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Twilight Struggle» Forums » Strategy

Subject: US +2 : Does it change the standard USSR opening move? rss

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Jamie Pollock
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Just wondering how people view USSR opening moves when faced with Italy at 3 and Iran at 3?

If they have a suitable 4 Op, I imagine a first turn coup is still on the cards, if not, would 2 in Afghanistan be a likely opener?

I know a lot depends on cards blah de blah, but we all know if it's default rules or US +1, the opening coup is still the most likely USSR move (perhaps with the exception of certain scenarios which lead to first turn USSR realignments in Europe).
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Michael Valentine

Texas
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I generally prefer couping Italy to Iran. If I have a spare 4, then that's choice. If not, then a usuable 3 op. Then a 2 op, then a 1. If I'm couping Iran instead of Italy for some reason (perhaps Europe scoring played on the headline or I'm holding Mideast scoring), the choice of card to coup with varies with my hand, especially how strong it is. I'm couping on AR1, absent special circumstances.

If I'm US and USSR plays 2 to Afghanistan on AR1, then I'm usually controlling Pakistan. I think some players are too scared of an IPW that Soviets likely don't have, and if they do, then likely don't win.
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Dan Likos
United States
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MichaelVal wrote:
I generally prefer couping Italy to Iran. If I have a spare 4, then that's choice. If not, then a usuable 3 op. Then a 2 op, then a 1. If I'm couping Iran instead of Italy for some reason (perhaps Europe scoring played on the headline or I'm holding Mideast scoring), the choice of card to coup with varies with my hand, especially how strong it is. I'm couping on AR1, absent special circumstances.

If I'm US and USSR plays 2 to Afghanistan on AR1, then I'm usually controlling Pakistan. I think some players are too scared of an IPW that Soviets likely don't have, and if they do, then likely don't win.


Keep in mind that a US move into Pakistan in response to USSR AR1 into Afganistan is a potential target for a 5 OP coup with the China Card. If successful creates an easy realign out of Iran. So commit more than 3 influence to Pakistan... which makes the IPW a bit scarier as well.
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R Cook
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Yes it does. With only 1 influence in Iran, USSR is couping Iran on AR1 the majority of the time.

With 3 influence in Iran, all of a sudden couping Iran is far less attractive. Even with a 4 op card, you have a 1 in 3 chance of failing to remove USA from Iran.

A lot depends on cards in hand, USA set up and headlines but there are now a lot of options and couping Iran or Italy might not be best. A few of the more common ones I've seen:

Coup Iran
Coup Italy (especially after Socialist Gvts headline)
Influence to Iraq / S Arabia / Afghanistan
Nasser headline followed by influence to Libya and Afghanistan
Vietnam Revolts headline followed by influence to Laos and Thailand

If anything couping Italy is now more common than couping Iran on AR1 with US+2 set up.

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King in Green
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dlikos wrote:
MichaelVal wrote:
I generally prefer couping Italy to Iran. If I have a spare 4, then that's choice. If not, then a usuable 3 op. Then a 2 op, then a 1. If I'm couping Iran instead of Italy for some reason (perhaps Europe scoring played on the headline or I'm holding Mideast scoring), the choice of card to coup with varies with my hand, especially how strong it is. I'm couping on AR1, absent special circumstances.

If I'm US and USSR plays 2 to Afghanistan on AR1, then I'm usually controlling Pakistan. I think some players are too scared of an IPW that Soviets likely don't have, and if they do, then likely don't win.


Keep in mind that a US move into Pakistan in response to USSR AR1 into Afganistan is a potential target for a 5 OP coup with the China Card. If successful creates an easy realign out of Iran. So commit more than 3 influence to Pakistan... which makes the IPW a bit scarier as well.


At DEFCON 5 I am delighted by a coup of Pakistan with China. On average it will lose out to the recoup.

I have seen good USSR players coup Panama AR1 with a poor hand, if they wish to lower DEFCON, usually with a 1.
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Sputnik Ma
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433 opening makes Italy too vulnerable particularly when you do not hold SG in your hand.
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