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Alien vs Predator: The Hunt Begins» Forums » Rules

Subject: Version 2.0 rules changes and review rss

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Shirley T
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With the Ver2.0 rules release, I decided to revisit this game and explore what had been changed and if it made a significant difference to the problems in Ver1.1. My comment can be found in {brackets}.

General Changes:
Leadership statistic has been removed {not sure why}
Rooms are no longer Normal Tiles {nerf against Marines}
Occupation points are different for Rooms (now 12), and dead ends (now 4) {needed to deploy larger forces}
Token removal now occurs at the end of each turn {instead of randomly before models activate}
CC Weapons now modify a models strength (instead of having their own strength)
Force recommendations added for missions: 2 predators Vs 5 marines vs 13/14 aliens {I really like this change}
There is a new 4 level implementation of an experience system that uses generic perks {usually after 10 frags}
Build your own hero rules have been significantly simplified {with a note that they may return in the wargame rules }
The Good:
Section 1.3 “Miniature Definitions” added definitions for “Force”, “Faction”, and “Unit/Squad”
Section 2.2 “General Game Concepts” clarifies Activated vs Unactivated
Section 2.5 “Cards” adds Active and Conditional cards to clarify when and how strategy cards are used
Section 9.11 “Mission Special Rules” added to clarify mission objectives/rules
Section 10 “Advanced Game Rules” has been revamped to actually make sense
Section 10.2 “Custom Victory Conditions” has been clarified and actually works now
Section 4.2 “General Extended Actions” - Sentry is now officially an extended action {Finally!!}
The Bad:
Section 3.2 “Line Of Sight” - Team tactics is still the same poorly implemented ability
Section 6.1 “Armour” - Armor rules are still unchanged and awkward
Section 6.6 “Engaging By Displacing” is now a hot mess with inconsistent occupation points for royal guard and "teleporting" marines/hellhounds.
Section 8.3.1 “Predator Weapons” stat lines of weapons were not updated to reflect new stats
Section 9.12 "Experience Levels" is nothing fancy
Section 10.3.4 “Horde Instinct” is still the unchanged single player rules
And the Verdict:
I have been REALLY critical of these rules in the past because:
1. They are poorly worded and unclear
2. The writers made stupid decisions toward themed abilities and basic unit costs
3. This created an unbalanced mess of a game

With that said, 2.0 rules goes a long way in righting almost all of these problems without seeming to create more issues (besides screwing up section 6.6 a bit). I really do think the changes made turn this game from an unplayable mess, into a reasonably clever and balanced game. There are still issues (see the new Warzone release for more of what should have changed), but the game is now SOLID and can be played without house ruling everything or reading between the lines and reverse engineering what SHOULD have been written.

TLDR: Yeah, they did a good job {finally!}.

I will break down what was done per faction in subsequent posts

-S
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Shirley T
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MARINE FACTION
Overall, the marines only needed to have their base squad points increased to make sense, Shotgun tweaked to not be stupid against full rooms of enemies, and maybe nerf their CC bonus on normal tiles. As you can see, all of these issues were addressed AND they changed sentry guns to be literal sentry guns (cheap ones too!).

My only rule recommendation: For team tactics purposes, if a Ping! Token uses a unique ability, they must reveal themselves first {otherwise it’s too confusing and can be abused easily}.

Marine Changes:
Normal Corridors impart a -2 bonus on CC AND RS (instead of -4 for CC only)
Burning Inferno - rewritten for clarity
Gun emplacement rules clarification
Overcharged Stun Prod has been removed
Nerfs:
A Marine squad cost OVER TWICE AS MUCH as they used to {a badly needed change}
Sergeants a bit more expensive
Shotgun! is limited to 4 models per tile {another needed change}
Point Blank Shot and Shotgun cannot be used in the same turn
Sentry guns are 24 points cheaper, but…
Auto-Sentry now automatically get an activation token as well as sentry
Buffs:
Air vents can be targeted with Ping! ability when adjacent
WY Commandos and power loaders are a bit cheaper
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Shirley T
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PREDATOR FACTION
The Predator disc needed to be nerfed, hard! This was done in a fair way, and so was vocal mimicry.
Vocal mimicry now falls in line with the Marine’s Sentry gun as a cheap support addition {love it!}. Predators received a few themed surprises to their weapons {awesome new relic weapons and youngbloods}. Every predator was buffed, hounds were buffed to help with doors {sweet!}, and the self-destruct device is awesome! I think they did a great job with the predators

Predator Changes:
Air vents can be targeted with a Disc Throw under certain circumstances
Youngbloods: 2 types added, neither have a plasmacaster (wrist dart instead), weaker stats means weaker weapons CC as well {I like them!}
Gatling plasma caster changed to match its name: -4 to ST(10), +3 to ROA(6)
Relic Weapons and plasma cannon added!
Nerfs:
Smart-Disk Throw follows the same restrictions as other ranged weapons {no longer an auto-hit monstrosity}
Vocal Mimicry is now purchased
Buffs:
Elder Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats and Wounds!
Berserkers are almost 50 points cheaper now
Hounds are a lot cheaper now, can assist with force the doors open, and can disengage freely!
Self-Destruct Device activates on 1-5 (vice 1-3) PLUS adjacent tiles suffer St11 AVV3 autohit!

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Shirley T
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ALIEN FACTION
Wow. This faction is the reason I hated the old rules. The aliens didn’t feel right, they didn’t play right, and playing with them wasn’t fun (unless you had overpowered add-ons which balanced the pathetic starting forces). Aliens received a few nerfs {OP Warriors, and facehuggers}. But with that, literally every unit was made stronger, cheaper, and more lethal in CC. Paroxysm is a clever addition that tips the scales toward the aliens in an ambush {I can’t say enough about this new rule!}. Heavy hitters were made significantly cheaper {and now actually usable}, and the one “real” nerf to the warriors is not a big deal: They now come in two varieties, a weaker and cheaper variant {still cool}, or a near-to-the-original HQ variant that is 20 points more expensive {another great idea}. Also, acid blood is slightly more common and doesn’t affect aliens {because, logic}. Also notice that facehuggers are to aliens what Sentry guns and vocal mimicry are to their factions {well done }.

Aliens Changes:
Hidden aliens that are targeted for an attack should be revealed for the purposes of stats (but still retain hide).
Acid Spit is actually defined (St 12 AVV o)
Facehugger produced aliens have been extended to include warriors
Nerfs:
Predaliens produced by facehuggers have only 1 wound
Facehuggers are 1 point cheaper but cannot carry tokens or count for frags/objectives
Warriors: slightly more expensive and suffered a -1 to CC(16), W(1), Claw ROA (3), a -3 to claw ST(13), and lose impenetrable armor
Buffs:
Acid Damage now occurs on 1-6 and doesn't affect Aliens anymore! {was 1-5, and melted aliens because, supidity}
Paroxysm: Aliens have a special extended action that increases their lethality in CC considerably {Badly needed buff, clever addition}
Tail strike added to aliens (ST +1, ROA 1)
Stalkers are 6 points cheaper
Infant Warriors: are slightly cheaper and gain a +1 to ST(10), CON(10)
Evolved Warriors: gain a +1 to RS(11), St(14), CON(14), and losses -2 to impenetrable armor(10) {are what warriors used to be, but cost 20 more points to compensate}
Royal Guard: almost 50 point cheaper and gains a +2 to St(15), CON(15), with only a - 1 to its claw ST (15)
Crusher: Almost 90 points cheaper. Gains a +1 to CC(14), loses -4 to ST(16), CON(16)
Queen: Almost 180 points cheaper!!!!! loses -1 to CC(18), -3 t St(16), CON(16)
Predalien: over 100 points cheaper and only losses -2 to its claw ST(14)

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Frank Clark
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Stony Brook
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Thank you for this
 
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Christoffer Hansson
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Great read!
Now I need a FAQ or errata for the 2nd version so I know what to edit, like:
Quote:
Section 8.3.1 “Predator Weapons” stat lines of weapons were not updated to reflect new stats

...and cards ofc =)
 
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I just want to say how much I love this game. We changed the rules and use the Battle Systems SciFi set with the Avp boards. The battle systems set is built like a pyramid with a long corridor to the Avp base game board. We use a long air vent to connect the two too.
It seems that everyone has their own way of playing this game due to the badly worded and just plain bad rules.
So now everything seems better...
When will Prodos send me, for free because it was their mess, new stat cards for all my miniatures?? I can't be expected to remember them all!!!
I can't be the only one thinking this... Or will there be another expansion kit to purchase with NEW cards and 3D tokens etc.
This bugs me more than the aliens... Even if I do have a disc cutter at my disposal!!
 
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Shirley T
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DeanWarrington wrote:
When will Prodos send me, for free because it was their mess, new stat cards for all my miniatures?? I can't be expected to remember them all!!!

My understanding is they gave up on Warzone updates and just made card pdfs available:
http://warzone.prodosgames.com/downloads. I would expect the same for this game.
 
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Paco Pérez pozanco
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dougisitosan wrote:


Buffs:
Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats including Wounds!



Really? I dont see predators 4 wounds.
 
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Phillip Knapp
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Arkanish wrote:
dougisitosan wrote:


Buffs:
Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats including Wounds!



Really? I dont see predators 4 wounds.

I think he was referring to the elder Preds
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Paco Pérez pozanco
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What you think is the best combination of predators in the campaign? only 2 possible, and disc so nerf...
 
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Shirley T
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Topknot87 wrote:
Arkanish wrote:
dougisitosan wrote:


Buffs:
Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats including Wounds!



Really? I dont see predators 4 wounds.

I think he was referring to the elder Preds

Good catch, that is indeed what I meant, but I wasn't very clear. I updated the post for clarity, thanks guys!
 
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Shirley T
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Arkanish wrote:
What you think is the best combination of predators in the campaign? only 2 possible, and disc so nerf...

Disk is still an area effect weapon (like a flamethrower), that also has close combat potential. It seems you now have the choice of a close combat Pred (combi-stick), the ranged Pred (Plasmacaster), and a mid-ranged Pred (disk). So taking a Stick-Pred for Aliens and Caster-Pred for humans gives you a model against each faction (but poor flexibility). However, taking a Disk-Pred gives you flexibility in targeting and your second pred will be all about who you feel is the bigger threat: aliens (stick) or Marines (caster). Haven't played enough with the new rules to test this theory out though.
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Phillip Knapp
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dougisitosan wrote:
PREDATOR FACTION

Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats




I just played a game and Pred stats are exactly the same
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Shirley T
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Topknot87 wrote:
dougisitosan wrote:
PREDATOR FACTION

Predators have all gained a +1 to all base stats




I just played a game and Pred stats are exactly the same


As pointed out early... this was in regard to Elder Predators only, I was careless in my original update, thanks!
 
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Konstantinos Lekkas
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Thank you very much for your kind words!

It really means so much to us. We are all gamers and fans and backers This is really the biggest payment we expected to receive, and our biggest regret if the gamers said instead it was not good.

I am not very active at BGG, but if you need rules questions or clarifications you can always find me at avprules@prodosgames.com or at the official gaming facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/1027030660685651/


Please bare in mind that when Prodos did digitalization some errors occured, so some things were left out of the 2.0 book by mistake.
Prodos will give us two more documents:
1. A pdf "errata" document (a couple of pages) for the important things left out or not changed, for all the players who printed 2.0
2. A pdf 2.1 rulebook version, that will be the final version incorporating changes.

The cards will come soon for download as well!

Cheers,
K.
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Sky Edwards
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just wondering where I could find those updated cards. I have some interest from fellow gamers and am trying to plan games currently! OP Thanks so much for summarizing the changes!~
 
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Shirley T
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Relic669 wrote:
just wondering where I could find those updated cards. I have some interest from fellow gamers and am trying to plan games currently! OP Thanks so much for summarizing the changes!~
No problem. The cards should be posted here by Prodos if they ever decide to do their jobs and not get distracted by future projects:

http://avp.prodosgames.com/downloads

I wouldn't hold your breath for these: they said they'd be released soon (and that was in September). soblue
 
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