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Cuba Libre» Forums » Rules

Subject: Turismo Confusion rss

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Scott D
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Virginia
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I am confused about the unshaded event on the "Turismo" card. It says "Support shifts one level toward neutral in each Casino space." I would interpret that as only Active Support and Passive Support spaces shifting. However, the tutorial in the Playbook suggests that the event hurts M26 as well, which I don't get. Does Active Opposition or Passive Opposition also shift here?
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Eddy del Rio
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San Antonio
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Scottland wrote:
I am confused about the unshaded event on the "Turismo" card. It says "Support shifts one level toward neutral in each Casino space." I would interpret that as only Active Support and Passive Support spaces shifting. However, the tutorial in the Playbook suggests that the event hurts M26 as well, which I don't get. Does Active Opposition or Passive Opposition also shift here?

Yes. After reading the card background in the rear of the Play Book, and the text in the Playbook pg 10, I am thoroughly confused, and will await further clarification.
 
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Yani
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Scottland wrote:
I am confused about the unshaded event on the "Turismo" card. It says "Support shifts one level toward neutral in each Casino space." I would interpret that as only Active Support and Passive Support spaces shifting. However, the tutorial in the Playbook suggests that the event hurts M26 as well, which I don't get. Does Active Opposition or Passive Opposition also shift here?


Yes. When in doubt interpret all instructions literally.
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Brian S.
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Minneapolis
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coralsaw wrote:
Scottland wrote:
I am confused about the unshaded event on the "Turismo" card. It says "Support shifts one level toward neutral in each Casino space." I would interpret that as only Active Support and Passive Support spaces shifting. However, the tutorial in the Playbook suggests that the event hurts M26 as well, which I don't get. Does Active Opposition or Passive Opposition also shift here?


Yes. When in doubt interpret all instructions literally.
The card specifically says "Support" with no mention of "Opposition". The literal interpretation is then, no, "Opposition" does *not* shift.
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Yani
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Vrooman wrote:
coralsaw wrote:
Scottland wrote:
I am confused about the unshaded event on the "Turismo" card. It says "Support shifts one level toward neutral in each Casino space." I would interpret that as only Active Support and Passive Support spaces shifting. However, the tutorial in the Playbook suggests that the event hurts M26 as well, which I don't get. Does Active Opposition or Passive Opposition also shift here?


Yes. When in doubt interpret all instructions literally.
The card specifically says "Support" with no mention of "Opposition". The literal interpretation is then, no, "Opposition" does *not* shift.


Then I would say you are right. I misread the question.
 
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Colin Taylor
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I know this doesn't give you a definitive yes/no answer, but IMO, the playbook statement must be incorrect. The card specifically mentions Support, and in the rulebook, Opposition is not a sub-state of Support, so I would say it only negatively affects the Govt.

Thanks,

Colin
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Scott D
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My issue is that thematically it makes no sense that the event would erode Opposition. If anything, disgust with "ugly Americans" would seem to increase Opposition (or, at the least, make the public forcefully "close" Casinos). Combined with a literal reading of the event text that only Support moves toward Neutral, I don't understand the Playbook tutorial handling of this card. It's like the event was that Support and Opposition eroded at the time of the tutorial's writing and the card change didn't make it into the tutorial itself.

Edit: Until I hear differently, I'm playing the card literally and only allowing it to affect Support, not Opposition.
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P. Fowler
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Indianapolis
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Like the others, I would play this as shifting Support only, since there is no mention of Opposition.
 
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Jonathan Squibb
United States
Camp Hill
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The Support-only interpretation makes more sense in both a literal reading of the card, and in historical context. But taking the playbook into account, I don't know what was intended, and I don't know how the card should be played.
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Mart van de Wege
Netherlands
Den Haag
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Scottland wrote:
My issue is that thematically it makes no sense that the event would erode Opposition. If anything, disgust with "ugly Americans" would seem to increase Opposition (or, at the least, make the public forcefully "close" Casinos).


I can see a thematically correct reading: the population is disgusted with the 'Ugly Americans', yes, but that alone is not enough to shift them to actively wanting the government gone. It merely reduces their support to apathy (of course, leaving a void for active revolutionaries, aka the other players, to exploit).
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Scott D
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My point is that there seems to be no thematic justification for the event reducing Opposition to Neutral, but that is what happens is implied in the Playbook tutorial. I simply meant that if the event were to affect Opposition at all it would make sense for it to increase Opposition. It also makes sense that the event only erodes Support but does not increase Opposition. However, I can't think of any reason why disgust with the "ugly Americans" who are visiting Cuba at the encouragement of the Governement would make the Cuban public oppose the Government less.

EDIT: Clarification that reduction of Opposition is implied versus actually happening.
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Mart van de Wege
Netherlands
Den Haag
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Ah right. Yes, that does seem weird.
 
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Eddy del Rio
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I don't understand why the Designer, Jeff Grossman, hasn't chimed in here?
 
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Volko Ruhnke
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Hi all, sorry for the delay.

Definitely play the card as written: unshaded "Turismo" affects Support only, not Opposition.

Colleen's comment in the tutorial may have been referring to Neutral spaces being a help to M26's competitor, the DR. I'm not sure. Regardless of the comment, play the card as written.

Best regards! Volko
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Volko Ruhnke
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Scottland wrote:
My point is that there seems to be no thematic justification for the event reducing Opposition to Neutral, but that is what happens in the Playbook tutorial. ...

fwiw, as I read the tutorial, nothing happens because of Turismo, because the players decline the Event. All we have is the comments from Colleen and Steve.
 
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Scott D
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You're right, Volko. Edited my comment accordingly.
 
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