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The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game» Forums » General

Subject: speculation finale rss

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juan b
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i heard that fantasyflightgames is going to do a new lcg (no Arkham Horror)maybe to replace the lord of the ring how many more expansion you thing is going to be , maybe The Sands of Harad ,the end of the saga and 1 more for a big finale or you thing the expansion are going to continue for more and more year ?
 
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Casey Lent
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This game isn't going anywhere for a long time.
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Chris Gordy
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The fact that they are building the ARkham Horror LCG does not directly impact the LotR LCG. There is no9 reason FFG can not have two LCG's going at one time (heck, they have at least 5 going at any one time now). Personally I would say the Arkham Horror LCG is helping to fill the void of the end of the Call of Cthulhu Card LCG in the last.

 
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Hedyn Brand
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I think they said they were "at capacity" when they had six current LCGs, so it's looking like something else will be pushed out when L5R arrives. It's looking a lot like Conquest at this point. AHLCG isn't replacing anything, just adding another co-op game to the universe
 
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Nigel McNaughton
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I think we know exactly how long it's going to last, exactly as long as sales support it. So go out and buy!

This thread feels particularly silly after we just got our newest cycle confirmed.
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Hedyn Brand
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Yep, they've confirmed LotR is one of their bestsellers.
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Jim Hansen
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We all know there is nowhere to go but down after getting Mumaks as mounts (if Caleb's tease holds true). Therefore, the end is nigh!
 
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Casey Lent
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gnurf wrote:
I think they said they were "at capacity" when they had six current LCGs, so it's looking like something else will be pushed out when L5R arrives. It's looking a lot like Conquest at this point. AHLCG isn't replacing anything, just adding another co-op game to the universe


Why would it be Conquest? I can see it from the perspective of being a small and somewhat redundant license, but how does the Conquest scene compare to Star Wars? I could see something like, SW LCG retired, non-randomized decks in a tightened up series of boxes. Especially with Destiny on the way.
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Hedyn Brand
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There's a general feeling that ALL the games they licensed IP from GW for are about to disappear :/

Star Wars seems safe, as they have 14 games now.
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Nigel McNaughton
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mistertrench wrote:
gnurf wrote:
I think they said they were "at capacity" when they had six current LCGs, so it's looking like something else will be pushed out when L5R arrives. It's looking a lot like Conquest at this point. AHLCG isn't replacing anything, just adding another co-op game to the universe :)


Why would it be Conquest? I can see it from the perspective of being a small and somewhat redundant license, but how does the Conquest scene compare to Star Wars? I could see something like, SW LCG retired, non-randomized decks in a tightened up series of boxes. Especially with Destiny on the way.


The scuttlebutt is that Games Workshop has broken up with FFG with all the GW licensed titles drying up. No proper Warhammer Quest expansions, no Forbidden Stars expansions, no Warhammer Conquest Playtesting.
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Brent Brown
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Remember last year when Warhammer Quest was going to replace the Lord of the Rings LCG?

Seems that we'll have to go through this every time FFG announces a new co-op card game...
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Casey Lent
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BathTubNZ wrote:
mistertrench wrote:
gnurf wrote:
I think they said they were "at capacity" when they had six current LCGs, so it's looking like something else will be pushed out when L5R arrives. It's looking a lot like Conquest at this point. AHLCG isn't replacing anything, just adding another co-op game to the universe


Why would it be Conquest? I can see it from the perspective of being a small and somewhat redundant license, but how does the Conquest scene compare to Star Wars? I could see something like, SW LCG retired, non-randomized decks in a tightened up series of boxes. Especially with Destiny on the way.


The scuttlebutt is that Games Workshop has broken up with FFG with all the GW licensed titles drying up. No proper Warhammer Quest expansions, no Forbidden Stars expansions, no Warhammer Conquest Playtesting.


Are not all relationships with GW salty ones? I don't think I've ever read or heard a single positive thing about working with them.

As a counterpoint, I would lobby Relic as being at least moderately successful, with a good run of expansions to date. Plus we just got a big Talisman box. The latter was thematically climactic, but I still see room for continued development.
 
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Patrick
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They're designing two years out for the game currently (per interview with Matt and Caleb on CotR episode 100), so there is at least that much. Also it's a pet project of Christian Petersen (the CEO) so I'm REALLY not worried about it.

Plus there is really no reason they can't have more than 6 LCG's (Anton Torres said in an FFG GenCon 2016 retrospective that LCG products sell great, so there's that, too).
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Jan Probst
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Lotr LCG is dying (again) and it is Cthulhu's fault. goo
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Casey Lent
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gnurf wrote:
There's a general feeling that ALL the games they licensed IP from GW for are about to disappear :/

Star Wars seems safe, as they have 14 games now.


Not to be that guy, but "a general feeling" is not exactly scientific. Also I feel there was a similar sentiment back when Invasion was shuttered. Although I can't remember if Conquest was leaked at that point. (People eventually figured out Conquest from the cover mural being an original composition)
 
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Hedyn Brand
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I know, but there have been a lot of little things from FFG pointing to Conquest and other GW-licensed games going away (rushed releases, no announcements, tiny expansion packs which look like parts of a larger one, lack of expansions).

Hopefully it's just them being too busy with the new products to release any new information, or they're going to announce things much closer to release hereafter.
 
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Rob Rob
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gnurf wrote:
I know, but there have been a lot of little things from FFG pointing to Conquest and other GW-licensed games going away (rushed releases, no announcements, tiny expansion packs which look like parts of a larger one, lack of expansions).

Hopefully it's just them being too busy with the new products to release any new information, or they're going to announce things much closer to release hereafter.

I'd have to agree, the way they've been soft peddling Warhammer Quest it seems (to me) they don't want to invest design time into a soon to be gone license.
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Greg
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Even the wise cannot see all ends.
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Robin Munn

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mistertrench wrote:

Are not all relationships with GW salty ones? I don't think I've ever read or heard a single positive thing about working with them.


This is a bit off-topic for the LOTR LCG boards, so I'll try to keep my comments on this subject brief.

Try a Google search for "Games Workshop business practices" (without the quotation marks), and see what comes up. The most positive article I found in the first page was this one, from a guy who wants to believe that GW is going to be successful because he's a shareholder in the company -- and his article is lukewarm at best, and GW is excoriated in the comments:

http://www.iii.co.uk/news-opinion/richard-beddard/games-work...

The most telling quote in the article: "In conversation [with GW managers after the shareholders' meeting], I’m told that the word “Game” in Games Workshop encourages the misconception that games are its business, but that only about 20% of Games Workshop’s customers are gamers."

Then there's the following quote from GW's 2014 annual report (emphasis mine):

"Our market is a niche market made up of people who want to collect our miniatures. They tend to be male, middle-class, discerning teenagers and adults. We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants. These things are otiose in a niche."

I wouldn't believe that quote either if I were in your shoes, so here's the source so you can look at it yourself and see that I'm not making it up: http://investor.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/0...

In 2030, business schools all over the UK will use Games Workshop's decline and eventual bankruptcy as a classic "How to Ruin a Formerly-Profitable Company" example in their management classes.

Oh, and one other thing: there was once a computer game company that had an agreement with GW to make a video game based on their Warhammer Fantasy Battles series, and another related video game based on their 40K universe. Both games was quite successful, had several sequels, and the fantasy wargame was eventually turned into the most-played MMORPG of all time: World of Warhammer.

Except that's not what happened: talks between Blizzard and GW broke down, and Blizzard had to hastily rewrite the backstory of Warcraft and Starcraft. And that's why GW's revenue is around $120 million, while Blizzard's revenue is around $4.5 billion.

Yep, GW sure knows how to maintain good relationships with their business partners that will profit them long-term. [/sarc]
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Casey Lent
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I always thought the GW - Blizzard deal was apocryphal, but the more you know right? Thanks for the links.
 
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Kostas K.
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rmunn wrote:
Except that's not what happened: talks between Blizzard and GW broke down, and Blizzard had to hastily rewrite the backstory of Warcraft and Starcraft. And that's why GW's revenue is around $120 million, while Blizzard's revenue is around $4.5 billion.


What now? I get the hate for GW, but claiming that the decision to not hand over their IP to Blizzard for Warcraft and Starcraft makes the difference between $120M and $4.5B is ridiculous. Sure they have made a lot of bad decisions over the years, but the main difference is that you are comparing a miniatures/boardgame company to a huge videogame company, tied to a colossal publisher (Activision). Why don't you compare the revenue of GW to the revenue of other boardgame companies, let's say FFG? And keep in mind that, for what it's worth, GW hasn't outsourced all its manufacturing jobs to China yet.

Also, if any statement is more stale than "Lord of the Rings LCG is dying", it's "Games Workshop is dying".
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Jim . K
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Meanwhile, back on thread.. ;-)

.. Do you think the latest cycle for LoTR actually has quite a bit of mileage to extend beyond the one deluxe set and accompanying AP's?? It's a really interesting part of Tolkien lore that itself could be a whole 'game within a game'.. I wonder if this won't be the last deluxe set.. (I know we also still have to complete the trilogy expansion too obviously).
 
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Lee Broderick
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JimBGG wrote:
Do you think the latest cycle for LoTR actually has quite a bit of mileage to extend beyond the one deluxe set and accompanying AP's??.. I wonder if this won't be the last deluxe set.


Took me a while to parse that sentence, which is grammatically correct but used contrary to popular current usage.

I agree, this will not be the last deluxe set.
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Robin Munn

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mistertrench wrote:
I always thought the GW - Blizzard deal was apocryphal, but the more you know right? Thanks for the links.


I don't have any proof of the GW-Blizzard deal for Warcraft, just someone else saying so on the Internet. So don't take my saying so as any kind of confirmation.

OTOH it's completely obvious that Starcraft was originally intended to be set in the 40K universe. The humans are the Imperium (don't know if they'd be Space Marines or Imperial Guard, but I lean towards Imperial Guard), the Protoss are the Eldar (complete with prophesies that make no sense except in retrospect, and with a habit of never explaining their plans to the humans who could have helped if they'd just explained), and the Zerg are so obviously Tyrannids that you can practically see the GW serial numbers not-quite-filed-off-enough on the bottom of a Zerg spawning pool.

Zerg spawning pool: http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/starcraft/images/c/ce/Sp...
Tyrannid spawning pool: http://s47.photobucket.com/user/fredmans/media/tyranidsmars1...

And Warcraft also makes perfect sense if it came from the Fantasy Battles universe: Skaven turned into goblins, and the rest of the races (orcs, elves, etc) aren't copyrightable so there was no need to change the race name. Just invent new heroes and appropriate backstories for them, and there you go.

But as I said, I have no proof, just suspicions -- mostly based on Starcraft's races.
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Robin Munn

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kostool13 wrote:
What now? I get the hate for GW, but claiming that the decision to not hand over their IP to Blizzard for Warcraft and Starcraft makes the difference between $120M and $4.5B is ridiculous.


I'm not saying that GW would have had $4.5 billion in revenue; perhaps I should have been a bit more clear, but I was trying to keep it brief. GW would have been in for some percentage of that revenue stream as part of the licensing deal, though, and I'm sure it would have been in the tens of millions of dollars, probably in the hundreds of millions. Though Blizzard has a pretty diverse IP portfolio, so GW wouldn't have been getting a percentage of the whole $4.5 billion.

kostool13 wrote:
Also, if any statement is more stale than "Lord of the Rings LCG is dying", it's "Games Workshop is dying".


Yeah, everyone has been saying it for a while now, so there's not that much point in repeating it one more time. Their slow-motion death is going to drag on for several more years, because there are still a LOT of 40K fans who love the universe despite GW's best attempts to flush their fans' goodwill down the toilet. So I should quit talking about them and get back to talking about a game whose creators actually like their customers. As proved by the fact that we're going to be getting Oliphaunt mounts!

Wait, that didn't come out "shouty" enough. Let me try again.

Oliphaunt mounts!

Okay, THAT was about the proper font size for that news. :-)
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