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La Bataille de France, 1940» Forums » Rules

Subject: Crest Line and Blind Hex rss

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Lawrence Hung
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Wan Chai
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This still troubles me as the way the rules are written in a peculiar manner. 6.2.2 "Line of Sight Along Slope": Hill can also create blind hex, the hex behind the crest line, "unless the difference between the height of the two units is less than or equal to the distance between them."

Does the height refer to the level of the hill as each hill level adds one level to it? For example, the town of Guines on map A is centrally located among three large hills, which have level 2 hills and a small hill at hex A510.

Units located at the large hilltops (level 2 hill) always have a LOS to each other units at level one hill because the distance between them always exceeds two hexes.

By the same token, the shortest distance to the next hill level from the small hill at A510 is at least three hexes away and so that small hilltop can also be seen from any other hill hexes in this scenario.

I conducted a survey of the maps with regard to the LOS behind crest line. I find some hexes would be blind hexes but I am not sure. A403 would be a blind hex to A406, B1003 to B605, C1116 to C113, D704 to 602. Please confirm my understanding. I do think some examples in the next version of the rulebook still help.
 
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Juan Carlos Cebrián
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Hi Lawrence
In all the examples you write there are not LOS
For example if you have a unit in A1114 you have LOS A914, A514, A414, A312 but no to A314, A1110 or A1314

regards

JCC
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Charles CORDIER
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As far as I understand the V1 rule, those blocked lines instance are not related to the OP's troublesome rule:

- A314 and A1110 are blocked because crossing hill hex at equal elevation (second bullet at the end of 6.2.2)

- A1314 is blocked because unit is not in a crest hex.

Like the OP, I do not understand the restriction on crossed crest line blocking LOS. For the difference in elevation to be greater than the distance, you would need two crest lines in the same hex. So on actual maps, intervening crest lines do not matter for LOS purpose. This sounds awkward.

Practical work now: is there a LOS between 1114 and 910 (assuming LOS does not cross the crest line in 1113)?


I would like to check the first bullet by the way: crest line+blind hex terrain=no LOS

EG there is no LOS from 1111 to 1109, 1108, 1107 ... due to trees in 1110, right?

Thanks!
 
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Juan Carlos Cebrián
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Hi Charles

Practical work now: is there a LOS between 1114 and 910 (assuming LOS does not cross the crest line in 1113)?


Not because in the hexagons 1013 and 1112 are trees that make the same level as the hex 1114.And if there were no trees either because it would be the blind hex of the hill
You have LOS from 1111 to 910


EG there is no LOS from 1111 to 1109, 1108, 1107 ... due to trees in 1110, right?

correct


regards

JCC
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Charles CORDIER
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Thanks for the fast answer! Anyhow it seems I need to read the rule again. Let's see:


Quote:
6.2.2.Line of Sight along slopes applies when the two hexes are at different heights. LOS may only be traced along slopes if the higher of the two units is in a crest hex. If the higher unit does not occupy a crest there is no LOS. For a unit to be considered in “crest” status, the LOS in question must cross the crest in the unit’s own hex.

This is quite clear for me: LOS for A908-A906; no LOS for A909-A906


Quote:
Blind hexes and slope LOS: Certain types of terrain block LOS downslope only in the hex directly behind them (tracing from the spotting hex). Such hexes are woods, light woods, dispersed buildings and built-up area hexes

I read the hex as singular, so my understanding is no LOS for A1114-A912; but LOS for A1114-A911. Right?


Quote:
(although these may not block slope LOS under conditions described below).

I do not understand what below points to nor if those means BUA or all four hex types.


Quote:
Any hex containing a crest line that is crossed by the LOS (other than a crest line in the hex occupied by the higher unit) also creates a blind hex in the adjacent hex behind it,

This would explain the blind hex of the hill part of your answer.


Quote:
unless the difference between the height of the two units is less than or equal to the distance between them.

This is the true problem for me. I agree that there is LOS for A1111-A910 under this condition, but I would also allow one for A1114-A910, which seems wrong from your answer. Is there a typo in the quoted rule?


Quote:
Blocking hexes and slope LOS: The following hexes block all slope LOS:
- A hex with a crest line that would create a blind hex that also contains other terrain that would create a blind hex (e.g., a hill hex with woods).

This I seem to understand as you agree with my example: no LOS for A1111-A110*


Quote:
- Hill hexes at an equal or higher elevation than the higher unit.

This seems quite plain: no LOS for A303-A504 or A406-A408


And last:
Quote:
6.2.1.Line of sight along flat ground.

Does A510-A507 falls in this case? Or does along means all hexes are at the same elevation?


Sorry for all those questions. I really try to figure why some LOS are valid and some not.

Thanks for your patience!
 
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Juan Carlos Cebrián
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noelberrier wrote:
Thanks for the fast answer! Anyhow it seems I need to read the rule again. Let's see:


Quote:
6.2.2.Line of Sight along slopes applies when the two hexes are at different heights. LOS may only be traced along slopes if the higher of the two units is in a crest hex. If the higher unit does not occupy a crest there is no LOS. For a unit to be considered in “crest” status, the LOS in question must cross the crest in the unit’s own hex.

This is quite clear for me: LOS for A908-A906; no LOS for A909-A906

CORRECT

Quote:
Blind hexes and slope LOS: Certain types of terrain block LOS downslope only in the hex directly behind them (tracing from the spotting hex). Such hexes are woods, light woods, dispersed buildings and built-up area hexes

I read the hex as singular, so my understanding is no LOS for A1114-A912; but LOS for A1114-A911. Right?

NO YOU DONT HAVE LOS TO NONE OF THE 2 HEXES BECOUSE YOU ARE A LEVEL 2 HILL AND THE WOODS AT A1113 LEVEL 1 HILL TURN THE HEXAGON ON A LEVEL 2


Quote:
(although these may not block slope LOS under conditions described below).

I do not understand what below points to nor if those means BUA or all four hex types.

FOR EXAMPLE IN ONE OF THE FOUR TYPE HEXES ARE AT A812 AND YOU ARE AT A 1111 THE HEX A712 IS A BLIND HEX



Quote:
Any hex containing a crest line that is crossed by the LOS (other than a crest line in the hex occupied by the higher unit) also creates a blind hex in the adjacent hex behind it,

This would explain the blind hex of the hill part of your answer.

YOU ARE AT A1111 THE HEXES AT A808-A809-A907-A1008 ARE BLIND HEXES FROM CREST LINE 1 LEVEL HILL

Quote:
unless the difference between the height of the two units is less than or equal to the distance between them.

This is the true problem for me. I agree that there is LOS for A1111-A910 under this condition, but I would also allow one for A1114-A910, which seems wrong from your answer. Is there a typo in the quoted rule?

FIRST THE WOODS AT A1013 THAT MAKE THE HEX LEVEL 2 LIKE THE HILL YOU ARE AND IF THE WOOD DONT EXIST THE HEX WILL BE THE BLIND HEX FROM LEVEL 1 HILL


Quote:
Blocking hexes and slope LOS: The following hexes block all slope LOS:
- A hex with a crest line that would create a blind hex that also contains other terrain that would create a blind hex (e.g., a hill hex with woods).

This I seem to understand as you agree with my example: no LOS for A1111-A110*

YES BECOUSE A1110 BLOCK YOUR LOS

Quote:
- Hill hexes at an equal or higher elevation than the higher unit.

This seems quite plain: no LOS for A303-A504 or A406-A408

CORRECT

And last:
Quote:
6.2.1.Line of sight along flat ground.

Does A510-A507 falls in this case? Or does along means all hexes are at the same elevation?

YOU HAVE LOS BECOUSE ALL LEVELS HAVE THE SAME ELEVATION

Sorry for all those questions. I really try to figure why some LOS are valid and some not.

Thanks for your patience!


Sorry for caps is only to diferentiate well the answering
Regards

JCC
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Charles CORDIER
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Thanks for your answers. I'll tinker with those in front on a map ASAP. I'm getting a clearer picture now. Thank you!
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Juan Carlos Cebrián
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Hi Charles

Without problem, and ask all the questions you need

regards

JCC
 
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