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Subject: Ranking the Outlaws rss

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mike D
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We have played this game quite a few times. The 4 Outlaws and their affects are well known at this point. I am going to rank them from most annoying to least and see if anyone has any differing opinions. This is just my opinion and perhaps I am not playing as optimally as others.


1. Phineus Pillbottom - He is worse than any two of the other outlaws put together. I imagine that about half my gold is spent on supply cubes. Having to pay that premium is just too much. He is easily the most bribed character in the game. The only good thing about him is that it is usually easy to complete claims cards needing him. That is until Calamity Sam gets involved.

2. Flatfoot Flemming - At $6 to bribe her away, you really have to wonder if it is worth spending that gold somewhere else and just keeping her for 6 rounds. There is nothing worse than bribing her away and getting her back the next turn when your opponent uses a tycoon card. It stinks having to bribe her to your own town to fulfill claims cards.

3. Sydney Smythe - He is sometimes the late game hot potato. Prior to the end game, he is a welcomed edition to any saloon. He counts as a male character and there are quite a few open claims requiring him. At the end of the game he may get passed around or not depending on secret claims. If the game is about to end and you have a choice to get rid of him or score more points doing something else, sometimes it isn't too bad to eat the -5 points. The only reason I rank him higher than Angie is that I have seen people bribe him.

4. Moonshine Angie - Nobody should be ashamed to take home Moonshine Angie. Her negative affect may sound bad, but it is very easy to play around. Some tiles give you the ability to play tycoon cards and she doesn't affect those. Those mediocre tycoon cards (Look at 2 of your opponents cards and take 1) just become fodder for Angie. You always get 2 cards per action and you can only play 1 per action anyway. In all the games we have played, whoever gets her first has kept her for the entire game. I can't imagine that too many games are lost by her presence.
 
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Ryan Feathers
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Madison
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I'd agree that Pillbottom is the most annoying to have around. However as you only get him after you get 5 supply cubes, and there are 20 supply cubes per player, I usually assume he's going to cost about 15 gold throughout the course of the game, and that's only if he stays with me the entire time. Now it may be a bit more than that since I might build my cubes than my opponents, or get more at the end of the game when you add in the extra, but I don't find the extra money to be that debilitating. He's still the most annoying, but I haven't found myself bribing him all that often--especially since some Tycoon cards can provide supply cubes, or some buildings can also. Worst case I just start building out a bit more and then bribe him away and buy 8 or so cubes in one big turn when I no longer have him. Still, usually when I get him I've just tried to suck it up and power through it and it hasn't been all that bad.


I've found Moonshine Angie to be the second most annoying to deal with however, but I also may be using Tycoon cards too much or overvaluing them--I've yet to figure out quite how much I should be using them compared to some other strategies. Still, with her in your Saloon your action cycle is draw 2 Tycoon cards, then next turn you discard one, play the other. Normally you can draw 2 Tycoon cards, then spend the next two turns playing both. Now they aren't always great, but she often winds up costing me entire actions because of that cost. While some tiles allow you to play a few cards here and there, it isn't enough for me to negate her effect. I've spent a few games just bribing her away or moving her with a card as I don't want to deal with her. But then again as I said I tend to interact with the Tycoon deck pretty often in my games as I find many of the cards to be worth it.

As for the other two, I'd probably state Flatfoot Flemming to be more annoying/vexing than Sydney Smythe, but neither of them have I worried about having too much. Fleming represents not that much lost income and generally I find that spending actions/gold/cards on moving her is probably a worse choice than just dealing with the lost income. Smythe on the other hand is easy to deal with since he doesn't hurt until the very end of the game, and you have plenty of options before the end of the game to attempt to unload him onto someone else, particularly if you try to plan on triggering end game so you can unload him and then no one else can move him after that. If anything I almost prefer having him so I can complete claims and then I know to plan to try and unload him and end the game rather than letting my opponent do so to me. To me he is easily the least annoying.


Thanks for starting this though--I do find it interesting to hear what others have been experiencing thus far. I haven't gotten in as many games as I would like yet, but should get in more this weekend where I hope to further develop some strategies and learn more about what actions to take and what things work well together to earn big points.
 
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mike D
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I may not be using the tycoon cards as much as I should. You and I probably play a bit differently.

If you look at an overall game cost, it is possible that Flatfoot Flemming costs more than Pillbottom. I never counted the number of turns to see how many there were. She hits you once per turn whereas Pillbottom hits you big at once. Supplying a billiard room for $12 as opposed to $8 feels pretty painful at the time. I suppose if it does work out to only $15 per game he isn't that bad. Then again the supply blocks are very limited and your opponents can buy 3 for every 2 you can. I seem to remember having over 24 blocks and the player with Pillbottom having 16 or maybe 17. I also remember losing the games when I bribed him to go away.
 
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Ryan Feathers
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Madison
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Yeah, I think it's a tough question of how much Pillbottom actually winds up costing you. But I also agree that the price of 6 gold and a precious action to bribe him away is rough and likely can lead to losing.

I've also primarily played 2 player games thus far, so not sure how that might be effecting strategy and experience. I look forward to more plays though as there is more depth to this game than I was expecting.

 
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Randy D

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Dirk2112 wrote:
Flatfoot Flemming - At $6 to bribe her away, you really have to wonder if it is worth spending that gold somewhere else and just keeping her for 6 rounds.

Since you lose 1 gold every round you have her it would seem logical that paying 6 gold to get rid of her would only make sense if you have her for more than 6 rounds. However, you also have to remember that she will hurt whomever you give her to so that also helps you as well (moreso in a 2-player game).
 
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elac yenwod
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Dirk2112 wrote:

...
4. Moonshine Angie - ...Some tiles give you the ability to play tycoon cards and she doesn't affect those. ...


Is this stated in the rules somewhere? This came up in one of my games but i couldn't find any reference to it, Her description in the manual just says playing a tycoon card requires discarding an extra card, doesn't specify what triggers the card play, if it is as your tycoon action or a completion bonus.
 
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Randy D

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elacyenwod wrote:
Dirk2112 wrote:

...
4. Moonshine Angie - ...Some tiles give you the ability to play tycoon cards and she doesn't affect those. ...


Is this stated in the rules somewhere? This came up in one of my games but i couldn't find any reference to it, Her description in the manual just says playing a tycoon card requires discarding an extra card, doesn't specify what triggers the card play, if it is as your tycoon action or a completion bonus.


Pg 4 of the manual:
A player that has Moonshine Angie at their saloon must first discard a Tycoon card in order to play one. If you are unable to discard a Tycoon card (i.e., you only have one in your hand), you may not play one. This effect only applies when using an action to play a Tycoon card. If a card or tile allows you to play a Tycoon card you do not need to discard one first.
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