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Subject: How to handle revealed Escort Card after combat? rss

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Barry Miller
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OK, you're at the point in the game where your active sub has finished its attack and has moved off the Tactical Display, perhaps after sinking a few enemy merchants. There's at least one revealed escort still on the display when you go into the Action Decision of the Post-Combat Resolution Phase. At this point, the rules instruct us to remove the counters from the display. But what are you all doing with the Escort Cards (that you drew to represent revealed escorts)?

Are you discarding them? Shuffling them back into the Escort deck? Putting them on the bottom? I can make a reasonable case for each option.

This is so far, the only hole I've found in the rulebook. But I'm also only in the middle of my first game. Still, even now, I can tell this rulebok is much improved over previous DVG rulebooks.

Thx!

EDIT: After another read-thru of the rules, I found the rule on page 9 about shuffling the discards to form a new deck. One could infer from this that all drawn cards are to be discarded after play. So until I hear differently, that's what I'll do.

Still, I think this is one point of housekeeping that could've been better expanded on. Regardless, my comment above wrt the improvements in this rulebook stand.
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Dan Beckler
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I've been discarding all drawn Merchants / Escorts / Naval cards into a separate pile, with the intent to reshuffle a particular deck once each is exhausted - hasn't happened yet in my game.

Follow-up question... do folks intend to shuffle back in "sunk" ships? I haven't found anything in the book one way or the other.
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Paul Dodds
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wedgeantilles1971 wrote:
Follow-up question... do folks intend to shuffle back in "sunk" ships? I haven't found anything in the book one way or the other.


I've been shuffling sunk ships back in. While the rules don't say anything I'm working on the assumption that if they were permanently removed from a campaign it would say something.
 
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Barry Miller
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Kyuss wrote:
wedgeantilles1971 wrote:
Follow-up question... do folks intend to shuffle back in "sunk" ships? I haven't found anything in the book one way or the other.

I've been shuffling sunk ships back in.

Hmmm... I've been taking exactly the opposite approach when it comes to sunk ships. Whereas my OP question deals with escorts that are still in service at the end of combat, I would've thunk that how to manage sunk ships is obvious. I mean, they're sunk, right? (Not trying to be snarky... I have a way of coming across that way although I don't intend to).

To my way of thinking, thematically, a sunk ship is never coming back into service, so why would I return the ship (counter and card) back into play stock? When I sink a ship, I put the card aside into my own little "victory pile".

Now, I'm still in the middle of my first game and I'm keeping it short. So I haven't taken the time to consider that there may be a possibility of running out of Merchant Cards if both the campaign is long enough and your good/lucky enough to run out of ships.

If that were ever to be the case (running out of Merchant Ship cards), I'd guess I'd declare victory and call it a day. But of course that's not the way the game is supposed to end, so in that case I probably would shuffle to sunk cards (which would be the entire Merchant Deck, in this situation) to form a fresh Merchant Deck.


Kyuss wrote:
While the rules don't say anything I'm working on the assumption that if they were permanently removed from a campaign it would say something.

Lol! I haven't looked at your collection, but is this your first DVG game? (OK, so now I am trying to be snarky !)
Seriously, DVG's rulebooks are widely known for their gaps and missing rules. This is why I made such a case in my OP that I think the Gato Leader rulebook is such an improvement over the other four DVG rulebooks I have. Comparatively speaking, it's leaps and bounds ahead of the others in the way that the rules for GL seem more complete, better organized, and flow better.

But still, compared to other rulebooks out there, there are still gaps and missing rules. Since I posted my OP, I've jotted down a few more questions I've discovered after playing the game more. So the rulebook isn't quite there yet, but as DVG rulebooks go I'm really impressed with how far its come. I'm traveling now... when I return from my trip, I'll post the other questions.




 
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Paul Dodds
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I've run out of Merchant cards a couple of times. Although the ships have names I don't think of them as specific ships but representative of a type of ship. Playing a long patrol or campaign without reshuffling would be impossible.

I've got a stack of DVG games, and you're absolutely right that the Gato Leader rule book is an improvement over many. Field Commander Napoleon still ranks as one of the best in my book. Having said that, while they do often contain gaps, in all the DVG games I own I've yet to come across the rules missing a game changing rule. (Tiger Leader was a mess because of balancing issues and not because of the rules). Removing sunk ships from play would be a game changer. So I remain comfortable with my assumption that it would have been mentioned if it was the case.
 
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Barry Miller
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Kyuss wrote:
I've run out of Merchant cards a couple of times. Although the ships have names I don't think of them as specific ships but representative of a type of ship. Playing a long patrol or campaign without reshuffling would be impossible.

OK, great point! As I hopefully made clear in my reply above, I caveated that I'm still in the middle of my first game, so haven't come across that situation. At the time I wrote my reply, I was having trouble imagining it as a possibility, but now I get it. (Especially after playing more).

So yeah, of course I'd agree that the Merchant Ships get shuffled beck into a deck, but I'd wait till the Merchant Ship deck is dry before doing that. It'd be nice to see an expansion with more ship cards, so that when a ship is sunk, it's sunk!

 
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Paul Dodds
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bgm1961 wrote:
It'd be nice to see an expansion with more ship cards, so that when a ship is sunk, it's sunk!


I do have a few minor issues with the game but I'm having enough fun with it that I think I'd happily purchase such an expansion.
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