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Nicole M
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considering adding Agricola to my collection - which version should i buy?
this one or the older one?
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Mister P
Australia
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The older one comes with pieces for 5 players while the new one comes with pieces for 4 players.

The new version may cost less, comes with revised and refined card decks, better wooden resource tokens, and components that will make it easier to set-up. There will be expansions to get it up to 6 players I believe but if you can't see yourself playing with more than 4 for now, I would get the newer edition.

Uwe Rosenberg's goal was to change the cards, to eliminate less useful cards so ideally, players will get more balanced hands of cards at the start of the game. Mulligan rules were included as an option but hopefully you won't need them with the revised version.
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Adam Webb
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BahdMufu wrote:
The older one comes with pieces for 5 players while the new one comes with pieces for 4 players.

The new version may cost less, comes with revised and refined card decks, better wooden resource tokens, and components that will make it easier to set-up. There will be expansions to get it up to 6 players I believe but if you can't see yourself playing with more than 4 for now, I would get the newer edition.

Uwe Rosenberg's goal was to change the cards, to eliminate less useful cards so ideally, players will get more balanced hands of cards at the start of the game. Mulligan rules were included as an option but hopefully you won't need them with the revised version.


Excellent rundown!

I'd snag the new version if you plan on getting more content for it later on. All of the expansions, etc. from here on out will be configured with the new version in mind.
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Jack Paris

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I just introduced the game to a lovely young couple that promptly decided to buy it and I urged them to buy the original. The original version comes with a whole heap of cards and the new one has a much much lower card count with the idea to sell regular expansions. If you prefer to just buy a good complete game in a box rather than buy into a system then I'd go with the original.
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Nicole M
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i understood there was frustration regarding the cards in the original, that some of them are too powerful then the others, and that the revised version balanced this issue.
I'll be happy if you may respond to that (:
thanks!
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Hanno Girke
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The new version comes with an overhauled rulebook - while the old one was hard work to digest, the new rulebook (though the rules didn't change much) makes it easier to get into the game.
Plus, all the nice meeples. Plus, lower price.
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Geoff Burkman
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Squishi wrote:
i understood there was frustration regarding the cards in the original, that some of them are too powerful then the others, and that the revised version balanced this issue.
I'll be happy if you may respond to that (:
thanks!


In general, the card mix in the new edition is better balanced, although quite naturally some cards are still stronger than others. Main point: you are much more likely to get relatively equal hands without having to resort to a draft than with the original. Plus, as a rule, the Minors in the new edition are a bit easier to get into play and to actually put to use.

As Hanno mentions, the rules are much more presentable in the new edition.
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Grant
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patrocles wrote:
...buy a good complete game in a box rather than buy into a system...

That's quite a stretch, there. The original version has expansion decks and the new version will have expansion decks. The new version has fewer cards, but they're supposed to be a better mix and more balanced.

Anyone can decide for themselves if they prefer more unbalanced cards or fewer, better balanced cards.

But to characterize one as a "complete game" and the other as a "game system" is completely disingenuous.
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Jack Paris

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Not at all disingenuous. The new version comes with a minimal card set as in, if you play a reasonable amount you're gonnna want more cards where as the original always had enough cards so that almost everyone never felt the NEED to have more cards. The fact that more cards came out and and super fans would want to try them all out is beside the point. The difference is substantive.

I think the way this new one was described was as good for people that will want to play it three or four times a year. If you want to get some good regular use out of it you're gonna feel the lack of cards. Something that never happened with the original.

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Grant
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patrocles wrote:
Not at all disingenuous. The new version comes with a minimal card set as in, if you play a reasonable amount you're gonnna want more cards where as the original always had enough cards so that almost everyone never felt the NEED to have more cards.

You're talking about your opinions as if they were facts. The exact opposite of what you said could be argued equally well:

If you rarely play, you won't know enough to be greatly impacted by imbalanced and over/under-powered cards, so the original game is fine.

If you play a lot, then with the old version the imbalance starts to become a problem, so a smaller, well balanced set of cards is much better.
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Jack Paris

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It seems that most groups that play Agricola very quickly cut a few cards out that they feel don't work for them as a group. With what remains I've never heard serious concerns about balance raised in all the time I've ever played Agricola with different people.

Drafts were never a question of balance for me; they are fun in their own right and help you to build a strategy right from the start; it's a very enjoyable part of the game and I understand that in the new rules even more variants are listed for drafting which implicitly recognises that it's not so much about fixing balance, drafting is fun!

As far as I'm concerned, a bit of rebalancing in the cards is interesting, sure, but I see no reason they couldn't have released a similar size card set as in the original edition. As it is, if you play it more than the selling point of three or four times a year then you're very quickly going to feel the need for more cards and, as they're not included already in the game box, you're going to have to reach for your wallet.

For that reason I suggested that this young couple I introduced Agricola to this last week buy the original Z-Man edition. You don't need to buy expansions to have a nice good full card set and you don't need to buy an expansion to be able to play with five.

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Grant
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patrocles wrote:
It seems that most groups that play Agricola very quickly cut a few cards out that they feel don't work for them as a group. With what remains I've never heard serious concerns about balance raised in all the time I've ever played Agricola with different people.

Drafts were never a question of balance for me; they are fun in their own right and help you to build a strategy right from the start; it's a very enjoyable part of the game and I understand that in the new rules even more variants are listed for drafting which implicitly recognises that it's not so much about fixing balance, drafting is fun!

As far as I'm concerned, a bit of rebalancing in the cards is interesting, sure, but I see no reason they couldn't have released a similar size card set as in the original edition. As it is, if you play it more than the selling point of three or four times a year then you're very quickly going to feel the need for more cards and, as they're not included already in the game box, you're going to have to reach for your wallet.

For that reason I suggested that this young couple I introduced Agricola to this last week buy the original Z-Man edition. You don't need to buy expansions to have a nice good full card set and you don't need to buy an expansion to be able to play with five.


I don't disagree with most of what you wrote here. What I disagree with is describing the new version as some kind of "game system" like an LCG where you'll need to keep buying new sets of cards to keep it interesting and relevant.
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Jack Paris

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No, you're quite right. It's not like a living card game or collectible card game, not as bad as that. I called it a system because I think the base game that you buy will be somewhat incomplete. IF you want to play it more than three or four times a year you will want to buy more cards. If you want to play it with more than four players you will have to buy an add-on for that too.

I don't like games that are designed to sell expansions with. Race for the Galaxy, for example, was designed with elements that couldn't be used until you bought a future expansion and it goes against the principles that I personally respect in micro-industry made up of passionate designers and passionate customers. So far Uwe Rosenberg's games have been wonderful in this regards. I have no problem with expansions coming out afterwards if a game is very popular and the designer and the gamers want it but it's another thing to design incompleteness and to plan expansions in from the get go, perhaps reducing the offering in the original game box to accompany that plan. It saddens me quite a lot that this has happened to a Uwe Rosenberg game.

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