


However, it hasn't felt like a runaway game. Usually the disparities are caused by the cumulative effect of the lead player having the most points and then placing the 6 star. This is often on a turn where the winner places 2 stars jumping from 4 to 6 stars.

Assuming the winner is in the 3rd popularity tier and the rest of the pack has 4 stars, that's a 10 point bump for just the two stars.

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rodney Cockrell
United States
Corona
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I played a 5-player game last night. I won as Crimea with a score of 94. The next closest was in the 60's.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Ferguson
Australia
Brisbane
Queensland
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
It sounds like good strategy got them the big points not the player count. The several 5 player games I have played, the games have been close with only 5-10 points to the winner.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matthias Reitberger
Germany
Nürnberg
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I have played two 5 Player games.
In the first Nordic was clearly leading but then made a big mistake by leaving 6 food on a field with just one worker. I grabbed it and won the game by 5 points.
The second I won with 14 points difference although I was the only player being attacked and lost a lot of resources. I reacted by spreading out and won because of holding the most terrain with a decent popularity.
Both games are not that typical because the Nordic player in the first game will not make the same mistake again and probably would win clearly in a similar situation. But he is a very good player at strategy games anyway so that is nothing special.
In the second play there were 3 new players with only two that had already played. I often win in that group so it's not because of Scythe.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gutripper
Denmark
Copenhagen
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Our first 5 player game ended 58, 50, 48, 48, 46....

So from that experience it seemed very balanced between the players
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ian Liddle
United States
Sandpoint
Idaho
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Our games are usually pretty close, but the pace of the game is really hard to anticipate, especially for new players. It seems like it takes forever for the first star or two to hit the board, but those last 2-3 can happen in one action.

So I usually mention that it's a bit like Dominion, but more abrupt, in that there's a tipping point where you're really going to want to focus on raw points instead of stuff.

E.g., spreading out with 3 speedy mechs dribbling workers is a 6 territory swing (12-24 VP) with a single action, even if you aren't fighting anyone.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Benjamin
msg tools
Our two games ended with winner with 70 points, everyone else with 40 points.

Though we did have some very aggressive plays, especially the second game was mostly warmongering. I found out that if you are Polonia and Saxons really want to fuck you over, they can unless you are expertly prepared.

Especially annoying was our disregard for popularity, which made early aggression possible. Paying a bit of popularity in an event for a great start is worth it, which means you don't care about scaring workers until you focus on popularity later on.

In the end the game seems all about action efficiency. Get workers out (3) asap, plan workers and actions around your 6 stars and rush for it. Very unlikely that someone else will win if you get 6.

The person winning both game grasped the interaction between your player board top + bottom action and how to maximise VP immediately and called the game "fun, but not very complex or difficult" while others including me found it so complex to be almost paralysing.

Odd thing is, it's the kind of game in which I usually crush people, yet struggled not to be dead last.
There seems to be a specific way to understand the game which isn't in the rulebook in the missing strategy section or as a starting guide.
For example I approached it as engine building game and invest early action for later success such as first upgrading to reduce cost later -- complete failure. Workers plus straight objectives was twice as efficient. Still trying to wrap my head around it trying to get attempt 3 right.

Concerning other experiences in this thread - 90+ points seems odd. Sounds like people were trying to maximise points and not finish game and win.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matthias Reitberger
Germany
Nürnberg
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
razordaze wrote:
Our games are usually pretty close, but the pace of the game is really hard to anticipate, especially for new players. It seems like it takes forever for the first star or two to hit the board, but those last 2-3 can happen in one action.

So I usually mention that it's a bit like Dominion, but more abrupt, in that there's a tipping point where you're really going to want to focus on raw points instead of stuff.

E.g., spreading out with 3 speedy mechs dribbling workers is a 6 territory swing (12-24 VP) with a single action, even if you aren't fighting anyone.


The first star is often quite fast by producing all workers, some objectives can also be fulfilled quite early but then it stalls.
A 6 terretory swing shouldn't be achievable in a 5 player game, it shows poor tactics of your opponents.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.